Let’s Talk Predestination

[VySky]

John 7:39 tells us that the Spirit had not yet been given at the time of this parable……so not sure it would be blasphemy at this time

I have given the above some thought and turned to Matthew 13:11. Jesus was talking to his disciples. "For it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given."

Yet Jesus also chose which of those among the soils he would give the ability to understand such as those among the good soil.

We have another example of God's sovereignty in being selective on who he chooses. I think of his 12 disciples. Not one chose Jesus, he chose them.

Or when the Lord told Eli]ah in 1 Kings 9:18. "Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel, all the knees which have not bowed unto Baal, and every mouth which hath not kissed him."

These men did not choose God, he chose them. He left for himself the 7000 men.

 

[Metanoia]

We have another example of God's sovereignty in being selective on who he chooses. I think of his 12 disciples. Not one chose Jesus, he chose them.

Interesting that Peter was the first one that accepted the invitation eventually becoming the rock on which the church would be built. The invitation was the test that he passed by putting down the ‘net’….the net was his livelihood and net can also be understood as something that entraps something…..the willingness to give up these things and influences verified his worthiness…….

 

[VySky]

Interesting that Peter was the first one that accepted the invitation eventually becoming the rock on which the church would be built. The invitation was the test that he passed by putting down the ‘net’….the net was his livelihood and net can also be understood as something that entraps something…..the willingness to give up these things and influences verified his worthiness…….

And to the contrary when see in Matthew 19:21 Jesus saying

“If you want to be perfect,” Jesus said to him, “go, sell your belongings and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

And the man left unwilling to do what Jesus asked of him. He was tied to things of the flesh.

 

[LittleNipper]

And to the contrary when see in Matthew 19:21 Jesus saying

“If you want to be perfect,” Jesus said to him, “go, sell your belongings and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

And the man left unwilling to do what Jesus asked of him. He was tied to things of the flesh.

The reality here is that JESUS was demonstrating to this young ruler, that he cannot do enough to please GOD.
Matthew 19:16-26
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (SO, is JESUS not GOOD or is JESUS saying in a round-about way, "Do you believe me to be GOD?"

18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?

21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.

24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."

 

[Metanoia]

The reality here is that JESUS was demonstrating to this young ruler, that he cannot do enough to please GOD.
Matthew 19:16-26
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (SO, is JESUS not GOOD or is JESUS saying in a round-about way, "Do you believe me to be GOD?"

18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?

21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.

24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

There is a great lesson here……when the young man asked which commandments to keep Jesus cited 6 of the 10 commandments as the criteria. The neglected commandments were specifically about religion…..this ommission by Jesus tells us that they are irrelevant in attaining eternal life. The young man was too hasty in stating that he obeyed the 6. The first 5 could be answered affirmatively….. but how could he answer the 6th ?. What does it mean to love your neighbor as thyself ? One is guilty of being a hypocrite if he answers without understanding. The young man was unwilling to give up his possessions and his attachments…..love of money and attachments leads to a bad end. One should consider whether religion can be viewed as an attachment……some seem to think so convinced that their church is the ‘right’ one. This has been a trap for many religions.

 

[LittleNipper]

There is a great lesson here……when the young man asked which commandments to keep Jesus cited 6 of the 10 commandments as the criteria. The neglected commandments were specifically about religion…..this ommission by Jesus tells us that they are irrelevant in attaining eternal life. The young man was too hasty in stating that he obeyed the 6. The first 5 could be answered affirmatively….. but how could he answer the 6th ?. What does it mean to love your neighbor as thyself ? One is guilty of being a hypocrite if he answers without understanding. The young man was unwilling to give up his possessions and his attachments…..love of money and attachments leads to a bad end. One should consider whether religion can be viewed as an attachment……some seem to think so convinced that their church is the ‘right’ one. This has been a trap for many religions.

It would seem that rather than call the rich young man a liar, JESUS was gently allowing this young man to realize his own inability to keep any of the law. Had he ever sassed his parents in anyway as a child? Had this individual ever take a second or third look at someone of the opposite sex? Could he have gotten a playmate in trouble by bending the truth (even just a bit)? Did he "borrow" that cookie? He never wished someone dead? This young man clearly felt that he was short in his behavior somehow. And now think ----- JESUS says, "Why do you call me good? For only GOD is good." Could JESUS, in knowing what this man would ask, be giving a friendly warning that GOD knows what you do and don't do. And so do I because I fit that mold!

 

[Metanoia]

My point of focus was Jesus’ dismissal of the first four commandments…..

 

[LittleNipper]

My point of focus was Jesus’ dismissal of the first four commandments…..

I don't believe JESUS dismissed anything. The rich young man was Jewish and JESUS knew his heart.

 

[Metanoia]

I don't believe JESUS dismissed anything. The rich young man was Jewish and JESUS knew his heart.

My translation did not have any of the first 4 Commandments…….if you have a different version please share it….

 

[LittleNipper]

My translation did not have any of the first 4 Commandments…….if you have a different version please share it….

JESUS didn't mention them because as a JEW, the rich young man would have already been WELL aware of them. Some things are obvious and some things take a little concentration on one's part. Again, JESUS being GOD was well aware of what this individual's problem was, and it starts the moment he said, "WHAT GOOD THING MUST I DO." And JESUS is informing HIM that, "There is nothing good enough that you can do to save YOURSELF."

 

[VySky]

2 Timothy 1:9​

“Who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.

Grace before time began. This verse emphasizes that God’s purpose and grace were given to believers in Christ Jesus before time began, highlighting the eternal nature of God’s plan.

Romans 9:11​

“(For the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls).”

God’s purpose in election. This verse explains that God’s choice and election are based on His purpose and calling, not on human works or merit, underscoring divine sovereignty.

John 15:16​

“You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you.”

Chosen and appointed by Jesus. This verse emphasizes that Jesus chose and appointed His disciples to bear lasting fruit, indicating divine selection and purpose.

2 Thessalonians 2:13​

“But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.”

Chosen for salvation. This verse emphasizes that believers were chosen by God from the beginning for salvation, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and faith in the truth.

1 Thessalonians 1:4​

“Knowing, beloved brethren, your election by God.”

Assurance of election. This verse expresses confidence in the believers’ election by God, providing assurance of their chosen status and divine calling.

30 Powerful Bible Verses About Predestination (With Explanation) - Bible Study For You

Predestination is a profound and sometimes complex theological concept that deals with God's foreknowledge and sovereign will in determining the destiny of

biblestudyforyou.com