Making Noise not Sense

[presluc]

There are often arguments here and elsewhere where one side seems intent upon simply being the last to say something.

To me, I hope, this difference is clear. See the posts by Presluc on the Evolution creationism thread.

But there are often many other examples. Most are where the subject is of religious charicter.

Why do people do this?

Who are they convincing with such drivel?

Is it anybody other than themselves?

Sir, I thought in a debate forum if one post to you you respond perhaps I was wrong. for of all the post on the evolution vs creationism thread I posted once. the rest were merely responding
If you are wandering why I'm here; on a debate forum one debates or discusses what is in the OP my name is there is it not?eace

 

[presluc]

Nothing religious people hold dear it's under attack. That's a conspiracy theory.

What it's really happening is that homosexuality is becoming a protected status like the others.

They simply don't like it because they cooked it up in their little minds that or nation should respect their religion. They aren't being attacked. That is playing victim to get their way.

Having faith in God, intelligent design, or a higher power does not necessarily follow any religion.eace

 

[presluc]

You, I and millions of other people may see it that way. But, obviously, they do not. The thread is asking why they become obstinate in these threads. That's why. They see things completely different than other people do.

For me, gay people getting married, woman getting an abortion and schools teaching science to kids who then figure out that what religions say about the Sky God, Jesus or Mohammad is probably bull**** is not a big deal. For them, it's the end of the world as they know it. Of course they're going to dig their heels in.


They'll say they do tolerate it, but they still want laws banning abortion, defining marriage as between a man and a woman, and push for prayer being allowed in schools. For them it's a war on Christmas when the school calls the holiday vacation Winter Break.

First of all who is " THEY"?
i have faith in God, Intelligent design, or a higher power. but not organized religion.

Although I am hetrosexual I support Gay rights
I support abortion
I support the death penalty.
I support the rights of the Individual as long as he is not harmful to himself or others.
Most of all I support the division of church and state. That's both sides Religion has no right to tell people what they can or can not do. However, everybody knows the main voter base of the Republican party and splinters of the Republican party is ORGANIZED RELIGION. this in my opinion is wrong.
If you want to get political I'd have to go Independent, for what else is there Republicans and Democrats playing the blame game shuffle and not my fault dance eace.

 

[calamity]

First of all who is " THEY"?
i have faith in God, Intelligent design, or a higher power. but not organized religion.

Although I am hetrosexual I support Gay rights
I support abortion
I support the death penalty.
I support the rights of the Individual as long as he is not harmful to himself or others.
Most of all I support the division of church and state. That's both sides Religion has no right to tell people what they can or can not do. However, everybody knows the main voter base of the Republican party and splinters of the Republican party is ORGANIZED RELIGION. this in my opinion is wrong.
If you want to get political I'd have to go Independent, for what else is there Republicans and Democrats playing the blame game shuffle and not my fault dance eace.

They, in the context of my post, would be the Religious Right who oppose gay marriage, abortion and push for prayer in schools.

 

[CLAX1911]

Having faith in God, intelligent design, or a higher power does not necessarily follow any religion.eace

Absolutely agree.

 

[presluc]

They, in the context of my post, would be the Religious Right who oppose gay marriage, abortion and push for prayer in schools.

I'm not a part of the Religious right I'm Independent., although hetrosexual and have faith in God I do not oppose gay rights .
However to be an Individual if the Big Bang theory is taught in public schools then religion should be taught in schools , after all it is the individual's choice is it not?
If you have but one choice well?eace

 

[calamity]

I'm not a part of the Religious right I'm Independent., although hetrosexual and have faith in God I do not oppose gay rights .

That would make that a correct assessment then. The RR is definitely opposed to things like same sex marriage and leaving gays alone versus sending them to conversion therapy where they are expected to pray the gay away.

However to be an Individual if the Big Bang theory is taught in public schools then religion should be taught in schools , after all it is the individual's choice is it not?
If you have but one choice well?eace

I've always had this "teach both" mentality, even when I was in college. And, I'm an atheist. If a school is going to discuss the Big Bang, then they should at least include the alternative to it: creation.

 

[Quag]

That would make that a correct assessment then. The RR is definitely opposed to things like same sex marriage and leaving gays alone versus sending them to conversion therapy where they are expected to pray the gay away.


I've always had this "teach both" mentality, even when I was in college. And, I'm an atheist. If a school is going to discuss the Big Bang, then they should at least include the alternative to it: creation.

BBT is a scientific theory supported by evidence Creationism is bible literalism ignoring evidence.
Religion has 0 place in schools, If you want to teach your children a certain belief system it is upon you to do so.
When you promote anti-science claptrap you get this kind of nonsense.


BBT isnt anti-God(s) before anyone makes that familiar and incorrect claim. It is however actually supported by evidence unlike creatioinist BS. But if you think creationism should be taught then you better agree to teaching FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories as they have as much evidence behind them as bible literalst YECers.

 

[calamity]

BBT is a scientific theory supported by evidence Creationism is bible literalism ignoring evidence.
Religion has 0 place in schools, If you want to teach your children a certain belief system it is upon you to do so.
When you promote anti-science claptrap you get this kind of nonsense.
View attachment 67196910

BBT isnt anti-God(s) before anyone makes that familiar and incorrect claim. It is however actually supported by evidence unlike creatioinist BS. But if you think creationism should be taught then you better agree to teaching FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories as they have as much evidence behind them as bible literalst YECers.

BBT is speculative with some supporting evidence. May as well say god popped the universe into existence when we discuss it. And, like I said, I firmly believe there is no god.

 

[Quag]

BBT is speculative with some supporting evidence. May as well say god popped the universe into existence when we discuss it. And, like I said, I firmly believe there is no god.

BBT has evidence behind it YECers not only have no evidence, what we do know disproves their nonsense.

So unless you think FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories shoould also be taught then YEC BS should not be considered either.

 

[calamity]

BBT has evidence behind it YECers not only have no evidence, what we do know disproves their nonsense.

So unless you think FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories shoould also be taught then YEC BS should not be considered either.

You're going to far, reading way too much into what I said. I said that if they teach BBT in high school, then making mention of the idea that the universe (not YEC, not some garden with Adam and ****ing Eve, none of that myth ****) may have been created is also a possibility. Both, after all, say the universe just popped into existence with no evidence at all supporting the hows and whys. No one knows what the Big Bang really was except a sudden burst of energy.

 

[Quag]

You're going to far, reading way too much into what I said. I said that if they teach BBT in high school, then making mention of the idea that the universe (not YEC, not some garden with Adam and ****ing Eve, none of that myth ****) may have been created is also a possibility. Both, after all, say the universe just popped into existence with no evidence at all supporting the hows and whys. No one knows what the Big Bang really was except a sudden burst of energy.

When people talk about teaching creation along with BBT they usually mean bible literalism and 6k year old earth. This is after all a heavily USA centered forum.

 

[calamity]

When people talk about teaching creation along with BBT they usually mean bible literalism and 6k year old earth. This is after all a heavily USA centered forum.

Well, that's definitely not what I would endorse. Although, that would be fine for a mythology class.

 

[Tim the plumber]

Ego.

When we debate, it so often becomes personal. And when a post is challenged, the poster feels challenged. Having the last word has been seen in our culture as some kind of win in the argument. In Asian cultures those who keep debating with a weak argument are considered childish

Do they really not have the endless "no it isn't" arguments????

If so how does the communist idea hold sway ever?

 

[Tim the plumber]

Originally Posted by Tim the plumber View Post
There are often arguments here and elsewhere where one side seems intent upon simply being the last to say something.

To me, I hope, this difference is clear. See the posts by Presluc on the Evolution creationism thread.

But there are often many other examples. Most are where the subject is of religious charicter.

Why do people do this?

Who are they convincing with such drivel?

Is it anybody other than themselves?

Sir, I thought in a debate forum if one post to you you respond perhaps I was wrong. for of all the post on the evolution vs creationism thread I posted once. the rest were merely responding
If you are wandering why I'm here; on a debate forum one debates or discusses what is in the OP my name is there is it not?eace

If ever I had wanted an example of exactly what I was talking about here it is in spades!

Not only not relivant to the thread. Not only not presenting any idea that would convice anybody of anything but also totally incoherant as well.

Presluc, who do you think is likely to change their mind due to your post?

 

[presluc]

They, in the context of my post, would be the Religious Right who oppose gay marriage, abortion and push for prayer in schools.

You are talking about organized Religion which stands for power and money. There are many out here who do not agree with organized Religion. but have faith in God , intelligent design or a higher power.

However if you flip the script , how much money and power has ateist had , lectures, research, books , ect.
Every atheist agrees on one thing there is no God they know

Faith believers have faith there is , but we don't have proof , find that out when we die .

In short we have faith but can not prove it
Atheist have theory but can not prove it.eace

 

[presluc]

That would make that a correct assessment then. The RR is definitely opposed to things like same sex marriage and leaving gays alone versus sending them to conversion therapy where they are expected to pray the gay away.


I've always had this "teach both" mentality, even when I was in college. And, I'm an atheist. If a school is going to discuss the Big Bang, then they should at least include the alternative to it: creation.

At one time I thought like organized religion , but after some research I changed Faith believers came back to 1 factor overlooked by organized religion God gave us free will.
You might stop a person from doing but you can not stop a person from thinking nor can you kill an idea.eace

 

[presluc]

BBT is speculative with some supporting evidence. May as well say god popped the universe into existence when we discuss it. And, like I said, I firmly believe there is no god.

The evidence SUPPORTING THE bbt is a best questionable.eace

 

[presluc]

BBT is a scientific theory supported by evidence Creationism is bible literalism ignoring evidence.
Religion has 0 place in schools, If you want to teach your children a certain belief system it is upon you to do so.
When you promote anti-science claptrap you get this kind of nonsense.
View attachment 67196910

BBT isnt anti-God(s) before anyone makes that familiar and incorrect claim. It is however actually supported by evidence unlike creatioinist BS. But if you think creationism should be taught then you better agree to teaching FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories as they have as much evidence behind them as bible literalst YECers.

First of all just because you have faith or believe in God , dose not mean you do not have faith or believe in science.
Second of all your uhh evidence is unconfirmed , and circumstantial
The belief system I would want for children is to the have the right to make your own choice.

How far as the so called scientific theory of BBT got so far telescope" you can see the whole universe with that" , theories red shift,theory expansion,theory a bunch of intellectual physics teachers on the lecture circuit, maybe another book?
what else ya got.eace

 

[presluc]

BBT has evidence behind it YECers not only have no evidence, what we do know disproves their nonsense.

So unless you think FSM and Hinduism and Greek/Norse/Sumerian creation stories shoould also be taught then YEC BS should not be considered either.

I've ask this before let me ask it again.

Is there any iron clad, hard core proof to the Big Bang Theory, not theories , not hypotheses FACTS?
NO SPEECHES JUST YES OR NO ANSWER.eace

 

[Quag]

I've ask this before let me ask it again.

Is there any iron clad, hard core proof to the Big Bang Theory, not theories , not hypotheses FACTS?
NO SPEECHES JUST YES OR NO ANSWER.eace

BBT is a theory it has evidence, no religious belief has any evidence, only belief.

 

[Quag]

First of all just because you have faith or believe in God , dose not mean you do not have faith or believe in science.

Never said anything approaching that

Second of all your uhh evidence is unconfirmed , and circumstantial

Apparently you don't understand the term evidence

The belief system I would want for children is to the have the right to make your own choice.

Huh? What choice are you denied?

How far as the so called scientific theory of BBT got so far telescope" you can see the whole universe with that" , theories red shift,theory expansion,theory a bunch of intellectual physics teachers on the lecture circuit, maybe another book?
what else ya got.eace

You are just confirming that you do not actually understand anything about BBT.

 

[presluc]

If ever I had wanted an example of exactly what I was talking about here it is in spades!

Not only not relivant to the thread. Not only not presenting any idea that would convice anybody of anything but also totally incoherant as well.

Presluc, who do you think is likely to change their mind due to your post?[/QUOTE

I didn't think anyone on this forum would want to change their minds , after all I did say in a debate forum if someone post to you you respond if you want to.. In a debate forum , one does tend to debate or discuss the OP That is true is it not , I was taught to debate the issues not the poster how was you taught?eace

 

[presluc]

Never said anything approaching that

Apparently you don't understand the term evidence

Huh? What choice are you denied?


You are just confirming that you do not actually understand anything about BBT.

You want to read the first sentence of your post again.

If I commit a crime evidence is gathered forensic or otherwise or eye witness then a jury will decide if the evidence is correct or not, as far as the evidence concerning the BBT THE JURY'S STILL OUT WOULDN'T CELEBRATE JUST YET.

If I taught a cooking class but you could only study fried foods and it was the only cooking class you could take publicly?

You are confirming exactly what I thought about the progress of the Big Bang theory .... NOTHINGeace

 

[presluc]

BBT is a theory it has evidence, no religious belief has any evidence, only belief.

It is true I have no proof and miracles are not accepted as evidence , however unconfirmed, circumstantial evidence is welcome. Although neither can be proven as FACT.
That is what we want right FACTS?eace