Lindsey: Trump Did Nothing Wrong in His Own Mind.

[veritas1]

Liberals do more work to push social safety nets than conservatives do. This is objective fact. You’re being absurd.

Yea, really working great out in CA. The same people overseeing and allowing the homeless epidemic there, have no room whatever to criticize others.

 

[veritas1]

I can't imagine why.

Of course you can't. It's the same reason you won't actually debate anything.

 

[AProudLefty]

Yea, really working great out in CA. The same people overseeing and allowing the homeless epidemic there, have no room whatever to criticize others.

You used the homeless to prove your point? :roll:

 

[JackA]

Nonsense. If Trump holding up aid for 8 weeks was impeachable, how about Obama offering none for 8 years, including while Crimea was invaded. I know, I know, that's different. That's Obama.

It's different because Obama was President, not Congress.

 

[veritas1]

You used the homeless to prove your point? :roll:

When liberals are grossly failing to address the issue in CA and then turning around and making moral judgments of conservatives, it should be pointed out.

 

[veritas1]

It's different because Obama was President, not Congress.

If Schiff is so sensitive about us helping Ukraine to defend itself against Russia, where was he while Obama was POTUS and Crimea was invaded? He was nowhere because he doesn't care in the slightest about Ukraine, only about attacking Trump.

 

[AProudLefty]

When liberals are grossly failing to address the issue in CA and then turning around and making moral judgments of conservatives, it should be pointed out.

And vice versa.

 

[JackA]

If Schiff is so sensitive about us helping Ukraine to defend itself against Russia, where was he while Obama was POTUS and Crimea was invaded? He was nowhere because he doesn't care in the slightest about Ukraine, only about attacking Trump.

I don't know what Schiff did and I doubt you do, but the congressman's personal feelings about Ukraine then or now couldn't be more beside the point. Then, again, deflection is what you guys do.

 

[Chomsky]

We have the wealthiest country in history and can't figure out how to get tens of thousands of people off the streets, especially the mentally ill and drug addicted? Really? This has nothing to do with housing prices. It has to do with government being pro-active and helping not only the homeless but those who have had their communities destroyed by them. If we need to build treatment centers, institutions, whatever it is, then we should do it. Take some of the money wasted in Iraq, Afghanistan or Syria and solve this mess.

If you believe this is a bipartisan issue, then I may be with you here. But if you're characterizing these social ills as being a "Liberal or Democratic problem", I don't see that at all. There's more homeless in cities because housing is higher and city streets are more habitable than country highways. But poverty, mental illness, and addiction are nationwide problems.

Sadly, poverty is going to increase as technology and the global employment market-place continues to take away American menial, labor, and factory jobs. Unfortunately, there is no way to turn back. We can skew things a bit, but we're not going to stop technology, eschew capitalism, or stop free-market economics.

Our only choice in the future may be to expand social programs, or except higher levels of poverty. And I say this as a committed capitalist, though a capitalist that has a strong & generous social conscience.

And by "poverty" (above), I don't necessarily mean joblessness. This country is filled with working poor.

 

[Chomsky]

If they have to choose between the founders and Orange Jesus™, I guess there's really no question how it's gonna go.

The poster claims he was being sarcastic here, so who am I to pursue it?

 

[apdst]

Thankfully we don't base our system of laws on what the criminal perceives to be wrong.

Well, usually at least. Presidents named Donald Trump seem to be able to do whatever the hell they want while conservative America cheers.

Thankfully we don't base our justice system on anyone's perception.

 

[SCrider]

Being called stupid by people devoid of conscience, devoid respect for law, devoid of respect for tradition and generally opposed to everything normal, is something I prize. The more leftwingers call me names, the more I know I'm right. I'll start worrying when they ever agree with anything I say.

You have summed up Trump's presidency nicely here.

 

[Sandy Shanks]

Thankfully we don't base our system of laws on what the criminal perceives to be wrong.

Well, usually at least. Presidents named Donald Trump seem to be able to do whatever the hell they want while conservative America cheers.

Un-freaking-believable! Trump's lawyers are lying to the Senate. The truth is known even to Joe Sixpack and Mary Wonderful. How can the chief justice of the supreme court allow these lies?

Answer: The fix is in.

White House Counsel Pat Cipollone said, “The proceedings took place in the basement of the House of Representatives. Not even [House Intelligence Committee chair Adam] Schiff’s Republican colleagues were allowed into the SCIF”—the Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility where the interviews took place.

There was equal representation between the Democrats and Republicans.

Sekulow’s said Trump “was denied the right to cross-examine witnesses” during the House inquiry.

In fact, the White House declined to do so.

Mitch and the Senate Republicans are forgetting the American people will have the final say in this matter.

 

[Deuce]

Yea, really working great out in CA. The same people overseeing and allowing the homeless epidemic there, have no room whatever to criticize others.

"Homeless people still exist" is your rebuttal? Laughable.

 

[eman623]

To the bolded:

If the political will is there, then yes she should be impeached. It's all about political will, in other words the will of the People. Everything in our Constitution leads back to the People, with the People as the final arbiter.

Fair enough, but the people do not want Trump impeached. The latest aggregate RCP poll puts support for impeachment about a point lower than the opposition.

 

[independentusa]

FBI Director James Comey clearing Hillary Clinton of charges because she had no criminal intent.

Are you suggesting Comey was wrong since others have investigated Clinton for the same thing and found no wrong doing.

 

[independentusa]

I do dismiss it when the people using it have shown no concern over right or morals up to this point.

Oh, and your leader trump has shown he has any morals at all? I think not. And the GOP Senators that allow him off knowing what he has done will show they also have no morals. And pointing to the Dems is just a bad attemtp to deflect from trump and the GOP Senators. As I have often said, deflection is the tool used by either side when they do not have a logical argument and your messages make my point. Dismissed

 

[tres borrachos]

Lindsey Graham Bizarrely Defends Trump: 'He Did Nothing Wrong In His Mind' | HuffPost

This is a defense? Trump is to be understood, it seems, the way you would the craziest sort of lunatic, except that instead of putting him in an asylum we will let him continue to run the country.

Please, for the love of all that's good and holy, somebody exhume John McCain's remains and take Lindsey's brain and spine out of the casket to give back to him.

 

[Obscurity]

Pretty sure Dahmer didn't think he was doing anything wrong, til he was caught.

Ignorance of the law is no defense of it.

 

[veritas1]

I don't know what Schiff did and I doubt you do, but the congressman's personal feelings about Ukraine then or now couldn't be more beside the point. Then, again, deflection is what you guys do.

The whole basis of the case we've seen drone on the last few days is that we somehow betrayed Ukraine by holding up aid for 8 weeks. This conveniently ignores that the previous administration provided no lethal aid for 8 years, including while Crimea was being invaded by Putin. Were Republicans then accusing Democrats of being agents of Putin? Were Democrats holding Obama to account for providing no lethal aid? The answer to both questions is no.

 

[veritas1]

You have summed up Trump's presidency nicely here.

We know he upsets the America Last party.

 

[veritas1]

"Homeless people still exist" is your rebuttal? Laughable.

No, you can't read. People who aid and abet homelessness, as Democrats running LA, SF, Sea and Portland do, have no room whatsoever to make moral pronouncements of others. When they've cleaned up their own house, they can pipe up. Until then, they need to keep quiet.

 

[veritas1]

Oh, and your leader trump has shown he has any morals at all? I think not. And the GOP Senators that allow him off knowing what he has done will show they also have no morals. And pointing to the Dems is just a bad attemtp to deflect from trump and the GOP Senators. As I have often said, deflection is the tool used by either side when they do not have a logical argument and your messages make my point. Dismissed

Trump hasn't done a damn thing that is impeachable. This is simply a desperate attempt by a desperate party to remove a guy who is succeeding and who they cannot defeat at the polls. BTW, if you think that Trump engaged in a quid pro quo and, as such, should be removed, how about when Quid Pro Joe told the Ukrainians to call Obama if they didn't think he was in agreement on holding back the loan guarantees? That's a quid pro quo clear as day and, according to Biden, it had Obama's blessing. IOW, money already appropriated for Ukraine was used as a lever to get a specific action, namely the firing of Shokin. If Trump's phone call and brief hold up of aid is impeachable, then all the more so was Obama's extorting of Ukraine with taxpayer dollars.

 

[Chomsky]

Fair enough, but the people do not want Trump impeached. The latest aggregate RCP poll puts support for impeachment about a point lower than the opposition.

Perhaps. But they did vote the impeaching party in power in 2018.

 

[Evilroddy]

Nonsense. If Trump holding up aid for 8 weeks was impeachable, how about Obama offering none for 8 years, including while Crimea was invaded. I know, I know, that's different. That's Obama.

Veritas1:

It's not the holding up of the military aid alone. It is why President Trump withheld the military aid that matters. That delay was designed to benefit his chances of reelection by pushing for an investigation by Ukrainian authorities of one of his domestic political rivals, not to promote American interests abroad. That is the moral bankruptcy at the core of Mr. Trump's decision making in this matter. Your talk of morals ring hollow if you defend such self-serving behaviour. This was extortion/bribery to benefit Mr. Trump personally, and there was nothing moral or right about it.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.