Male Post-Conception Opt Out

[Bodi]

He cant. It's a direct and perfect example and I've made it many times, so have others. He refuses to acknowledge it.

And yet today...people legally recognized as men do gestate....it has already occurred. So...this is HIS lie. That he refuses to acknowledge this reality.

The law would be applied *equally* to men. The "right" that he pretends exists would be upheld equally for men.

Oh boy... :lol: This is an argument about biological men not having the same rights as biological women and you bring up biological women thinking that they are men having kids and call ME a liar? :lol:

And you wonder why I blow your stupid lies off and ignore them? :lol:

 

[Bodi]

There is no lie present. A woman does not have a right to opt out of parenthood. If a woman had that right she could exercise it regardless of which body the ZEF is in. But this is not true. If her offspring is being gestated in a body other than her own she is required to provide child support of some manner after birth occurs, unless the one carrying the ZEF decides to abort. That is exactly the same as occurs for the man. I'll even spell it out to make sure. If his offspring is being gestated in a body other than his own he is required to provide child support of some manner after birth occurs, unless the one carrying the ZEF decides to abort. How about that? Other than gender pronouns, exactly the same. No difference between man and woman.

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A woman has the right to opt out of parenthood... it is called an abortion.

Why read any further when you open up with something so ridiculous?

 

[Bodi]

Fact: If her offspring is being gestated in a body other than her own she is legally required to provide child support of some manner after birth occurs, unless the one carrying the ZEF decides to abort.

If her egg is implanted in another female then the child produced is not "her offspring".

It is the offspring of the gestating mother...

 

[Bodi]

The law applies equally to men.

A a corporation is a person... :roll:



:lol: Post more stupid stuff...

 

[Lursa]

Oh boy... :lol: This is an argument about biological men not having the same rights as biological women and you bring up biological women thinking that they are men having kids and call ME a liar?

And you wonder why I blow your stupid lies off and ignore them? :lol:

No no no! You have claimed that biology has NOTHING to do with this argument. :mrgreen:

And your post is about a LEGAL argument, a LEGAL 'opt-out.' Nothing to do with biology, you've claimed that over and over and over.

And so I am showing that a LEGALLY recognized man would have EQUAL opportunity under the current laws to opt-out as women.

You have sooooo failed here...hoisted with your own petard "it's not about biology!"

:lamo :lamo

 

[Lursa]

A a corporation is a person... :roll:

:lol: Post more stupid stuff...

Corporations have the "right" to not be parents.

LMAO, oh the stupid just keeps coming...from you.

:lamo :lamo

 

[Bodi]

Corporations have the "right" to not be parents.

LMAO, oh the stupid just keeps coming...from you.

:lamo :lamo

That was not the point... so of course you missed it.

No no no! You have claimed that biology has NOTHING to do with this argument. :mrgreen:

And your post is about a LEGAL argument, a LEGAL 'opt-out.' Nothing to do with biology, you've claimed that over and over and over.

And so I am showing that a LEGALLY recognized man would have EQUAL opportunity under the current laws to opt-out as women.

You have sooooo failed here...hoisted with your own petard "it's not about biology!"

:lamo :lamo

It has nothing to do with biology in child support as well as the way that you try to use it here...

Of course you are taking my comment out of context or not understanding it... because I only talk about men not having the same rights LEGALLY that women do regarding opt out and that is because they are biologically men who can not get pregnant.

 

[Lursa]

That was not the point... so of course you missed it.



It has nothing to do with biology in child support as well as the way that you try to use it here...

Of course you are taking my comment out of context or not understanding it... because I only talk about men not having the same rights LEGALLY that women do regarding opt out and that is because they are biologically men who can not get pregnant.

Nope...you are making a legal argument for equality. I have clearly proven that the law currently applies equally to men and women.

You are trying to move the goalposts in your poorly thought-out proposal...now that we've shown (again) that it fails.

How hypocritical can you be? "Biology" only matters "when YOU want it to."

Not only that, you also always write that it's not about child support :doh It's about *equality!* (imagine Bod stamping his feet) And you call me a liar? :roll:

:lamo :lamo

 

[Bodi]

Nope...you are making a legal argument for equality. I have clearly proven that the law currently applies equally to men and women.

You are trying to move the goalposts in your poorly thought-out proposal...now that we've shown (again) that it fails.

How hypocritical can you be? "Biology" only matters "when YOU want it to."

Not only that, you also always write that it's not about child support :doh And you call me a liar? :roll:

:lamo :lamo

Men can not get pregnant... just more lies... or...

Like I have said, you might not be lying, you might actually believe the stupid **** that you write.

How hypocritical can you be? "Biology" only matters "when YOU want it to."

Biology matters in that men can not get pregnant and women can. That is it. That is how it does not relate to Child Support. That is how it DOES relate opting out. At no time can a man opt out, legally, because of his biology. At all times a woman can opt out Legally, because of her biology.

Biology matters when I want it to because that is how I have framed the argument. If you don't like that then don't argue it but the way that I have framed the argument is iron clad... it is the difference between knowing how to win an argument and being lead about and then having to resort to lies in a feeble effort to change the argument.

 

[Lursa]

Men can not get pregnant... just more lies... or...

Like I have said, you might not be lying, you might actually believe the stupid **** that you write.

Yes...'legally recognized' men can and have gotten pregnant.

Dont lie just because it's inconvenient to your OP which is based on a LEGAL argument for "equality."

Face it, you screwed yourself with the constant "it's not about biology" BS. But guess what...your cop-out proposal fails on a legal basis as well.

 

[Bodi]

Yes...'legally recognized' men can and have gotten pregnant.

Dont lie just because it's inconvenient to your OP which is based on a LEGAL argument for "equality."

Face it, you screwed yourself with the constant "it's not about biology" BS. But guess what...your cop-out proposal fails on a legal basis as well.

See my above edited post... it is why you take things out of context and/or post lies and why I have little time to spend on your posts...

 

[maquiscat]

A woman has the right to opt out of parenthood... it is called an abortion.

Why read any further when you open up with something so ridiculous?

Again, the results of one right, does not create a separate right in and of itself. If a woman has a right to opt out of parenthood, then she could do so anytime, not just when the ZEF is in her body. If a woman had a right to opt out of parenthood, she could do so while her biological offspring was being carried by a surrogate. Can you show where a woman can opt out of her biological offspring is in a surrogate's body?

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[maquiscat]

If her egg is implanted in another female then the child produced is not "her offspring".

It is the offspring of the gestating mother...

It is biologically and legally hers, not the surrogate's. Keep in mind this is different from the type of surrogate where the man uses another woman to create the offspring and said surrogate has agreed to legal turn over her parental rights and responsibility over to the man's significant other, usually his wife. In that case, it is legally the wife's, bit biologically the surrogate's.

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[Lursa]

Biology matters when I want it to...

:lamo :lamo

 

[Bodi]

Again, the results of one right, does not create a separate right in and of itself. If a woman has a right to opt out of parenthood, then she could do so anytime, not just when the ZEF is in her body. If a woman had a right to opt out of parenthood, she could do so while her biological offspring was being carried by a surrogate. Can you show where a woman can opt out of her biological offspring is in a surrogate's body?

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A woman who is using a surrogate is not the parent. The child is also not her offspring. She entered into a contract relinquishing their right to opt out.

 

[Bodi]

:lamo :lamo

That is how the argument is framed... you would make a terrible lawyer.

 

[Lursa]

See my above edited post... it is why you take things out of context and/or post lies and why I have little time to spend on your posts...

The edit in your post reads like a 2 yr old trying to get out of sitting in the corner. I took nothing out of context...if you are making a legal argument, then you have to recognize that the law does apply equally to men and women. And legally-recognized men do get pregnant.

I dont care if you respond or not. My responses will remain for anyone else to read and consider...and see how your cop-out has failed on every level (as usual).

 

[Lursa]

That is how the argument is framed... you would make a terrible lawyer.

Thank you

 

[Bodi]

It is biologically and legally hers, not the surrogate's. Keep in mind this is different from the type of surrogate where the man uses another woman to create the offspring and said surrogate has agreed to legal turn over her parental rights and responsibility over to the man's significant other, usually his wife. In that case, it is legally the wife's, bit biologically the surrogate's.

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A surrogate can keep the baby as her own after birth and can have an abortion if she wants to as well...

 

[Bodi]

Thank you

I guess that you don't see how it was not about you actually being a lawyer but about your inability to debate effectively...

 

[Lursa]

I guess that you don't see how it was not about you actually being a lawyer but about your inability to debate effectively...

LMAO...now you've been reduced to explaining your already lame attempts at personal insults?

And of course you know...resorting to personal insults is the strongest evidence that your arguments have failed. :mrgreen:

:2bow:

 

[Bodi]

...resorting to personal insults is the strongest evidence that your arguments have failed. :

That is logically incorrect... but more evidence from you of a weak understanding of debate and logic is always nice to see...

 

[Lursa]

That is logically incorrect... but more evidence from you of a weak understanding of debate and logic is always nice to see...

So myopic of you...it's pretty common to see people here recognizing that deteriorating into personal insults indicates a failure to succeed in an argument. Esp when no additional discussion is involved. You provide ample evidence of that.

(er...not insult...just fact)

Now...anything else to add to your cop-out proposal?

 

[Bodi]

So myopic of you...it's pretty common to see people here recognizing that deteriorating into personal insults indicates a failure to succeed in an argument. Esp when no additional discussion is involved. You provide ample evidence of that.

(er...not insult...just fact)

Now...anything else to add to your cop-out proposal?

There are exceptions to every rule... I would hope to see you trying to understand this logic instead of trying to pat yourself on the back for a failed counter-argument.

 

[Lursa]

There are exceptions to every rule... I would hope to see you trying to understand this logic instead of trying to pat yourself on the back for a failed counter-argument.

You have presented no new "logic," only moving goal posts and denial.

Your argument for parental cop-out convenience for men has moved into personal discussion cop-out "convenience" for you.

Carry on...it's all set out here for others to consider.