Nancy Pelosi is winning in her battle with Trump. Here's why

[bullseyelqcs]

Pelosi is a dementia addled moron with a "deer in the headlights" expression on her face all the time. In one or two televised speeches, months ago, she could not even remember who the president was. In one speech, she thought it was Bush. About the only reason the democrats still keep her around is that she is like an ATM machine. She is able to raise alot of cash for the party. Otherwise, she is the queen of inept.

May want to watch out saying things like that...its gonna hurt a little more when The King is beaten badly by someone so inept.

 

[jnug]

If the Republican controller House and Senate (over the last two years) would have just done their job then Pelosi wouldn't have to make Trump look so inept.

That assumes they wanted Trump's Wall in the first place. They didn't. Isn't it obvious? Its even hard to see how Trump actually wanted it as he never helped Ryan get the one Bill that had a shot, the July 2018 Bill through the House. That is the one Bill that could have gone through the standard Appropriations process. But the Administration never sent any help to Ryan to get it through. What was Ryan supposed to tell the Bill's Floor Manager, get it through on your good looks? Ryan eventually pulled the Bill out of the voting schedule because he had nothing to work with and didn't have the votes. I don't even think Trump understood the civics lesson he was getting in that exercise in futility.

 

[Stealers Wheel]

Nancy Pelosi is winning in her battle with Trump. Here's why

If that is the case, then why are the libruls whining incessantly about McConnell refusing to allow floor votes on Nancy's bills to end the shutdown?

Simply stating facts is not whining. The House has sent multiple bills to the Senate without funding for the wall. Any of these bills would pass the Senate overwhelmingly, by veto-proof margins. That is why it is critical that McConnell not allow them a vote on the floor.

At least Trump is putting offers on the table, which is how bipartisan politics is supposed to work. Pelosi is just rejecting anything and everything out of hand if it includes funding for the border wall. Trump is willing to negotiate and compromise while Nancy is attempting to force one party rule.

Trump has not budged on the $5.7 billion on the wall. He has essentially said "Give me 100% of what I want, and I will give you the government back. And a few temporary trinkets that I don't give a shxt about." That is what you call 'negotiating.' The president's chief of staff Mulvaney actually suggested that Trump might move off that number and Trump had a fit right there in the room in front of the Democrats. You can bet Mulvaney won't make that mistake again. It's embarrassing getting bitch slapped in front of guests.

That is utter nonsense. 800,000 federal employees are missing paychecks because the democrats want to play politics on an issue they helped pass in 2006. Schumer, Hillary, and even Obama voted in favor of the Secure Fence Act. The democrats are now looking quite stupid keeping the government shut down over the same issue, simply because they hate Trump.

The House, elected by their constituents, are fully within their constitutional mandate to withhold funding for whatever reason. Don't like that? Change the Constitution. Otherwise, get over it. In less than 2 years, we can replace the entire House if that is what we want.

 

[Perotista]

Nancy Pelosi is winning in her battle with Trump. Here's why

If Trump wants to die on the government shutdown hill, Pelosi will certainly let him. It's just now dawning on Trump that he no longer controls Congress.

The Trump/Kushner/Mulvaney offer yesterday was a [bumbling] nonstarter. All Trump offered is restoring the Dreamer protections he himself removed.

That's not going to cut it, nor will it extricate Trump from the deepening political pit he's been digging for himself.

You are probably right about this not being a fair battle. But I think the longer this draws out, the more ire will be thrown at both sides regardless of who is right or who is wrong. If there is such a thing as one side being right and the other wrong in a purely 100 partisan political battle. A battle that is personal.

41% of all Americans attach a lot of blame to Democrats in congress for the shutdown, 21% attach a little blame to the Democrats. A total of 62% of all Americans attach at least some blame to the congressional democrats. Question 43A.

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/1xbksrgzje/econTabReport.pdf

Question 43C, 57% of all Americans attach a lot of blame for the shutdown on President Trump. A lot higher than the 41% attached to the congressional Democrats. But only 15% attach a little blame to Trump. A total of 72% of all Americans give Trump at least some blame. Again, Pelosi and the democrats come out on top in the blame game, 62-72. But this means a whole lot of Americans are placing blame on both. I suspect that will only increase as time drags by.

What is interesting about above is 26% of all Americans state the democrats in congress have no blame at all vs. 20% for Trump. I suppose this means no one is getting a free pass as much as each side tries to portray that.

One question left is how much harm is both sides willing to do to America to make the other side cave? Then perhaps another, which one would be hurt more with their base of support if one or the other does cave or even works out a compromise.

Far as I'm concerned, this whole shutdown is asinine. Over 5 billion dollars for a stupid wall which comes out to be 0.0125% of a singer percentage point of the 4 trillion the government will spend this year. Get real or perhaps Washington D.C. is nothing more than a fantasy land for the ultra partisans where the R and or the D means a thousand times more than being an American.

 

[JayJay]

What’s really happening here is a battle to re-establish Congress as a viable co-equal branch of government.

No fan of Pelosi, but at least she realizes that.

McConnell is putting partisanship above Congress being relevant.

Hopefully it finally sinks onto his thick skull that this is what he’s doing, and he wakes up before it’s too late.

 

[calamity]

Nancy Pelosi is winning in her battle with Trump. Here's why

If Trump wants to die on the government shutdown hill, Pelosi will certainly let him. It's just now dawning on Trump that he no longer controls Congress.

The Trump/Kushner/Mulvaney offer yesterday was a [bumbling] nonstarter. All Trump offered is restoring the Dreamer protections he himself removed.

That's not going to cut it, nor will it extricate Trump from the deepening political pit he's been digging for himself.

Simple fact: Pelosi knows Trump people: defense contractors, farmers, trailer trash, etc; are more dependent on government funds than her people. So, she'll gladly let Trump starve his own people out.

 

[jnug]

You are probably right about this not being a fair battle. But I think the longer this draws out, the more ire will be thrown at both sides regardless of who is right or who is wrong. If there is such a thing as one side being right and the other wrong in a purely 100 partisan political battle. A battle that is personal.

41% of all Americans attach a lot of blame to Democrats in congress for the shutdown, 21% attach a little blame to the Democrats. A total of 62% of all Americans attach at least some blame to the congressional democrats. Question 43A.

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/1xbksrgzje/econTabReport.pdf

Question 43C, 57% of all Americans attach a lot of blame for the shutdown on President Trump. A lot higher than the 41% attached to the congressional Democrats. But only 15% attach a little blame to Trump. A total of 72% of all Americans give Trump at least some blame. Again, Pelosi and the democrats come out on top in the blame game, 62-72. But this means a whole lot of Americans are placing blame on both. I suspect that will only increase as time drags by.

What is interesting about above is 26% of all Americans state the democrats in congress have no blame at all vs. 20% for Trump. I suppose this means no one is getting a free pass as much as each side tries to portray that.

One question left is how much harm is both sides willing to do to America to make the other side cave? Then perhaps another, which one would be hurt more with their base of support if one or the other does cave or even works out a compromise.

Far as I'm concerned, this whole shutdown is asinine. Over 5 billion dollars for a stupid wall which comes out to be 0.0125% of a singer percentage point of the 4 trillion the government will spend this year. Get real or perhaps Washington D.C. is nothing more than a fantasy land for the ultra partisans where the R and or the D means a thousand times more than being an American.

Except that regardless of the numbers, the country can focus all of its ire on two men vs 230 dem congressmen and 47 dem senators. Two men control the entire shutdown at the moment. Trump and McConnell are the whole story.

When a football team is failing, does the owner go after the whole 53 man team or does he go after the head coach? Regardless of how much the blame gets pushed up for both sides, with only two people to focus on those are the two that are eventually going to be made to feel the most pressure. Plus the argument is simply too easy to make that you simply make a mockery of Article 1 to allow Trump to subvert the Constitution at the point of a knife to get Wall funding. Unfortunately, there will be more suffering before this ends. McConnell probably comes that conclusion before Trump does though I think Trump is being flimflammed.

This whole argument that Trump's base will desert him if he does not get them the Wall is based on the notion that there is someplace for the base to put pour their gruesomeness into other than Trump. They are not going to desert him into a vacuum. I have asked this question several times at DP with no answer back. Who may I ask would they desert Donald for? Not Bannon, not David Duke, not Queen Ann Coulter and I don't think Vlad could run even if he applied for US citizenship. So somebody tell me who the base would go to if they abandoned Donald. I would think Newt Gingrich if he didn't already 75 and had so much DC baggage.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Pelosi is a dementia addled moron with a "deer in the headlights" expression on her face all the time. In one or two televised speeches, months ago, she could not even remember who the president was. In one speech, she thought it was Bush. About the only reason the democrats still keep her around is that she is like an ATM machine. She is able to raise alot of cash for the party. Otherwise, she is the queen of inept.

and yet she's making Donald Trump look like a middle schooler.

 

[Carleen]

This thread is about Pelosi... not Trump. Focus.

If the shoe fits........

 

[MAGAnificent]

May want to watch out saying things like that...its gonna hurt a little more when The King is beaten badly by someone so inept.

I stand by what I said. If not for her handlers....Nancy would just sit there and mumble incoherently.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Except that regardless of the numbers, the country can focus all of its ire on two men vs 230 dem congressmen and 47 dem senators. Two men control the entire shutdown at the moment. Trump and McConnell are the whole story.

When a football team is failing, does the owner go after the whole 53 man team or does he go after the head coach? Regardless of how much the blame gets pushed up for both sides, with only two people to focus on those are the two that are eventually going to be made to feel the most pressure. Plus the argument is simply too easy to make that you simply make a mockery of Article 1 to allow Trump to subvert the Constitution at the point of a knife to get Wall funding. Unfortunately, there will be more suffering before this ends. McConnell probably comes that conclusion before Trump does though I think Trump is being flimflammed.

This whole argument that Trump's base will desert him if he does not get them the Wall is based on the notion that there is someplace for the base to put pour their gruesomeness into other than Trump. They are not going to desert him into a vacuum. I have asked this question several times at DP with no answer back. Who may I ask would they desert Donald for? Not Bannon, not David Duke, not Queen Ann Coulter and I don't think Vlad could run even if he applied for US citizenship. So somebody tell me who the base would go to if they abandoned Donald. I would think Newt Gingrich if he didn't already 75 and had so much DC baggage.

Who would they go to? The GOP would split. If McConnell allows a vote on these House bills. And they pass in the Senate. There's a chance the Republican party would split in 2020.

 

[MAGAnificent]

and yet she's making Donald Trump look like a middle schooler.

In the eyes of partisan libruls like yourself, maybe, however it is Nancy who is looking stupid fighting Trump over the same issue that Schumer, Hillary, and even Obama helped pass in 2006.

 

[jnug]

Who would they go to? The GOP would split. If McConnell allows a vote on these House bills. And they pass in the Senate. There's a chance the Republican party would split in 2020.

Its already splitting. Hence the departure via retirement of the Flakes and the Corkers and the death of McCain. Then there is the GOP congressmen, mainly moderates driven under in the 2018 elections. I don't know who the base goes to if they abandon Trump. There is only one Donald Trump with all his faults and foibles. Like him or not, there is only one. Whether the GOP splits is not the issue. The issue is how does the base replace Trump if they abandon him. I don't see that guy or gal anywhere and they won't abandon Trump into a vacuum. They live off of manifesting their ire through Donald. They won't be able to sustain themselves into a vacuum.

 

[jnug]

In the eyes of partisan libruls like yourself, maybe, however it is Nancy who is looking stupid fighting Trump over the same issue that Schumer, Hillary, and even Obama helped pass in 2006.

Oh great....lets go back 13 years for a frame of reference. That makes sense.

 

[What if...?]

Its already splitting. Hence the departure via retirement of the Flakes and the Corkers and the death of McCain. Then there is the GOP congressmen, mainly moderates driven under in the 2018 elections. I don't know who the base goes to if they abandon Trump. There is only one Donald Trump with all his faults and foibles. Like him or not, there is only one. Whether the GOP splits is not the issue. The issue is how does the base replace Trump if they abandon him. I don't see that guy or gal anywhere and they won't abandon Trump into a vacuum. They live off of manifesting their ire through Donald. They won't be able to sustain themselves into a vacuum.

Yup. Dopamine is a helluva drug!

 

[<alt>doxygen]

Its already splitting. Hence the departure via retirement of the Flakes and the Corkers and the death of McCain. Then there is the GOP congressmen, mainly moderates driven under in the 2018 elections. I don't know who the base goes to if they abandon Trump. There is only one Donald Trump with all his faults and foibles. Like him or not, there is only one. Whether the GOP splits is not the issue. The issue is how does the base replace Trump if they abandon him. I don't see that guy or gal anywhere and they won't abandon Trump into a vacuum. They live off of manifesting their ire through Donald. They won't be able to sustain themselves into a vacuum.

The cult seems wedded to Trump. I don't see them abandoning him, ever. He really could shoot one of them and the others would shrug it off.

 

[<alt>doxygen]

What’s really happening here is a battle to re-establish Congress as a viable co-equal branch of government.

No fan of Pelosi, but at least she realizes that.

McConnell is putting partisanship above Congress being relevant.

Hopefully it finally sinks onto his thick skull that this is what he’s doing, and he wakes up before it’s too late.

McConnell doesn't cover for Trump here and he gets primaried by a Trumper when he tries to run in 2020. McConnell has to choose between keeping his job and doing what's right for the country. If I were him and there was a bill to stop this that had 60 votes, I'd bring it to the floor. McConnell is old, and he's rich. What is he screwing the country in the name of Trump for???

 

[MAGAnificent]

Simply stating facts is not whining. The House has sent multiple bills to the Senate without funding for the wall. Any of these bills would pass the Senate overwhelmingly, by veto-proof margins.

You are flat making the last part of that up in your own mind. Where do you get the veto proof margin nonsense from? I doubt they would even pass in the senate. Have you personally polled the republicans? At this point, chances are nearly 100% that they would support Trump on this one. Nancy can pass a million bills in the House and they will not become law unless they include funding for the border wall.

That is why it is critical that McConnell not allow them a vote on the floor.

McConnell is wise. With a partial government shutdown going on, he is not going to waste time bringing bills to a floor vote that he knows will not only fail to pass in the Senate when Trump will not sign them into law. Your claim of a veto proof margin is pure fantasy.

Trump has not budged on the $5.7 billion on the wall. He has essentially said "Give me 100% of what I want, and I will give you the government back.

Bald faced lie. Trump has been budging all over the place on the wall since taking office. He started out wanting 25 billion.....and at one point was willing to accept as low as 1.6 billion. Do you think 1.6 billion or 5.6 billion is 100% of 25 million? Sounds like fuzzy math.

And a few temporary trinkets that I don't give a shxt about." That is what you call 'negotiating.'

It's absolutely what I and anyone with common sense calls negotiating. He is at least offering something. Nancy is offering absolutely nothing. And giving Dreamers that protection for three years is significant. In the least it's a good starting point. If he gets wall funding, he would almost certainly go further with that offer. Trump is negotiating in good faith, while Nancy Dementia is just sitting their saying "Open the government and get nothing!"

The president's chief of staff Mulvaney actually suggested that Trump might move off that number and Trump had a fit right there in the room in front of the Democrats. You can bet Mulvaney won't make that mistake again. It's embarrassing getting bitch slapped in front of guests.

Sorry. I am not impressed. The chief of staff works for the president....not the other way around

The House, elected by their constituents, are fully within their constitutional mandate to withhold funding for whatever reason.

And Trump is not constitutionally mandated to accept whatever the House of Representatives or for that matter the Senate proposes. See how that works? And you libruls were fine with that when Obama prevented bills from going into law that Republicans had the numbers for in both houses of congress. That is the only reason that monstrosity known as Obamacare survived Obama's first term. At that time, the republicans had the numbers and the will to repeal Obamacare.

Don't like that? Change the Constitution. Otherwise, get over it. In less than 2 years, we can replace the entire House if that is what we want.

I am fine with the US Constitution. Unlike you, I understand it past the partisan politics you like to inject.

 

[gdgyva]

Who would they go to? The GOP would split. If McConnell allows a vote on these House bills. And they pass in the Senate. There's a chance the Republican party would split in 2020.

It implodes

Which is why democrats are grinning like a 12 year old seeing his first porno

But that is why Mitch won’t budge and neither can the president

A line has been drawn in the sand....they have said what they want...all that is left is what do they need to give up for it

Otherwise, this shutdown will be indefinite....and will last till the next elections

And the public as a whole is gonna love both sides for killing the economy over 5.7b and a damn wall

The polls are already going against both....it will get much much worse

 

[gdgyva]

McConnell doesn't cover for Trump here and he gets primaried by a Trumper when he tries to run in 2020. McConnell has to choose between keeping his job and doing what's right for the country. If I were him and there was a bill to stop this that had 60 votes, I'd bring it to the floor. McConnell is old, and he's rich. What is he screwing the country in the name of Trump for???

Lol

Yeah right....

Kentucky is and will be solid red....

And unless McConnell wants to quit the seat is his....unless he goes against Trump

Kinda like Reid used to do with Obama...right?

 

[Perotista]

Except that regardless of the numbers, the country can focus all of its ire on two men vs 230 dem congressmen and 47 dem senators. Two men control the entire shutdown at the moment. Trump and McConnell are the whole story.

When a football team is failing, does the owner go after the whole 53 man team or does he go after the head coach? Regardless of how much the blame gets pushed up for both sides, with only two people to focus on those are the two that are eventually going to be made to feel the most pressure. Plus the argument is simply too easy to make that you simply make a mockery of Article 1 to allow Trump to subvert the Constitution at the point of a knife to get Wall funding. Unfortunately, there will be more suffering before this ends. McConnell probably comes that conclusion before Trump does though I think Trump is being flimflammed.

This whole argument that Trump's base will desert him if he does not get them the Wall is based on the notion that there is someplace for the base to put pour their gruesomeness into other than Trump. They are not going to desert him into a vacuum. I have asked this question several times at DP with no answer back. Who may I ask would they desert Donald for? Not Bannon, not David Duke, not Queen Ann Coulter and I don't think Vlad could run even if he applied for US citizenship. So somebody tell me who the base would go to if they abandoned Donald. I would think Newt Gingrich if he didn't already 75 and had so much DC baggage.

I don't know either. But I'm sure Trump supporters would be very disappointed. Trump supporters, quite a lot of Republicans in general were angry at the GOP congress critters for not standing up more to Obama. Out of that anger, Trump was born. But he didn't come onto the horizon until the middle of 2015. They lashed onto him because they deemed him a fighter. A fighter, vulgar at that, who first won in the primary, then the general.

He failed on the repeal of Obamacare, but those angry Republicans, Trump supporters blamed that on the Republican congress. The wall is different. I think they, Trump supporters look at it differently also. This is their man in a championship bout, defending the belt he won back in 2016. A defeated champion doesn't have the same aura that a non-defeated champion once had. He can be beaten.

You're probably right, Trump probably would retain most of his supporters. A lot of them would be disappointed in him for caving or losing the fight. Some would slink back into the background. Waiting for another hero to come forth. There probably wouldn't be that high energy support for him from them.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[jnug]

McConnell doesn't cover for Trump here and he gets primaried by a Trumper when he tries to run in 2020. McConnell has to choose between keeping his job and doing what's right for the country. If I were him and there was a bill to stop this that had 60 votes, I'd bring it to the floor. McConnell is old, and he's rich. What is he screwing the country in the name of Trump for???

McConnell really has a problem as we edge closer and closer to people realizing that Trump is demanding Constitutional Collapse. Is that what Mitch wants his legacy to be, the destruction of our carefully cobbled three legged system of checks and balances? He does not have enough years left even to live to get over that one and every day edges us closer to people understanding what is really going on here.

 

[MAGAnificent]

Oh great....lets go back 13 years for a frame of reference. That makes sense.

Then tell me why the democrats who supported the wall in 2006 suddenly do not support it in 2019?

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Its already splitting. Hence the departure via retirement of the Flakes and the Corkers and the death of McCain. Then there is the GOP congressmen, mainly moderates driven under in the 2018 elections. I don't know who the base goes to if they abandon Trump. There is only one Donald Trump with all his faults and foibles. Like him or not, there is only one. Whether the GOP splits is not the issue. The issue is how does the base replace Trump if they abandon him. I don't see that guy or gal anywhere and they won't abandon Trump into a vacuum. They live off of manifesting their ire through Donald. They won't be able to sustain themselves into a vacuum.

You make good points. But there are other White Nationalists out there who can throw red meat to the Nationalist base by screaming MAGA and build a wall.

 

[jnug]

Then tell me why the democrats who supported the wall in 2006 suddenly do not support it in 2019?

You are going back 13 years for a frame of reference. I know that for the Trump base if we are not going back to 1862 it just does not seem like time matters. But you cannot hold any politician to a vote he or she made 13 years ago. Not in this century and really not in the later half of the last either. Its patently ridiculous.