• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Mike Pence Versus Joe Biden

If Trump Resigned, who would you vote for in November?

  • Mike Pence (Republican)

    Votes: 26 30.6%
  • Joe Biden (Democrat)

    Votes: 53 62.4%
  • Other

    Votes: 5 5.9%
  • I would not vote

    Votes: 1 1.2%

  • Total voters
    85
  • Poll closed .
How does Trump not ALSO represent the 'elitists'? Yeah, he ran on 'draining the swamp' and he (rightly) hammered Clinton on her Wall-Street ties, but then he proceeded to induct some of the very same WS/corporate-ass-hat scumbags he railed against, into the administration.

Does 'elitist' really mean anything to you guys? Because I'm fairly certain that a billionaire/millionaire who has outright admitted to buying politicians, who appoints Exxon-Mobile and WS bankers to administrative positions, qaulifies as 'part of the establishment'.

You guys were had, quite a while back.
The primary difference is in the policies. Trump's policies so far do not have the taint of the progressive man's burden,
where the enlightened tell the rest of us that they know better, and we should be forced down their enlightened path.
 
No different than the nonsense you attribute to Trump!

No, I am actually quoting Trump's own words and actions. You on the other hand have this notion that a New York billionaire, afflicted with extreme narcissism, a massive inferiority complex, and lacking any semblance of a conscience, somehow represents anyone but the "elite".
 
No, I am actually quoting Trump's own words and actions. You on the other hand have this notion that a New York billionaire, afflicted with extreme narcissism, a massive inferiority complex, and lacking any semblance of a conscience, somehow represents anyone but the "elite".
Actions speak louder than words, We will just have to agree to disagree!
 
Actions speak louder than words, We will just have to agree to disagree!

Do you mean his actions like running around as the biggest birther on earth for the entire Obama presidency? How about his actions in retweeting videos of white Trump supporters yelling "white power"? What about his actions in not allowing the military to rename bases that are named after Confederate heroes? What about his actions of having a white supremacist as his most trusted advisor? The guy is a white supremacist.

You want to vote for him, by all means, do so, but be man enough to put a Trump sign in your yard and a Trump sticker on your car so that everyone that knows you, knows that you voted for an Anti-American racist.
 
The primary difference is in the policies. Trump's policies so far do not have the taint of the progressive man's burden,
where the enlightened tell the rest of us that they know better, and we should be forced down their enlightened path.

You're speaking in plattitudes. You sound like a Democratic politician. Mind elaborating with tangible statements?
 
More likely that Biden would withdraw from the race or be unable to continue.
Biden is in a steep mental decline. There is no way he could function as the
president of the United States.
Biden could lose all his brain cells, and he would still have 150 IQ points on Pence.
Pence is only good for kissing Trump’s worthless lying ass. Nothing more.
 
Do you mean his actions like running around as the biggest birther on earth for the entire Obama presidency? How about his actions in retweeting videos of white Trump supporters yelling "white power"? What about his actions in not allowing the military to rename bases that are named after Confederate heroes? What about his actions of having a white supremacist as his most trusted advisor? The guy is a white supremacist.

You want to vote for him, by all means, do so, but be man enough to put a Trump sign in your yard and a Trump sticker on your car so that everyone that knows you, knows that you voted for an Anti-American racist.

Your bias is showing!
 
You're speaking in plattitudes. You sound like a Democratic politician. Mind elaborating with tangible statements?
It is a more general thing, but if you looked at Trump and Biden from a Libertarian perspective, Trump would appear
much closer to the Libertarian views than Biden.
The democratic party seems to be more about increasing peoples dependence on Government
than decreasing it. In my opinion, Government should always be attempting to minimize it's impact on society.
 
Your bias is showing!

You are being ridiculous. There is nothing that I said that anyone, other than a racist, would see any bias in. If you want to vote for a racist because you agree with him on other things then fine, do so, but man up and admit it.
 
You are being ridiculous. There is nothing that I said that anyone, other than a racist, would see any bias in. If you want to vote for a racist because you agree with him on other things then fine, do so, but man up and admit it.
I take it you have never seen real raciest, least you would not so readily attach the label.
I grew up in Southern Louisiana in the 1960's, and have seen real raciest. They are vile, ignorant, white trash! (and dangerous).
Thankfully there are not many of those left. I am talking about, those idiots who would beat the hell out of a store owner, and burn a cross
in front of his home/store, because he sold to black people. ( forget the fact that 90% of the people within a mile of the store were black).
Those same morons would tell me that I am Hispanic, and that my kids are half breeds.
No! we do not have many of the real racist left, and Trump is not even a pale shadow of those!
 
I take it you have never seen real raciest, least you would not so readily attach the label.
I grew up in Southern Louisiana in the 1960's, and have seen real raciest. They are vile, ignorant, white trash! (and dangerous).
Thankfully there are not many of those left. I am talking about, those idiots who would beat the hell out of a store owner, and burn a cross
in front of his home/store, because he sold to black people. ( forget the fact that 90% of the people within a mile of the store were black).
Those same morons would tell me that I am Hispanic, and that my kids are half breeds.
No! we do not have many of the real racist left, and Trump is not even a pale shadow of those!

So basically, in your opinion, since Trump is not a member of the klan, and because he got far too much money from his father to be considered poor white trash, he can't be a racist. That is pretty damn stupid. I grew up in rural Arkansas, I know what racists are.
 
So basically, in your opinion, since Trump is not a member of the klan, and because he got far too much money from his father to be considered poor white trash, he can't be a racist. That is pretty damn stupid. I grew up in rural Arkansas, I know what racists are.
If you know what racist are, why are you including Trump in the list?
For a man in his 70's his attitude on race is very accepting, he has hired people from other races than his to be on his cabinet,
and his decisions do not appear to be based on race. Is he perfect? by no means, but he is not a raciest, as far as his actions are concerned.
 
It is a more general thing, but if you looked at Trump and Biden from a Libertarian perspective, Trump would appear
much closer to the Libertarian views than Biden.
The democratic party seems to be more about increasing peoples dependence on Government
than decreasing it. In my opinion, Government should always be attempting to minimize it's impact on society.

While this is a coherent thought, it does not have anything to do with being 'elite' or not being 'elite'. Words mean things. If you actually look up the definition of the word, 'elite' (which I would post here, if I weren't typing this post on a game console) it means something akin to 'the best of the best' or 'people of the highest class'. When people talk about the social elite, they're basically talking about uppity rich folk, and ussually with a negative connotation.

When it comes to politics, right-wingers like to call Democrats out as 'elites', and I ussually get the feeling that it's either meant to imply that the Democratic party is mostly full of college-educated liberals--as opposed to rural conservatives, or meant to imply that Democrats are the bigger corporate shills. Neither implications is true; both parties cobble together various groups of people from different backgrounds and classes, and both parties are almost neck and neck when it comes to their subservience to the donor/rich/elite class.

I'm harping on the whole 'elite' thing, because I have been seeing it used more and more in a way that makes no sense, and it's pretty clear to me that people are simply parroting that which gets their own base fired up, but this sort of meaningless rhetoric does nothing but confuse everyone involved.

---

As for libertarianism, well, yes, I'm familiar with the libertarian view of small government and can even respect the idealogy, given that I sympathize with anarchist ideals, but I don't hold to it, myself, being someone who would tackle minimizing the wealth and income gap through any means neccessary; you can say that I'm someone who distrusts government power, but who also distrusts government power by equal measure. I would, however, would much rather acheive such a goal through higher wages and unionization, rather than relying on the welfare system to attempt to pick up the slack.

I'm not a libertarian or a conservative, obviously, and have no inherent issue with welfare, myself, but I strongly feel that it should only be relegated to being a safty-net, and to tackling extenuating circumstances. Wages must be competitive enough across the board as to reduce the incentive towards abusing or gaming the system.
 
While this is a coherent thought, it does not have anything to do with being 'elite' or not being 'elite'. Words mean things. If you actually look up the definition of the word, 'elite' (which I would post here, if I weren't typing this post on a game console) it means something akin to 'the best of the best' or 'people of the highest class'. When people talk about the social elite, they're basically talking about uppity rich folk, and ussually with a negative connotation.

When it comes to politics, right-wingers like to call Democrats out as 'elites', and I ussually get the feeling that it's either meant to imply that the Democratic party is mostly full of college-educated liberals--as opposed to rural conservatives, or meant to imply that Democrats are the bigger corporate shills. Neither implications is true; both parties cobble together various groups of people from different backgrounds and classes, and both parties are almost neck and neck when it comes to their subservience to the donor/rich/elite class.

I'm harping on the whole 'elite' thing, because I have been seeing it used more and more in a way that makes no sense, and it's pretty clear to me that people are simply parroting that which gets their own base fired up, but this sort of meaningless rhetoric does nothing but confuse everyone involved.

---

As for libertarianism, well, yes, I'm familiar with the libertarian view of small government and can even respect the idealogy, given that I sympathize with anarchist ideals, but I don't hold to it, myself, being someone who would tackle minimizing the wealth and income gap through any means neccessary; you can say that I'm someone who distrusts government power, but who also distrusts government power by equal measure. I would, however, would much rather acheive such a goal through higher wages and unionization, rather than relying on the welfare system to attempt to pick up the slack.

I'm not a libertarian or a conservative, obviously, and have no inherent issue with welfare, myself, but I strongly feel that it should only be relegated to being a safty-net, and to tackling extenuating circumstances. Wages must be competitive enough across the board as to reduce the incentive towards abusing or gaming the system.

I am talking about ideological elitism, not financial! The idea that the unwashed masses, are incapable of making their own decisions,
and must be coerced down the proper path. Freedom is about letting people make their own choices, even bad ones!
As a society, we have an obligation to help those incapable of taking care of themselves, but we have no obligation
to help those unwilling to take care of themselves.
 
Back
Top Bottom