Let's Talk about Christopher Columbus

[Redress]

Never has a man been so lost and so clueless as to think he was half-a-world away from his landing spot, and yet still be considered a hero for almost 600 years. Now, that is some mythical **** right there.

Ben Shapiro explained the truth about Columbus and indigenous people to me...



The sad part is that alot of people really believe basically what is in the video...

 

[Hawkeye10]

Co.umbus is a perfect example of how US History is generally distorted on almost every issue. He was a scumbag, no question about it. So why was he honored in our History/SocialStudies classes for so long? How many other examples of distorted history are there? S.O.P.. Standard Operating Procedure. I would recommend the History of the US, by Howard Zinn. Much closer to the truth.
/

The famous "It was the breadmakers who changed the world for the better" argument.....

Some people still go for that.

 

[FastPace]

You wanted to look at him as a man of his time, but in his time he was considered a monster. He did not hesitate to massacre Amerindians or rape some Amerindian children. He gave child sex slaves as gifts to his men.

Carjosse, he was considered a monster by whom, Christian Europeans?

I'm asking because I have done some (I'm no scholar by any means) reading on Amerindians back when the Europeans arrived. You are aware it was common practice among various Amerindian nations to rape girls, women, torture their captives. They would literally--not figuratively--fry little babies over camp fires as their screaming mothers watched.

Amerindians--at least in North America--routinely gave little girls as gifts to other Amerindian families (even white girls) after murdering the girl's entire family.

Many Amerindian nations were such savages they shocked the sensibilities of even Christian settlers who could be some pretty ruthless and cruel people themselves.

Also, Christopher Columbus did not reach Wisconsin or what is now Milwaukee. So, again, I ask you "Oh benevolent *America*," where the hell are the Amerindians in Milwaukee? Because according to the grand story in this thread, only Christopher Columbus, wiped out Amerindians in genocidal level. Then I should see Amerindians all over America.

There is literally no reason to celebrate the man, he accomplished something the Vikings did several centuries earlier as well as being a psychopath. You don't see Germany celebrating Hitler Day.

Why the hell should I respect the American flag, or the US Government, which wiped out Amerindians?

It was Columbus--not the Vikings--who awakened most of Europe up to the existence of the Americas.

I don't celebrate Columbus Day. You see... I'm not a dumb American constantly engaged in stirring fights. I let those that celebrate Columbus Day do so. I don't salute the US Flag either or hold my hand on my heart.

I have no problem with Amerindians having their own Federal "Amerindian Day" or whatever. I'm also not Italian. I'm half German-American and half black. Ethnically, I'm Black-American.

I'll have to read more on Columbus and make up *my own* mind. That's how I do things. I don't automatically let screaming liberals or screaming conservatives making me think what they think I ought think. Thus far, I regard Christopher Columbus as heroic as a sailor and explorer. Maybe as I read more on him years from now I may change my mind, or maybe I won't.

 

[calamity]

Ben Shapiro explained the truth about Columbus and indigenous people to me...



The sad part is that alot of people really believe basically what is in the video...

lol...yeah. There is no room in that myth for European people dying by age 35, being mange-riddled, illiterates who burned heretics at the stake, basically a bunch of superstitious imbeciles who cut down all their forests and poisoned all their water to the point where sailing off into the unknown horizon actually sounded better than staying put.

 

[Perotista]

Is that proof or evidence?

Really, I have no dog in the fight about Vikings reaching the Americas before Christopher Columbus. In other words, I'm not emotionally invested in it one way or the other. It is evident a bunch (not few) of people arrived in the Americas long before any Europeans. We call them various things like "Indians," "Amerindians," "First Nation" people.

Why stop with Christopher Columbus anyways? I mean listen to the official name of the USA: United States of America.

What or who could "America" refer to by the way? Probably not an Anglo-Saxon. And why the hell would Amerindians want to celebrate a flag celebrating "America" as opposed to the 6 Nations or the Vikings?

Most likely without Columbus there would be no United States of America. North and South America is named after Amerigo Vespucci.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amerigo_Vespucci

He got it right, he demonstrated that Brazil and the West Indies did not represent Asia's eastern outskirts as initially conjectured from Columbus' voyages, but instead constituted an entirely separate landmass hitherto unknown to people of the Old World.

The Vikings followed by Columbus were the first Europeans to discover America. There's a debate as to whom the first peopled Americas. The ones who came over the land bridge or the one's who sailed here from Polynesia and beyond. DNA, plants, animals seem now to favor the Polynesian. But it will be years, decades and maybe even more until our history text books will be changed. If they ever will be.

It's also believed the Chinese under Admiral Zhang He could have discovered America in 1421. The evidence is mounting for that. They drew maps and it is believed Columbus knew of these maps and may have had one prior to him leaving Spain.

All speculation, but there is evidence enough to cause the speculation.

 

[FastPace]

Co.umbus is a perfect example of how US History is generally distorted on almost every issue. He was a scumbag, no question about it. So why was he honored in our History/SocialStudies classes for so long? How many other examples of distorted history are there? S.O.P.. Standard Operating Procedure. I would recommend the History of the US, by Howard Zinn. Much closer to the truth.
/

My understanding is Italian-Americans lobbied to get him celebrated. Italians (particularly Italian-Americans) can be pretty proud of their ethnic groups history. Look... the United States actually named its country after an Italian: United States of America.

My understanding is that once upon a time the official name of the country was simply: United States.

Later "of America" was added. "America" being the continent (if you are French) or the continents (if you are a United Statesian).

I would have to double check if originally it was only the "United States." But I think I am remembering correctly.

 

[Diving Mullah]

Uh, Christopher Columbus believed that he had actually reached India. In fact, until the day he died, he never relented his belief that he had found India.

Actually No. His first landing was San Salvador (one the bahama's island). He knew this was not India, otherwise why call it and San Salvador. He also had indian Translators, which they had no freaking idea what the natives where talking about.

He famously wrote....Many of the men I have seen have scars on their bodies, and when I made signs to them to find out how this happened, they indicated that people from other nearby islands come to San Salvador to capture them; they defend themselves the best they can. I believe that people from the mainland come here to take them as slaves. They ought to make good and skilled servants, for they repeat very quickly whatever we say to them. I think they can very easily be made Christians, for they seem to have no religion. If it pleases our Lord, I will take six of them to Your Highnesses when I depart, in order that they may learn our language. I could conquer the whole of them with 50 men, and govern them as I pleased.

 

[calamity]

He proved the world wasn't flat.

That was Magellan. Columbus only sailed really far away. He never circumnavigated the earth.

 

[calamity]

Actually No. His first landing was San Salvador (one the bahama's island). He knew this was not India, otherwise why call it and San Salvador. He also had indian Translators, which they had no freaking idea what the natives where talking about.

He famously wrote....Many of the men I have seen have scars on their bodies, and when I made signs to them to find out how this happened, they indicated that people from other nearby islands come to San Salvador to capture them; they defend themselves the best they can. I believe that people from the mainland come here to take them as slaves. They ought to make good and skilled servants, for they repeat very quickly whatever we say to them. I think they can very easily be made Christians, for they seem to have no religion. If it pleases our Lord, I will take six of them to Your Highnesses when I depart, in order that they may learn our language. I could conquer the whole of them with 50 men, and govern them as I pleased.

Why do you think he called them Indians?

 

[Tigerace117]

Co.umbus is a perfect example of how US History is generally distorted on almost every issue. He was a scumbag, no question about it. So why was he honored in our History/SocialStudies classes for so long? How many other examples of distorted history are there? S.O.P.. Standard Operating Procedure. I would recommend the History of the US, by Howard Zinn. Much closer to the truth.
/

No, Howard Zinn wouldn't know the truth if it whacked him upside the head.

 

[KevinKohler]

Um that was pretty much a well known fact long before...

Christopher Columbus Never Set Out to Prove the Earth was Round - History in the Headlines

No one was willing to bet their lives on it though.

 

[Jack Hays]

Never has a man been so lost and so clueless as to think he was half-a-world away from his landing spot, and yet still be considered a hero for almost 600 years. Now, that is some mythical **** right there.

He was one of the most consequential human beings ever to live. Whether he was lost doesn't matter. He changed the world.

 

[calamity]

He was one of the most consequential human beings ever to live. Whether he was lost doesn't matter. He changed the world.

Oh, come on. Do you really believe that?

Someone would have found the Bahamas before 1500. It's not like Columbus was the only sailor floating around in the Atlantic.

 

[calamity]

No one was willing to bet their lives on it though.

Ever hear of the Vikings?

 

[apdst]

Happy Native American Day

Even the Indians came from somewhere else.

 

[Manc Skipper]

Even the Indians came from somewhere else.

Which planet are you from? Insensitivia? Or Insensibilia?

 

[Jack Hays]

Oh, come on. Do you really believe that?

Someone would have found the Bahamas before 1500. It's not like Columbus was the only sailor floating around in the Atlantic.

I absolutely believe that. Certainly someone, sometime, would have made the voyage, but they didn't and he did.

 

[apdst]

Which planet are you from? Insensitivia? Or Insensibilia?

I'm from the planet where I know how to spell "linguistic" and the Indians came from somewhere else. They engaged in tribal warfare, slavery, torture and genocide.

 

[mike2810]

Happy Native American Day

Science shows that Native Americans are not indigenous to what is now the USA.

"Prevailing ideas point to all Native Americans descending from ancient Siberians who moved across the*Beringia land bridge*between Asia and North America between 26,000 and 18,000 years ago. As time wore on, the thinking goes, these people spread southward and gave rise to the Native American populations encountered by European settlers centuries ago."
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/scie...-question-who-were-first-americans-180951469/

Makes me wonder how many who believe Columbus doesn't deserve a holiday, took the paid holiday anyway. Call in Native American day or indigenous people day if it makes you feel better.

 

[calamity]

I absolutely believe that. Certainly someone, sometime, would have made the voyage, but they didn't and he did.

John Cabot was right on Chris's heels. Columbus just lucked out and received his money from Freddy and Izzy before Cabot did from King Henry.

 

[Jack Hays]

John Cabot was right on Chris's heels. Columbus just lucked out and received his money from Freddy and Izzy before Cabot did from King Henry.

Cabot did not sail until after Columbus returned. Without Columbus there's no guarantee there would have been any money for Cabot. The life of Columbus was perhaps the most consequential between Mohammed and the present day.

 

[vegas giants]

Cabot did not sail until after Columbus returned. Without Columbus there's no guarantee there would have been any money for Cabot. The life of Columbus was perhaps the most consequential between Mohammed and the present day.

Pretty consequential for the people he enslaved

 

[Carjosse]

Most likely without Columbus there would be no United States of America. North and South America is named after Amerigo Vespucci.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amerigo_Vespucci

He got it right, he demonstrated that Brazil and the West Indies did not represent Asia's eastern outskirts as initially conjectured from Columbus' voyages, but instead constituted an entirely separate landmass hitherto unknown to people of the Old World.

The Vikings followed by Columbus were the first Europeans to discover America. There's a debate as to whom the first peopled Americas. The ones who came over the land bridge or the one's who sailed here from Polynesia and beyond. DNA, plants, animals seem now to favor the Polynesian. But it will be years, decades and maybe even more until our history text books will be changed. If they ever will be.

It's also believed the Chinese under Admiral Zhang He could have discovered America in 1421. The evidence is mounting for that. They drew maps and it is believed Columbus knew of these maps and may have had one prior to him leaving Spain.

All speculation, but there is evidence enough to cause the speculation.

The first explorer to actually find the coast of North America, which I would say contributed far more to the creation of the USA was John Cabot. He paved the way for British North America. He is well known in Canada.

 

[Winston]

Uh, Christopher Columbus believed that he had actually reached India. In fact, until the day he died, he never relented his belief that he had found India.

Sounds like someone else we all know and love.. that delusional SOB who thinks millions of illegals robbed him of the popular vote.

 

[Jack Hays]

The first explorer to actually find the coast of North America, which I would say contributed far more to the creation of the USA was John Cabot. He paved the way for British North America. He is well known in Canada.

Cabot did not sail until after Columbus returned. Without Columbus there might not have been a Cabot voyage.