Protesters crash DHS Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen's dinner amid furor over family separations

[Ikari]

Yep, no one was hurt....this time.

Sent from my SM-T587P using Tapatalk

True, and so long as that remains true, and there isn't rioting and property damage, there is nothing wrong with it.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Yep.... poor leadership begets unrest amongst the people

Unrest does not equal refusal to act like civil human beings, being unhappy gives no right to act badly.

What this behavior represents is breakdown of the society.

This should catch your attention.

 

[upsideguy]

Unrest does not equal refusal to act like civil human beings, being unhappy gives no right to act badly.

What this behavior represents is breakdown of the society.

This should catch your attention.

Again, its a reflection of poor moral leadership. As with any organization, bad behavior begins at that top.

Please explain what is Presidential about any of this....

https://www.usmagazine.com/celebrit...most-offensive-and-outrageous-quotes-w167142/

 

[OlNate]

Oh for goodness sake, dude, once you get on a roll, you just can't get off, can you?

The simple fact is -- promoting burkas is akin to promoting misogyny. I've explained it in detail to you and I know you understand it. You just can't admit it.

Your attitude is not far removed from the mullahs in Iran who advocate for Iranian women to have the "right" to wear a burka. And if they don't agree with that "right" they can be beaten, raped, or worse.

But, go right ahead and keep promoting that "right." Fundamental Muslim men love you for it.

:roll:

lmao...I'm a mullah now? :lamo Oy vey, the drama, though.... haha

Here's the thing. I'm not "promoting burkas". I'm promoting the right of women to choose what they want. If a woman tells me she doesn't want to wear it, despite cultural pressure to do so, then I support her. And if a woman tells me she does want to wear it, despite cultural pressure not to do so, then I support her too. Why do you only support women who believe and act the same way you do, Howie?

The truth is, I've met a good number of Muslim women in Canada who choose to continue wearing their covering, whether it's a burka, a niqab, hijab, chador, khimar, al-amira, or shayla, who are under no pressure to do so. I even know a white Catholic lady who converted to Islam, and wears the niqab without even being raised with any pressure whatsoever to do so...quite the opposite, as you can imagine. And no, she didn't marry into it either. What gives me, or you, the right to tell them that they are wrong for doing so, that they are somehow oppressing themselves? The answer is nothing, it's absolutely none of our ****ing business until we are asked to help or provide an opinion.

And just because you explain something "in detail", it doesn't mean you're correct...lol... That's right, Howie, I've heard your explanation, I do understand what you're saying, you're always very clear and eloquent with your posts.......and I deem you incorrect...hehe... That's just how she goes from time to time in a debate forum...

While I've thoroughly enjoyed you trolling me today, I think it's time for you to give it up, or point to any post I've ever written outside of this conversation that anyone would think is misogynistic. Seriously, stop, it's silly, and we don't do silly, do we Howie? There's plenty of valid reasons to call me an asshole without resorting to desperate fiction. I'm pretty consistent.

 

[calamity]

I'm still trying to figure this one out. What did she do?

"Honey, I feel like some Mexican tonight."
"Really, Kirstjen?"
"Sure. What could possibly go wrong?"

 

[Mach]

And I recall how people cried about the “rude” behavior of the TEA party at town hall meetings. I also recall all the angst over “violent rhetoric”. Odd that that’s not a thing anymore.

So you support him calling these protestors violent animals.
And since you can’t defend that, you point the finger in a Whataboutism.

That’s more like cheeerleading. I’m fine with guy cheerleaders, just saying.

 

[j-mac]

Deal. Let me know when you take a job with the Trump administration and it game on.

I thought supporters were just as bad to you radicals...That's ok though, I always knew you were just a silly blowhard with no guts.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[X Factor]

So you support him calling these protestors violent animals.
And since you can’t defend that, you point the finger in a Whataboutism.

That’s more like cheeerleading. I’m fine with guy cheerleaders, just saying.

I don’t support that. Actual animals have value.

 

[Mach]

I don’t support that. Actual animals have value.

So you think they are worse than animals for protesting. Gonna take them out back and dispose of them now? Classy. MAGA!!

 

[danarhea]

I think it's just the matter of barging in on someone's dinner being considered more low class than anything else.

No it isn't. This is............

 

[What if...?]

DSA eh? hmmmm...Looks like the "animals" are pushing ever toward violent confrontation....

Over two hundred thousand years asshole behavior was met with negative consequences from other tribe members.

Its how the tribe held together

Now people are shielded by their status, their positions.

Why should public officials be allowed to Inflict suffering and lie to our faces about it without consequence?

Screw her.

I hope she never gets to eat out in peace again.

 

[What if...?]

Actually, that reminds me of progressives that protect the Muslim men who force their women to cover themselves.

Wrong mythos.

 

[What if...?]

I have not seen the President out making a scene at a restaurant because he has anger issues towards one of the customers....bringing strife and negativity onto a lot of peoples days.

Don't act like an asshole and nobody will call you on it.

 

[What if...?]

I see it.

Yeah.

And as with this whole debacle, she never even thought "What could go wrong? How could this possibly result in an ironically embarrassing evening?"

Where's that Nelson meme when I need it!

 

[What if...?]

And I recall how people cried about the “rude” behavior of the TEA party at town hall meetings. I also recall all the angst over “violent rhetoric”. Odd that that’s not a thing anymore.

Turning the other cheek only gets both sides of your face bruised.

Our founders were traitors. Don't forget.

Sometimes you gotta act up.

Or the assholes win.

 

[What if...?]

What type of physical retribution would you like to see to make their lives miserable?

No need for violence.

Constant public ridicule when they're out in public should suffice.

No peace. Ever.

 

[What if...?]

You've got the meme down cold, the problem with that sort of mindset, however, is that it encourages misogyny and abuse.

The burqa and nijab are not like a nun's habit. A nun chooses to follow a specific religious path, and makes a decision on her own to adopt the outfit to her lifestyle. Not so Muslim women.

Sharia law compels women to cover themselves, and in every nation that has Sharia, women are required to cover themselves.

Progressives will argue that the women choose to cover themselves, but this is a lie. You will find Muslim women who say they want to wear their coverings, but that's because they're afraid not to say that.

In the US a couple of decades ago, the law took the choice out of a woman's hands whether or not to charge her husband/boyfriend with abuse. Too many beaten women were refusing to press charges, claiming the beating they took was their own fault. It's called "battered woman's" syndrome, and it forces women to make claims contrary to what's in their best interest.

To understand how detrimental it is to support burqa's you first have to understand their purpose. Fundamental Muslims believe a woman's body is too tempting to be uncovered. They believe that men are not strong enough to resist raping the woman unless she's covered from head to toe. When Muslim women choose to wear the burqa it's out of a sense of self-preservation.

When you promote that *right,* you're really promoting a patriarchal culture that seeks to keep women subordinate.

Now, you'll probably argue, but if you want to know what Muslim women really want --- compare Iranian women's dress before and after the Iranian revolution. The first is what they chose to wear -- the second is what Muslim men forced them to wear.



View attachment 67234694

View attachment 67234695

Are you aware that the same phenomenon responsible for battered wives syndrome is at play in modern conservatism?

 

[cpwill]

Turning the other cheek only gets both sides of your face bruised.

Our founders were traitors. Don't forget.

Sometimes you gotta act up.

Or the assholes win.

Given the partisan breakdowns inside of the portions of our populace with wartime ground combat experience, those who hunt, and those who train with firearms in civilian lives....

..I"m not positive ya'll on the Left really want to argue that we should tear down all societal norms and do our damedest to harm those who disagree with us. People who have hunted people tend to make bad victims.

After all, if ya'll can do it, so can we. But we will be much, much better at it.

 

[What if...?]

Good, good, building on the troll I said was working, bravo. :lol:

However, your assertion that women cannot be fully committed to their religion, to the point where they would choose to wear the niqab without having it tied on by some club wielding man, is about as offensive as me saying that the only worthwhile women are those walking around with some big ol' titties and a heart shaped ass. Neither you, nor I, get to say what "women" want...or men, for that matter. All we can do is accept and support what they individually tell us, so long as it doesn't infringe upon anyone else's right to do the same. The second we tell them what they want, and take steps to make it so without their consent or buy in, we are engaging in oppression.

Gotta ask, Howie, how come you like oppressing women so much?

Orthodox Jewish women cover their hair with wigs and their arms and legs, coming from the same general mindset. They're really only different from Muslims in the degree to which they treat their women like second class citizens. All the ken dancing in the streets of Brooklyn while the women are required to stay indoors and watch.

Dead chickens are also somehow involved.

I doubt very seriously Howie includes them in his damnation.

 

[JasperL]

Given the partisan breakdowns inside of the portions of our populace with wartime ground combat experience, those who hunt, and those who train with firearms in civilian lives....

..I"m not positive ya'll on the Left really want to argue that we should tear down all societal norms and do our damedest to harm those who disagree with us. People who have hunted people tend to make bad victims.

After all, if ya'll can do it, so can we. But we will be much, much better at it.

First of all, who has advocated for violence here? Since when is peaceful protest un-American? What do you have against people exercising the rights you served to supposedly protect and defend? If we can't protest, then we're no better than hellhole tinpot dictatorships. Why do you only believe in the principles of the First Amendment when you agree with the message and the way it's delivered, and politely I presume is a necessity, so as not to inconvenience or make uncomfortable anyone in power?

Also, too, if having to listen to a few crazies protest you in a restaurant when you're wielding power at the highest levels of government makes one a "victim," boo hoo. Get over it snowflake. :boohoo:

Also, too, we're all werry skeered.

 

[cpwill]

First of all, who has advocated for violence here?

If you want to start destroying basic norms of human decency in order to make folks lives as much of a hell as you can for the sin of thinking differently than you :shrug: expect to get some of that back.

Since when is peaceful protest un-American?

That's not a protest, and:

What do you have against people exercising the rights you served to supposedly protect and defend?

You don't have the right to crash private property. Go have a march. Distribute leaflets. Have rallies.

But be civilized. Because (see: 2016, election of) there is an extent past which those on the right will no longer be willing to play along with a double standard that disadvantages them.

 

[What if...?]

Given the partisan breakdowns inside of the portions of our populace with wartime ground combat experience, those who hunt, and those who train with firearms in civilian lives....

..I"m not positive ya'll on the Left really want to argue that we should tear down all societal norms and do our damedest to harm those who disagree with us. People who have hunted people tend to make bad victims.

After all, if ya'll can do it, so can we. But we will be much, much better at it.

Funny that.

I'm not going to disavow you of that notion.

It might spoil the surprise!

I personally prefer destroying peoples images in the eyes of their peers.

That way, they have to live with it.

Properly done, you can get them to pull.their own covers.

Alternately, you simply find out what they don't want other people to know, and make sure everybody knows.

There's lots of way to punish people without guns and cages.

Worked great for us for almost a quarter of a million years.

 

[Irwin Corey]

Protesters crash DHS Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen's dinner amid furor over family separations

Good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[JasperL]

If you want to start destroying basic norms of human decency in order to make folks lives as much of a hell as you can for the sin of thinking differently than you :shrug: expect to get some of that back.

Give me a break. Protest is as old as the Republic, which you would know because I think you've studied history. This breaks no norms of "human decency" - it's protest. This being allowed is what makes us a free country.

And the protest isn't about some abstract difference of opinion, but of a policy that some find obscene, actually. I don't care if you agree, but if you don't support PEACEFUL protests against those in power wielding it in ways you believe are affronts to human decency and who we are as Americans, you're not really supportive of freedom, except when you AGREE with the message. How can you get this so wrong? Obviously, Sec. Nielsen has every right to protest the protesters, defend herself, which she can do any day by commanding a microphone reaching millions on every network, all the editorial pages, etc. Goodness, when did supposed conservatives adopt the attitude of helpless subjects? It's pathetic, or sad.

That's not a protest, and:

Of cours it is. What else could it be but a protest when the people in the restaurant were clearly and unambiguously protesting a very specific policy?

You don't have the right to crash private property. Go have a march. Distribute leaflets. Have rallies.

You mean do stuff that is easily ignored and dismissed. Got it! Good idea.

OR, maybe, confront people wielding great power when they venture out among the proles and subjects of their rule! The restaurant can press charges of trespassing if they want, but the official herself has no standing to object. It's part of wearing the big person pants - to have to listen to DISSENT when you're an advocate for policies with widespread condemnation.

But be civilized. Because (see: 2016, election of) there is an extent past which those on the right will no longer be willing to play along with a double standard that disadvantages them.

What double standard? Who said right wingers can't peacefully protest? They seem to have done fine at it at multiple public hearings during the Tea Party era.

By the way, the veiled threats of violence against leftists for exercising rights you should be defending on here, if you believed in them, is just more evidence of how the right wing has become the home for authoritarians. It's been that way for a long time, but the Trump era makes it impossible to ignore or dismiss.

BTW, you ignored this comment so I'll repeat it for you:

"Also, too, if having to listen to a few crazies protest you in a restaurant when you're wielding power at the highest levels of government makes one a "victim," boo hoo. Get over it snowflake."

 

[ClaraD]

Personally, I think this was well deserved. Her comments have come back to haunt her.