No unborn human needs or wants legal rights

[Patriotic Voter]

I don't. I didn't impregnate her.

Sometimes people try to avoid getting pregnant and somehow conceive new human lives anyway. You know that, rigjht? Accidents happen. Even if both sex partners were using contraception exactly as instructed, it can fail. Some girls and women are raped. So you can't expect everyone to be successful. Of course, there also will always be people who forget to use contraception before having sex.

So a girl or woman accidentally gets pregnant. Why do you want her to suffer all the consequences of that? She is not your enemy because you never knew her. You have no idea how she got pregnant or why she did not want to have a kid or can't take care of one and decided abortion is the best solution. Without knowing any of that, you have no reason or right to judge her for choosing to have an abortion.

So why do you want pregnant girls and women to suffer?

 

[Dayton3]

Sometimes people try to avoid getting pregnant and somehow conceive new human lives anyway. You know that, rigjht? Accidents happen. Even if both sex partners were using contraception exactly as instructed, it can fail. Some girls and women are raped. So you can't expect everyone to be successful. Of course, there also will always be people who forget to use contraception before having sex.

So a girl or woman accidentally gets pregnant. Why do you want her to suffer all the consequences of that? She is not your enemy because you never knew her. You have no idea how she got pregnant or why she did not want to have a kid or can't take care of one and decided abortion is the best solution. Without knowing any of that, you have no reason or right to judge her for choosing to have an abortion.

So why do you want pregnant girls and women to suffer?

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be "suffering".

 

[Patriotic Voter]

A pro-choicer is distinguished from a pro-abortionist by how he regards passive attempts to influence a pregnant mother's choice, and by how he characterizes the act of abortion.

A pro-choicer has no opposition to waiting periods, doctors showing mothers sonograms of their fetuses, or groups like Save the Storks who provide free ultrasounds to mothers to show them the developing foetus (which significantly decreases their likelihood to abort). A pro-choicer tolerates websites and literature that calls abortion immoral and unnecessary. Most importantly, a pro-choicer doesn't take a position that abortion is beneficial (or even necessary) for society.

By contrast, a pro-abortionist resists any attempt to sway the choice of mothers in favour of carrying pregnancies to term, including (but not limited to) waiting periods, doctors showing sonograms to mothers, doctors informing parents, prayer vigils in front of abortion clinics, and groups like Save the Storks. A pro-abortionist abhors the characterization of abortion as immoral/unnecessary, and supports banning websites and literature that promote this view. Finally, a pro-abortionist actively defends/promotes abortion as beneficial (or necessary) to society, and invests time and effort extolling the "benefits" of aborting and the costs of carrying to term.

Which of the two descriptions above would you say best characterizes you?

Pro-choice. I am a huge fan of mandatory sex education starting in fifth grade (but voluntary at religious schools, of course) as a federal law because leaving such decisions up to the states an districts obviously is not working. It also needs to be expanded to include when fetuses can feel pain and reach viability in high school health. All contraception needs to be easier to get. I would suppor these additions:

A maternal/child health care plan that covers all gynecology, obstetrics, counseling, neonatal care, and childcare with no copays for one year incxluding free contraception.
Police departments having free Plan B on hand to give the sexual assault or rape victim during their investigation, assuming they can get there in time for the pill to work.
Only require a police report to prove she was sexually assaulted to let the victim get an abortion, but make the dad pay for all pregnancy-related fees after a paternity test.
Permit abortions only during the first trimester or when the woman learns she is pregnant, whichever comes later, unless it is medically necessary by the doctor's judgment.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be suffering.

You have a lot to learn. There is also mental (psychological) suffering that impacts the mom just as badly as physical pain, such as post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

 

[Dayton3]

You have a lot to learn. There is also mental (psychological) suffering that impacts the mom just as badly as physical pain, such as post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

I don't recognized the concept of "mental suffering" because it is not effectively the same for everyone.

 

[weaver2]

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be "suffering".

I'm guessing anti-abortion males have to strenuously suppress empathy and self-awareness or they wouldn't be able to deny women the right to make private reproductive decisions. Never, ever have I heard a women say, " I don't consider prostate cancer to be a cause for any suffering on the part of men.

 

[weaver2]

A pro-choicer is distinguished from a pro-abortionist by how he regards passive attempts to influence a pregnant mother's choice, and by how he characterizes the act of abortion.

. Pro-choice is defined by how he reacts to pregnancy? :lamo I'm guessing you don't understand how hysterically funny that is.

A pro-choicer has no opposition to waiting periods, doctors showing mothers sonograms of their fetuses, or groups like Save the Storks who provide free ultrasounds to mothers to show them the developing foetus (which significantly decreases their likelihood to abort). A pro-choicer tolerates websites and literature that calls abortion immoral and unnecessary. Most importantly, a pro-choicer doesn't take a position that abortion is beneficial (or even necessary) for society

. Given that you describe pro-choice as a male position, of course you have no objection to the delaying tactics and despicable propaganda aimed at denying women the right to make personal decisions about their private lives.

By contrast, a pro-abortionist resists any attempt to sway the choice of mothers in favour of carrying pregnancies to term, including (but not limited to) waiting periods, doctors showing sonograms to mothers, doctors informing parents, prayer vigils in front of abortion clinics, and groups like Save the Storks. A pro-abortionist abhors the characterization of abortion as immoral/unnecessary, and supports banning websites and literature that promote this view. Finally, a pro-abortionist actively defends/promotes abortion as beneficial (or necessary) to society, and invests time and effort extolling the "benefits" of aborting and the costs of carrying to term.

LOL. Oh dear, all those evil hussies who won't listen to males and who think they are entitled to the same decision making rights as men. Just look at how they stick their fingers in their ears and ignore men's superior advice on managing their sex and reproductive lives.

Which of the two descriptions above would you say best characterizes you?

. Neither, I'm not a paternalistic, authoritarian, punishing anti-abortion male.

 

[Integrityrespec]

When pro-lifers say all "unborn babies" (which are really zygotes, blastocysts, embryos, and fetuses) have the right to life, they completely ignore all of the proven biological facts about in-utero human development. Their mistakes not only include using the wrong temrinology to describe what these human lives and abortion are, but also why only born people need or should have any legal rights. I assume nobody on DP is an expert on obstetrics or human embryololgy. I hope this will help pro-lifers to learn all about that aspect of abortion vs. motherhood instead of just the fact that all pregnant girls and women need the legal right to choose that is already given to them.

When society decides it's a better thing to kill unborn children than to take on the responsibility of giving birth and raising those children we are in a bad state of affairs. If we are going to operate on that level of compassion then the next person that falls out of a heart attack, stroke or Covid 19, then just let them die. No use in trying to revive them, they are dead and now have no rights and I guess don't want any. As far as capital punishment, when a person kills another they deserve to die. Killing another person is a sign you have no regard for life and that should include your own, you should die.
Having life in your hands is a great responsibility and ignoring that is a sad reflection on mankind. There are ways to prevent pregnancy and any responsible person can prevent pregnancy with a little forethought. If you think it's ok to kill it because you slipped up then the next person that robs a liquor store or stages a home invasion and in the course of that act kills someone, then they need to die for that little slip up. There's always consequences to your actions and responsibility that goes with it.

 

[weaver2]

When society decides it's a better thing to kill unborn children than to take on the responsibility of giving birth and raising those children we are in a bad state of affairs. If we are going to operate on that level of compassion then the next person that falls out of a heart attack, stroke or Covid 19, then just let them die. No use in trying to revive them, they are dead and now have no rights and I guess don't want any. As far as capital punishment, when a person kills another they deserve to die. Killing another person is a sign you have no regard for life and that should include your own, you should die.
Having life in your hands is a great responsibility and ignoring that is a sad reflection on mankind. There are ways to prevent pregnancy and any responsible person can prevent pregnancy with a little forethought. If you think it's ok to kill it because you slipped up then the next person that robs a liquor store or stages a home invasion and in the course of that act kills someone, then they need to die for that little slip up. There's always consequences to your actions and responsibility that goes with it.

Abortion is almost always the right choice if the pregnancy is unplanned, unwanted and the family cannot support a child or another child. Aborting is a sign that a woman has taken the life of the potential child into consideration and knows it will suffer if born into a world that can't provide the love and support every child need to grow into a caring adult.

There are ways to prevent pregnancy. They are not 100% effective. 50% of all unwanted pregnancies happen even though one or both partners were using contraceptives. Unless you are willing to care for or pay for 500,000 unwanted and unplanned for children I suggest you temper your arrogant and asinine attitude about responsibility with a bit of reality. One little bit of reality is that anti-abortion women get abortions at exactly the same rate as pro-choice women. Tend to the hypocrisy in your own women before you start condemning others.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

I don't recognized the concept of "mental suffering" because it is not effectively the same for everyone.

Of course it is different for everyone. So is the physical suffering pregnant people have. Very often, the two go together - one causing the other in a variety of ways.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

When society decides it's a better thing to kill unborn children than to take on the responsibility of giving birth and raising those children we are in a bad state of affairs. If we are going to operate on that level of compassion then the next person that falls out of a heart attack, stroke or Covid 19, then just let them die. No use in trying to revive them, they are dead and now have no rights and I guess don't want any. As far as capital punishment, when a person kills another they deserve to die. Killing another person is a sign you have no regard for life and that should include your own, you should die.

Having life in your hands is a great responsibility and ignoring that is a sad reflection on mankind. There are ways to prevent pregnancy and any responsible person can prevent pregnancy with a little forethought. If you think it's ok to kill it because you slipped up then the next person that robs a liquor store or stages a home invasion and in the course of that act kills someone, then they need to die for that little slip up. There's always consequences to your actions and responsibility that goes with it.

Why don't you think before you post?

 

[roguenuke]

What 'magic' occurs the day before the birth of the child and the day AFTER the birth of the child that suddenly bestows them in your eyes legal rights?

The law, which is the source of rights to begin with. The law defines human beings, persons as those who are born.

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[roguenuke]

So to you LITERALLY the unborn child prior to birth is worthless...nothing but a gathering of cells...but after the moment of birth they become 'human' and worthy of legal rights and protection?

Thats REALLY your position?

Is your house worthless simply because it has no rights? What about your fish or dog or cat?

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[roguenuke]

Pregnant girls and women by and large to not "need" to get rid of them. At least not via abortion. If they truly do not want the "fetus" then they can put it up for adoption once born.

Standard adoption procedure by the way is for the adoptive parents to pay the medical bills for the prenatal care and delivery of the baby.

Being pregnant can cause hardship. Can increase chance of death or medical problems. Costs money and time in itself.

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[roguenuke]

That's her problem.

And a solution for it is an abortion. No more problem.

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[roguenuke]

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be "suffering".

Then you've never been pregnant.

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[roguenuke]

I don't recognized the concept of "mental suffering" because it is not effectively the same for everyone.

Physical suffering isnt the same for everyone. People are different.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

 

[Bodi]

When pro-lifers say all "unborn babies" (which are really zygotes, blastocysts, embryos, and fetuses) have the right to life, they completely ignore all of the proven biological facts about in-utero human development. Their mistakes not only include using the wrong temrinology to describe what these human lives and abortion are, but also why only born people need or should have any legal rights. I assume nobody on DP is an expert on obstetrics or human embryololgy. I hope this will help pro-lifers to learn all about that aspect of abortion vs. motherhood instead of just the fact that all pregnant girls and women need the legal right to choose that is already given to them.

You want to help pro-lifers? That is sweet... but when you say "their mistake" you should really realize that they are flat out lying.

 

[Bodi]

Wrong.

:lol: What a stupid post...

 

[Bodi]

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be "suffering".

Spoken like a man... :roll:

 

[Bodi]

Absent any unexpected or unpredictable physical dangers, I don't consider carrying a pregnancy to term to be "suffering".

Then you've never been pregnant.

Woman! A man is speaking!!

 

[Bodi]

So to you LITERALLY the unborn child prior to birth is worthless...nothing but a gathering of cells...but after the moment of birth they become 'human' and worthy of legal rights and protection?

Thats REALLY your position?

I have heard very few other than a few extremists who state anything like that. Most pro-choicers think that the unborn is extremely important... just not as important as the mother's right to live her own life the way that she sees fit.

 

[DarkWizard12]

When pro-lifers say all "unborn babies" (which are really zygotes, blastocysts, embryos, and fetuses) have the right to life, they completely ignore all of the proven biological facts about in-utero human development. Their mistakes not only include using the wrong temrinology to describe what these human lives and abortion are, but also why only born people need or should have any legal rights. I assume nobody on DP is an expert on obstetrics or human embryololgy. I hope this will help pro-lifers to learn all about that aspect of abortion vs. motherhood instead of just the fact that all pregnant girls and women need the legal right to choose that is already given to them.

anyone else see the irony that the person saying this was, in fact, a fetus?

 

[COTO]

Pro-choice. I am a huge fan of mandatory sex education starting in fifth grade (but voluntary at religious schools, of course) as a federal law because leaving such decisions up to the states an districts obviously is not working. It also needs to be expanded to include when fetuses can feel pain and reach viability in high school health. All contraception needs to be easier to get. I would suppor these additions:

A maternal/child health care plan that covers all gynecology, obstetrics, counseling, neonatal care, and childcare with no copays for one year incxluding free contraception.
Police departments having free Plan B on hand to give the sexual assault or rape victim during their investigation, assuming they can get there in time for the pill to work.
Only require a police report to prove she was sexually assaulted to let the victim get an abortion, but make the dad pay for all pregnancy-related fees after a paternity test.
Permit abortions only during the first trimester or when the woman learns she is pregnant, whichever comes later, unless it is medically necessary by the doctor's judgment.

You appear to be less extreme than most on the permissibility of abortions. The key questions stand, however: Do you oppose passive measures to persuade pregnant mothers not to abort? Do you habitually argue for the utility, necessity, etc. of abortion? Do you habitually extol the costs and penalties of carrying to term?

These are the specific behaviours that mark pro-abortionists.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

You appear to be less extreme than most on the permissibility of abortions. The key questions stand, however: Do you oppose passive measures to persuade pregnant mothers not to abort? Do you habitually argue for the utility, necessity, etc. of abortion? Do you habitually extol the costs and penalties of carrying to term?

These are the specific behaviours that mark pro-abortionists.

I oppose forcing women to be passive during their pregnancies. If she carries a fetus to term, that's great, but it must be her choice. I do not believe in telling women they should abort their pregnancies just because of what could happen to their babies either. If the woman knows she does not want a baby, I would tell her to schedule an appointment with a female counselor instead of listen to people like us.