Lois Lerner does about-face, will give Hill testimony on IRS scandal

[Mithros]

When trying to prove the legal definition of a phrase you probably shouldn't pull from BusinessDictionary.com.

But then "social welfare" isn't clearly defined in the law, so I can see your conundrum.

Advocating for one side of an issue is not political. Most Tea Partiers don't give a damn who balanced the budget or lowered taxes, in the end. Just because lately Democrats seem universally opposed to that concept doesn't mean that Tea Party goals are political.

Perfect! I think you exactly expressed the root cause of all the disagreements. You don't consider TEA party groups to be non-political. So lets start there. What's the difference between a political group which we all agree should be 527 and a Social Welfare group which should be 501c4?

 

[Mithros]

We cannot debate your beliefs. They are yours and we can leave it at that.

Please give me any plausible series of events where Issa could be telling the truth.

Why can't you just accept that he's lying? Democrats, Republicans, Tea Partiers, Lawyers, Husbands, Wives, Children, etc.... they ALL lie. And yet Issa.... well we can't possibly know if he's lying.

 

[Grant]

Please give me any plausible series of events where Issa could be telling the truth.

Why can't you just accept that he's lying? Democrats, Republicans, Tea Partiers, Lawyers, Husbands, Wives, Children, etc.... they ALL lie. And yet Issa.... well we can't possibly know if he's lying.

Everyone lies? How do I know you're telling the truth?

 

[jmotivator]

Perfect! I think you exactly expressed the root cause of all the disagreements. You don't consider TEA party groups to be non-political. So lets start there. What's the difference between a political group which we all agree should be 527 and a Social Welfare group which should be 501c4?

What? I didn't say I thought Tea Party groups are political, they are ideological. Being for or against higher taxes is not inherently political. If your groups primary goal is to educate the public on the effects of taxation on the population you are not being political, you are advocating your group's ideology, which is fully supported under 501c4.

 

[jmotivator]

Everyone lies? How do I know you're telling the truth?

Hah, yeah, I don't think Mithros thought that statement through strategically. The only use of such proclamations that I can think of is to make robots explode.

 

[ChezC3]

If she's covering Obama's ass, it may very well be that she'll get one when she takes the fall for him. I'd be on the look out for that.

Well, if anything we know it was done on his behalf. Whether it was done under his direction is the question, isn't it? Personally, growing up with Chicago politics I have no doubt in my mind that he was in on it.

People might assume that it is the partisan in me that makes me believe this but it isn't, it's the Chicago in me.

This is textbook Machine politics that old Daley himself is smiling from the grave over.

 

[eohrnberger]

Well, if anything we know it was done on his behalf. Whether it was done under his direction is the question, isn't it? Personally, growing up with Chicago politics I have no doubt in my mind that he was in on it.

People might assume that it is the partisan in me that makes me believe this but it isn't, it's the Chicago in me.

This is textbook Machine politics that old Daley himself is smiling from the grave over.

Oh, I have no doubt that Obama had knowledge of it going on, whether he ordered it, or just gave the appropriate wink and nod at the right time to get it done it very much open to debate, and frankly we'll probably never know for sure. I'm also sure that he'll have some sort of plausible deniability in place so that he can't get hung for it.

 

[jmotivator]

Well, if anything we know it was done on his behalf. Whether it was done under his direction is the question, isn't it? Personally, growing up with Chicago politics I have no doubt in my mind that he was in on it.

People might assume that it is the partisan in me that makes me believe this but it isn't, it's the Chicago in me.

This is textbook Machine politics that old Daley himself is smiling from the grave over.

It does fit the Obama MO perfectly, doesn't it? He doesn't like a legal decision or law so he finds a way through his administration to circumvent it. He didn't like the Citizens United SCOTUS decision and leveraged the IRS to "fix" it.

 

[What if...?]

But that is just conjecture on your part and a willingness to cover for people on your side of the political spectrum. If this was the Bush Whitehouse and the situation were reversed you would be singing a different tune and you know it. So you lack credibility. Sorry.

You're wrong.

I voted for McCain years ago over campaign finance reform.

I would suppoet ANYONE who stripped anonymity from our politics.!

 

[What if...?]

You know how potentially damning this sitiation is based on the lefts continued mitigations and attempts to divert away from the real issue.

They want this all to disappear and fast.

Whether they like it or not Lois Lerner's continued refusal to answer questions looks bad Politically and not only for Obama, but for the Democrats in general and in a election year no less.


According to them this is a bunch of contirived GOP motivated BS with Issa as the the bad guy. Oh and Lerner exercising her right not to incriminate herself is absolutley irrelevent.

The problem with that is Lerner could make all of this go away easily AND make Issa and the GOP look like a bunch of partisan motivated bullies in the process by just aswering the questions.


If there is nothing behind the charges of Obama's use of the IRS to target Conservatives then wouldn't the wise strategy employ truth and full disclosure instead of obfuscating ?

Thd left wants us to think the Democrats are passing up a golden oppurtuntiy here.

Think about the implications of shutting down this investigation in a election year. The Democrats would be able to expand upon a victory over Issa and the GOP for the next 8 months.

But thats not whats happening.

Lerner and the Democrats are making sure this issue stays alive and theyre making sure that these charges of unprecedented corruption continue to go on unanswered.

There is only one explanation for Lerners continued refusal to amswer questions and most objective Americans know that it has nothing to do with the person asking them.

Yet no offer of immunity.

 

[US Conservative]

But that is just conjecture on your part and a willingness to cover for people on your side of the political spectrum. If this was the Bush Whitehouse and the situation were reversed you would be singing a different tune and you know it. So you lack credibility. Sorry.

Absolutely.

Imagine:
-Bush suppressing his political opponents by setting the IRS on them.
-Letting an American ambassador and other Americans get killed on 9/11, by Al Qaieda, while he was campaigning for re-election, and then covering up what they knew about.
-Spying on nearly every Americans phone calls and emails
-Investigating and threatening journalists.

It would be the end of days, but since its a democrat-they have the balls to defend it.

 

[Boo Radley]

Absolutely.

Imagine:
-Bush suppressing his political opponents by setting the IRS on them.
-Letting an American ambassador and other Americans get killed on 9/11, by Al Qaieda, while he was campaigning for re-election, and then covering up what they knew about.
-Spying on nearly every Americans phone calls and emails
-Investigating and threatening journalists.

It would be the end of days, but since its a democrat-they have the balls to defend it.

Ask the Amish about Bush. Then you won't have to imagine.

 

[Erod]

Why is belief the criteria? Shouldn't evidence be?

She has no interest in providing the evidence. Cummings is diverting attention from that and trying to change the story to Issa. Instructions from up high, I have not the slightest doubt.

 

[Somerville]

Any official attached to the IRS is the government. The IRS and NSA and ATF are the greatest opponents of liberty this country has. Put them all in the ground and call in a dozer.

This is a perfect example which shows that not every person is actually following the story. Ms Lerner resigned last year, therefore she WAS a government official. Today she IS NOT a government official.

 

[justabubba]

She has no interest in providing the evidence. Cummings is diverting attention from that and trying to change the story to Issa. Instructions from up high, I have not the slightest doubt.

but your boy, issa, insisted otherwise. just look at the thread title and see
let's watch him fail to offer the emails he says he has which he insisted was the basis for his allegation

 

[Somerville]

Absolutely.

Imagine:
-Bush suppressing his political opponents by setting the IRS on them.
-Letting an American ambassador and other Americans get killed on 9/11, by Al Qaieda, while he was campaigning for re-election, and then covering up what they knew about.
-Spying on nearly every Americans phone calls and emails
-Investigating and threatening journalists.

It would be the end of days, but since its a democrat-they have the balls to defend it.

Bush DID use the IRS against political opponents

Bush did 'let' 3000 be killed on 9/11 by ignoring warnings while he was on vacation

The spying on Americans did take place while Bush was in the White House

Bush people did out an undercover CIA agent

 

[US Conservative]

Bush DID use the IRS against political opponents

Bush did 'let' 3000 be killed on 9/11 by ignoring warnings while he was on vacation

The spying on Americans did take place while Bush was in the White House

Bush people did out an undercover CIA agent

So what you are admitting here is Obama is worse than Bush. Agreed.

 

[Boo Radley]

She has no interest in providing the evidence. Cummings is diverting attention from that and trying to change the story to Issa. Instructions from up high, I have not the slightest doubt.

Which is meaningless. Evidence should still be the criteria and not anyone's belief. Without conclusive evidence, only a fool has no room for doubt.

 

[Somerville]

So what you are admitting here is Obama is worse than Bush. Agreed.

WOW!!

That is some response there... I honestly do not comprehend how you made that assumption. That is some strange 'thinking'

IMO, there are actions Obama has undertaken that I see as no better than those of past Presidents. I do not however see him as being worse than any past President - obviously opinions vary but your response to my post requires some rather convoluted definitions of several words, definitions not found to be of common usage.

 

[Fletch]

Bush DID use the IRS against political opponents

Prove it.

 

[What if...?]

The "IRS thing" is the intentional harassment and delay of conservative 501(c)(4) applications in the run up to the 2012 election. Just because you haven't been listening doesn't mean people haven't been very specifically clear as to what the IRS "thing" is.

Or an attempt to deal with abuse of 501(c)(4) status.

It would look the same to you.

 

[Somerville]

Prove it.

When the IRS targeted liberals
“I wish there was more GOP interest when I raised the same issue during the Bush administration, where they audited a progressive church in my district in what look liked a very selective way,” California Democratic Rep. Adam Schiff said on MSNBC Monday. “I found only one Republican, [North Carolina Rep. Walter Jones], that would join me in calling for an investigation during the Bush administration. I’m glad now that the GOP has found interest in this issue and it ought to be a bipartisan concern.”

The well-known church, All Saints Episcopal in Pasadena, became a bit of a cause célèbre on the left after the IRS threatened to revoke the church’s tax-exempt status over an anti-Iraq War sermon the Sunday before the 2004 election. “Jesus [would say], ‘Mr. President, your doctrine of preemptive war is a failed doctrine,’” rector George Regas said from the dais.

September 2006

IRS Ends 2-Year Probe Of NAACP's Tax Status

 

[Fletch]

September 2006

Bush was behind this?

 

[Grant]

Prove it.

There is no proof. Another leftist will pick up what's been said as being the truth, repeat it, and so it spreads among the Leftist community, like Herpes.

 

[Kobie]

There is no proof. Another leftist will pick up what's been said as being the truth, repeat it, and so it spreads among the Leftist community, like Herpes.

Proof was posted in this very thread. You don't know what you're talking about.