More than 250 cases of alleged voter fraud involving tens of thousands of illegal votes

[marke]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

1. Nobody ever went to jailo for this,
2. It did not really affect the outcome.
3. Nobody ever proved the allegations true.
4. It was a clerical error.
5. They did not mean to break the law.
6. The cause was never identified.

And many, many more excuses and flimsy arguments designed to deceive the gullible while protecting the fraud.

https://www.brennancenter.org/sites...emocracy/Analysis of Crawford Allegations.pdf

 

[HonestJoe]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

The document you linked appears to be a direct response to some legal case challenging voter ID specifically and is presenting the case that the examples of election fraud (actual or alleged) presented to support voter ID don't actually do so.

It doesn't strike me as any kind of defence of fraud. If anything, it's part of a reasonable argument to look more widely at the issue and not obsess over voter ID as if it was the one and only solution to the issue.

There is loads of partisan politics involved in this but you're not doing anything to reduce that here.

 

[marke]

The document you linked appears to be a direct response to some legal case challenging voter ID specifically and is presenting the case that the examples of election fraud (actual or alleged) presented to support voter ID don't actually do so.

It doesn't strike me as any kind of defence of fraud. If anything, it's part of a reasonable argument to look more widely at the issue and not obsess over voter ID as if it was the one and only solution to the issue.

There is loads of partisan politics involved in this but you're not doing anything to reduce that here.

Yes, this source is official, not some biased partisan hit piece. These facts have been entered into court records. That means we need to reject any claims of fake news or lying bias. Then what? Sould we assume every case would be or will be proven false under closer examination? Why would we do that? Just to promote the narrtive that voter fraud does not exist? Why promote that narrative if it isn't true?

Admittedly, in each instance of the more than 250 separate cases listed, involving allegations of multiple tens of thousands of potential fraudulent votes, the authors of this report make some effort on every page in every case to minimize the effect of fraudulent voting. That is bias but not healthy.

Here are just the first few of the hundreds of cases listed, and the attempted dismissal of the bad effects of voter fraud in each case:

1. In 3 years in one jurisdiction there were 180 investigations into voter fraud with multiple convictions. The effort to minimize the crimes the authors said that in none of these cases was it ever proven a voter ID could have prevented the fraud.

2. Of multiple evidences of dead people voting in another area, there was no indication the pollbooks were examined for clerical error.

3. A local newspaper reported 5,412 votes by dead people in another area and 1600 votes by illegals, but no proof was presented in any of the cases than a voter ID could have prevented the fraud.

4. In another locality 100 double votes were identified and ballots exceeded voter registrations by 4,608 votes, but the investigation is still ongoing.

And so it goes. There can be no doubt the authors of these details are making efforts to make light of voter fraud. That is dishonest and is doing great damage to the integrity and security of the American elections process.

 

[calamity]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

1. Nobody ever went to jailo for this,
2. It did not really affect the outcome.
3. Nobody ever proved the allegations true.
4. It was a clerical error.
5. They did not mean to break the law.
6. The cause was never identified.

And many, many more excuses and flimsy arguments designed to deceive the gullible while protecting the fraud.

https://www.brennancenter.org/sites...emocracy/Analysis of Crawford Allegations.pdf

Wow, talk about reading the exact opposite into what the linked article wrote. This op wins that award.

 

[marke]

Wow, talk about reading the exact opposite into what the linked article wrote. This op wins that award.

If you don't want to deal with the truth of voter fraud then don't try to understand why there are so many hundreds of cases of voter fraud listed in court documents, as detailed in the report posted on the OP.

 

[HonestJoe]

And so it goes. There can be no doubt the authors of these details are making efforts to make light of voter fraud. That is dishonest and is doing great damage to the integrity and security of the American elections process.

I disagree. Assuming I'm reading it correctly, all of the items listed in the document were raised as reasons for voter ID specifically. It isn't a discussion of electoral fraud in general, it is only a challenge to the idea that those examples provide justification for the use of voter ID.

In general terms, I've actually no issue with the idea of voter ID but I'd suggest that the singular obsession with it as the one solution to electoral fraud is simply wrong and risks as much damage to the integrity of the system as anything else. In person voter impersonation is really quite a way down the long list of problems with the US electoral system. Some of the bigger problems (primarily partisan politicians running the electoral systems) is one of the reasons legitimate voter ID systems aren't being implemented in the first place.

 

[marke]

I disagree. Assuming I'm reading it correctly, all of the items listed in the document were raised as reasons for voter ID specifically. It isn't a discussion of electoral fraud in general, it is only a challenge to the idea that those examples provide justification for the use of voter ID.

In general terms, I've actually no issue with the idea of voter ID but I'd suggest that the singular obsession with it as the one solution to electoral fraud is simply wrong and risks as much damage to the integrity of the system as anything else. In person voter impersonation is really quite a way down the long list of problems with the US electoral system. Some of the bigger problems (primarily partisan politicians running the electoral systems) is one of the reasons legitimate voter ID systems aren't being implemented in the first place.

OK, good. Voter fraud is real and widespread. Some people think IDs won't stop it, but why do they not want anything to stop it?

 

[HonestJoe]

OK, good. Voter fraud is real and widespread. Some people think IDs won't stop it, but why do they not want anything to stop it?

Electoral fraud in general, not just voter fraud specifically. It's certainly real, though I'm not sure how we can define "widespread" in this context. I'd suggest that determining the extent and impact of electoral fraud is more complex and nuanced than such a simple term allows and only after that could the possible methods to minimise the risks can be determined and assessed.

I'm not sure who you're accusing of not wanting to stop voter (or electoral) fraud. I'd never heard of the organisation hosting the report you linked but a quick glance over their website shows other things about wider electoral issues. On this basis, why wouldn't you ask why the people obsessing over voter ID alone don't want to stop any other form of electoral fraud.

 

[marke]

Electoral fraud in general, not just voter fraud specifically. It's certainly real, though I'm not sure how we can define "widespread" in this context. I'd suggest that determining the extent and impact of electoral fraud is more complex and nuanced than such a simple term allows and only after that could the possible methods to minimise the risks can be determined and assessed.

I'm not sure who you're accusing of not wanting to stop voter (or electoral) fraud. I'd never heard of the organisation hosting the report you linked but a quick glance over their website shows other things about wider electoral issues. On this basis, why wouldn't you ask why the people obsessing over voter ID alone don't want to stop any other form of electoral fraud.

Electoral fraud and voter fraud are both fraud and both have the same wicked end goal, to elect corrupt politicians in ways which require an illegal boost in illegal votes to secure the win. Nevertheless, the 250 listed cases in the above document, while far from being a complete list, contain evidences of tens of thousands of fraudulent votes generated from voter fraud, as well as additional evidences of electoral fraud.

 

[HonestJoe]

Electoral fraud and voter fraud are both fraud and both have the same wicked end goal, to elect corrupt politicians in ways which require an illegal boost in illegal votes to secure the win. Nevertheless, the 250 listed cases in the above document, while far from being a complete list, contain evidences of tens of thousands of fraudulent votes generated from voter fraud, as well as additional evidences of electoral fraud.

Voter fraud is a subset of electoral fraud and many of the examples listed are of electoral fraud but not voter fraud. That's why their being presented to support voter ID was flawed. That is the sole point of that document but it's not the only document about electoral fraud (and indeed even wider issues with the US electoral system) published by that organisation or others like it.

Nobody is saying all those other forms of electoral fraud shouldn't be addressed. Of course, the reason we even know about many of them is exactly because there are measures in place to identify or prevent them. There is plenty more that could and should be done but it is far from only about voter fraud and far from only solved with voter ID. It's up to you whether you focus on the blinkered partisan-political fight over voter ID alone or engage in wider efforts to improve the US electoral and political system in general.

 

[jamesbyoung]

This case is about voter ID, and is supported by unsupported allegations of voter fraud.

 

[TomFitz]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

1. Nobody ever went to jailo for this,
2. It did not really affect the outcome.
3. Nobody ever proved the allegations true.
4. It was a clerical error.
5. They did not mean to break the law.
6. The cause was never identified.

And many, many more excuses and flimsy arguments designed to deceive the gullible while protecting the fraud.

https://www.brennancenter.org/sites...emocracy/Analysis of Crawford Allegations.pdf

So, which right wing blog fed you this link, which you didnt bother to read?????

After all. you dont have to get past about the third paragraph to learn that your OP claim is flatly contradicted by the paper itself.

Out of 400 million votes, the study found exactly ONE case of a person trying to impersonate someone else.

 

[TomFitz]

This case is about voter ID, and is supported by unsupported allegations of voter fraud.

That’s fairly typical of the voter suppression effort. They know they dont have a case. They also have a hidden agenda (preventing the other side from voting).

 

[marke]

Voter fraud is a subset of electoral fraud and many of the examples listed are of electoral fraud but not voter fraud. That's why their being presented to support voter ID was flawed. That is the sole point of that document but it's not the only document about electoral fraud (and indeed even wider issues with the US electoral system) published by that organisation or others like it.

Nobody is saying all those other forms of electoral fraud shouldn't be addressed. Of course, the reason we even know about many of them is exactly because there are measures in place to identify or prevent them. There is plenty more that could and should be done but it is far from only about voter fraud and far from only solved with voter ID. It's up to you whether you focus on the blinkered partisan-political fight over voter ID alone or engage in wider efforts to improve the US electoral and political system in general.

Jimmy Carter recommended voter ID to secure elections against fraud. He knew what he was talking about even if modern lefts do not want to agree.

 

[marke]

This case is about voter ID, and is supported by unsupported allegations of voter fraud.

The document listed in the OP has hundreds of examples of both.

 

[snakestretcher]

If you don't want to deal with the truth of voter fraud then don't try to understand why there are so many hundreds of cases of voter fraud listed in court documents, as detailed in the report posted on the OP.

Your version of the truth is what you choose to believe. That, sir, is totally at odds with the reality you are so desperate to dismiss.

 

[marke]

So, which right wing blog fed you this link, which you didnt bother to read?????

After all. you dont have to get past about the third paragraph to learn that your OP claim is flatly contradicted by the paper itself.

Out of 400 million votes, the study found exactly ONE case of a person trying to impersonate someone else.

You have not correctly summarized the evidence outlined in the paper. Not wanting any of the evidences to be true is hardly a basis for declaring none of the evidences are true. Those who do not want elections secured against voter fraud simply refuse to believe the clear implications that exist in the hundreds of known reports of fraud, including the hundreds listed in this report.

 

[marke]

That’s fairly typical of the voter suppression effort. They know they dont have a case. They also have a hidden agenda (preventing the other side from voting).

I admit that measures designed to secure elections against fraud will likely suppress the votes of thousands who had intended to vote illegally. Anyone claiming any measures to secure our elections against fraud are wrong are simply trying to protect voter fraud methods which have been used by American traitors for decades in America.

 

[TomFitz]

Jimmy Carter recommended voter ID to secure elections against fraud. He knew what he was talking about even if modern lefts do not want to agree.

I wouldn’t try and hide behind Jimmy Carter if I were you.

Ask the man himself, and he will not endorse the voters caging, voter suppression tactics employed by the GOP today.

 

[TomFitz]

I admit that measures designed to secure elections against fraud will likely suppress the votes of thousands who had intended to vote illegally. Anyone claiming any measures to secure our elections against fraud are wrong are simply trying to protect voter fraud methods which have been used by American traitors for decades in America.

Thousands who had intended to vote illegally is something you made up.

No evidence exists to support this at all.

And your attempt to defend the GOPs voter suppression effort by trying to reframe the discussion into an either/or fallacy is just as dishonest.

 

[Luther]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

1. Nobody ever went to jailo for this,
2. It did not really affect the outcome.
3. Nobody ever proved the allegations true.
4. It was a clerical error.
5. They did not mean to break the law.
6. The cause was never identified.

And many, many more excuses and flimsy arguments designed to deceive the gullible while protecting the fraud.

https://www.brennancenter.org/sites...emocracy/Analysis of Crawford Allegations.pdf

Isn't Indiana majority Republican?

 

[marke]

Thousands who had intended to vote illegally is something you made up.

No evidence exists to support this at all.

And your attempt to defend the GOPs voter suppression effort by trying to reframe the discussion into an either/or fallacy is just as dishonest.

Assuming no fraud is exposed in this document is stupid and wrong. Criticizing all efforts to protect our voting system from future is stupid and wrong. Claiming there is no fraud and there is nothing we can to to protect elections from fraud is stupid and wrong.

 

[Logician Man]

The strongest weapons wielded by democrats who oppose investigations into voter fraud are Bias, ignorance, deceit, smoke, nonsense and disbelief.

Each case in this report lists details, names, dates, specifics and so forth. Common throughout, however, are not refutations of the dates, but efforts to mislead the readers into acceptance of dummass reasons not to be concerned about the damage voter fraud does to our country.

What reasons are given to try to convionce people to simply ignore voter fraud while doing tnothing to try to stop it? Here are som typical types of arguments, excuses, lies, and other tactics designed to leave voter fraud alone in the hands of the crooks:

1. Nobody ever went to jailo for this,
2. It did not really affect the outcome.
3. Nobody ever proved the allegations true.
4. It was a clerical error.
5. They did not mean to break the law.
6. The cause was never identified.

And many, many more excuses and flimsy arguments designed to deceive the gullible while protecting the fraud.

https://www.brennancenter.org/sites...emocracy/Analysis of Crawford Allegations.pdf

:yawn: :inandout:

 

[marke]

Isn't Indiana majority Republican?

So? Should no effort be made in a state to secure our elections from future fraud just because there may be more of one party than another in the state?

 

[Termn8or]

Thousands who had intended to vote illegally is something you made up.

No evidence exists to support this at all.

And your attempt to defend the GOPs voter suppression effort by trying to reframe the discussion into an either/or fallacy is just as dishonest.

Have you read either of John Fund's two books filled with mostly Democrat-committed voter fraud?

Read through Heritage's 1200 examples?

No? Didn't think so.

You're just blowing smoke.