Is "gypsy" a slur?

[justabubba]

It's not an individual decision. It's a social thing. From the slur we get "gyped", or cheated, a pejorative based on the slur for Romani.

gypped is to gypsy as jewed is to jew

then, if gypsy is a slur why not the term jew?

 

[ecofarm]

gypped is to gypsy as jewed is to jew

then, if gypsy is a slur why not the term jew?

The Jewish pejorative is not derived from a slur. If it was it'd be 'kiked' or 'hymied', if I remember such slang correctly. That's what 'gyped' is.

 

[spud_meister]

gypped is to gypsy as jewed is to jew

then, if gypsy is a slur why not the term jew?

Because Jew is the preferred denonym for Jewish people, gypsy is not the preferred term for Romani.

 

[ecofarm]

Because Jew is the preferred denonym for Jewish people, gypsy is not the preferred term for Romani.

Preferred being self identified.

 

[Slingshot Bob]

Because Jew is the preferred denonym for Jewish people, gypsy is not the preferred term for Romani.

Some years ago, in Fl (some jewish group, I would think) had the JewFish (a large grouper) officially renamed as the Goliath grouper.

No word yet on the whiting, whitefish, red fish, black drum.

 

[justabubba]

The Jewish pejorative is not derived from a slur. If it was it'd be 'kiked' or 'hymied', if I remember such slang correctly. That's what 'gyped' is.

if i understand your post, you are telling us that gypsy (d)evolved from the expression gypped

not according to dictionary.com:
gypsy

1505-15; back formation of gipcyan, aphetic variant of Egyptian, from a belief that Gypsies came originally from Egypt

gyp

"to cheat, swindle," 1889, American English, probably derived from the colloquial shortening of Gypsy (cf. gip). Related: Gypped. As a noun, "fraudulent action, a cheat," by 1914.

Gypsy | Define Gypsy at Dictionary.com
Gypped | Define Gypped at Dictionary.com

which then tells us my previous post ws correct. gypped evolved from gypsy
and if that causes gypsy to become an inappropriate expression
why is jew, the basis for the slur jewed, not also found to be an inappropriate expression

 

[ecofarm]

if i understand your post, you are telling us that gypsy (d)evolved from the expression gypped

No, the other way, of course.

 

[justabubba]

No, the other way, of course.

then i go back to my original response to your explanation (see below):

if gypped is an inappropriate term, causing gypsy to then be found inappropriate
and jewed is found inappropriate, then why is the base term, jew, still found acceptable


here was that referenced explanation:

It's not an individual decision. It's a social thing. From the slur we get "gyped", or cheated, a pejorative based on the slur for Romani.

allow me to use your expression for a comparison:

From the slur we get "jewed", or cheated, a pejorative based on the slur for jew

there is no apparent logic in your comparison

 

[ecofarm]

then i go back to my original response to your explanation:

if gypped is an inappropriate term, causing gypsy to then be found inappropriate

No.

1. Gypsy is a slur, always has been. It wasn't generally seen as such some years ago.
2. Gypped is a pejorative referring to Romani and is based on a slur.

and jewed is found inappropriate, then why is the base term, jew, still found acceptable

Jewed is a pejorative referring to Jews but is not based on a slur.


One easy way to identify a slur is ask "who self identifies as such". If the answer is "no one", it's probably a slur. Romani don't call themselves Gypsies, just like Inuits didn't call themselves Eskimos (also a slur assigned by outsiders). We call people what they call themselves, not what outsiders derogatorily called them.

 

[Medusa]

I didn't realize that some people consider it a slur. Even when you use it to describe yourself, people have said that it's awful to even say the word "gypsy". I thought when someone describe themselves that way it just meant they were very carefree, kind of a hippie, bohemian, etc.

What do you all think?

Yes and people usually know it is used to insult people ,you cant say you dont know about it

 

[calamity]

I didn't realize that some people consider it a slur. Even when you use it to describe yourself, people have said that it's awful to even say the word "gypsy". I thought when someone describe themselves that way it just meant they were very carefree, kind of a hippie, bohemian, etc.

What do you all think?

I'm cool with the term, have been referring to myself as one for decades, but yes. Some people see it as a slur.

 

[Bum]

I didn't realize that some people consider it a slur. Even when you use it to describe yourself, people have said that it's awful to even say the word "gypsy". I thought when someone describe themselves that way it just meant they were very carefree, kind of a hippie, bohemian, etc.

What do you all think?

I think the preferred words are Rom, Romani, or the slightly less used "traveler".

Ask if you don't know for sure.....there are always going to be some offended while others wont even blink an eye.

 

[JANFU]

What he said made perfect sense. gypped/gypsy -- jewed/Jew. Gypsy a slur, but Jew isn't?

Not Jew, but Jewed is, If you read the link I posted it is clear as day

 

[slowhawk]

I named my first dog Gypsy. An Irish Setter that the police picked up as a stray. I thought the name fit her very well and she seemed to like it.

 

[justabubba]

Yes and people usually know it is used to insult people ,you cant say you dont know about it

i certainly was unaware of that
but then my adult children had to admonish my use of "oriental", to instead be referenced as "asian"
so, what is the acceptable/peecee expression one is expected to use for those itinerant people some of us referred to as "gypsies"

 

[JANFU]

gypped is to gypsy as jewed is to jew

then, if gypsy is a slur why not the term jew?

I would say context- Jewed is without doubt a slur.
Now if I was asked a question ref a person- what religion is he? Jew/Jewish. If asked how he is when doing business on price - answers- be careful as he will Jew you. Last is using the word as a slur

 

[Fearandloathing]

You should probably ask someone who belongs to that ethnic group or someone who knows people who do as to whether or not that particular word is offensive to them or considered a slur. I generally do not like it when people decide to take vicarious offense on behalf of others when such protection was never asked for, and I am given to distrust such presumptuousness. But I am not going to give some kind of validation and tell you "Hey, there's nothing offensive using that word! Go nuts!" because that would be equally presumptuous of me.

Part of the "new" politically correct.

What amuses me? No one has a problem with Polish Jokes; demeaning in the extreme, suggesting sub human level of intelligence and body care, but EVERYBODY tells them....except Poles.

Odd

 

[jimbo]

I didn't realize that some people consider it a slur. Even when you use it to describe yourself, people have said that it's awful to even say the word "gypsy". I thought when someone describe themselves that way it just meant they were very carefree, kind of a hippie, bohemian, etc.

What do you all think?

My mother considered it a slur. Apparently back in her day gypsies roamed the Nebraska countryside in covered wagons looting and stealing as they went. Would even steal home made pies off window sills. And your daughters for brides.

My mom had a lot of strange ideas.

Not too many years ago I remember reading something about shoddy contractors, the ones who show up at your door with a half load of asphalt left over from your neighbor's job offering a discount for a paving job. These too were labeled gypsies.

Apparently a lot of people considered it a slur.

 

[Fearandloathing]

I didn't realize that some people consider it a slur. Even when you use it to describe yourself, people have said that it's awful to even say the word "gypsy". I thought when someone describe themselves that way it just meant they were very carefree, kind of a hippie, bohemian, etc.

What do you all think?

I have never thought of "Gypsy" as a nationality, but a life style.

The people who are called Gypsy actually originate in the North Indian sub continent. Recently the prime minister of India declared that "Gypies" were children of India; making a specific reference to their Arab counterparts the "Dom" people often mistaken for and treated as "Romani"

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Yes and people usually know it is used to insult people ,you cant say you dont know about it

In North America it is not always associated with an insult. I would hazard a guess in that 50% of North Americans would associate the term gypsy with people who travel a lot with no fixed address for extended periods of time.

There are very few Romani in North America, and if someone mentioned they knew a gypsy I would generally not expect them to mean a Romani

 

[Medusa]

In North America it is not always associated with an insult. I would hazard a guess in that 50% of North Americans would associate the term gypsy with people who travel a lot with no fixed address for extended periods of time.

There are very few Romani in North America, and if someone mentioned they knew a gypsy I would generally not expect them to mean a Romani

Tell it to the other north americans who agree with me .

 

[Medusa]

i certainly was unaware of that
but then my adult children had to admonish my use of "oriental", to instead be referenced as "asian"
so, what is the acceptable/peecee expression one is expected to use for those itinerant people some of us referred to as "gypsies"

People just want to insult them by calling them gypsy and they feel insulted when called gypsy but 'roman' is used to refer to them .

Oriental is a nice name in my opinion

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

Tell it to the other north americans who agree with me .

For something to be an insult it would require two things,

Knowledge it was an insult, and the intent to use it as an insult. I expect less than 5 % of North Americans have ever met a Romani, but will have direct experience with people who lead a gypsy lifestyle (with many self proclaimed ) In those cases it is not known to be an insult, nor is their an intent for it to be an insult. In fact for these cases it is more of a positive word than negative.


If however they knew the word to be an insult when regarding the Romani and used when regarding the Romani, the intent would be to insult.


Words do have multiple meaning, some can be positive and some can be negative. It is how they are being used and the intent for the usage of the word

 

[Medusa]

For something to be an insult it would require two things,

Knowledge it was an insult, and the intent to use it as an insult. I expect less than 5 % of North Americans have ever met a Romani, but will have direct experience with people who lead a gypsy lifestyle (with many self proclaimed ) In those cases it is not known to be an insult, nor is their an intent for it to be an insult. In fact for these cases it is more of a positive word than negative.


If however they knew the word to be an insult when regarding the Romani and used when regarding the Romani, the intent would be to insult.


Words do have multiple meaning, some can be positive and some can be negative. It is how they are being used and the intent for the usage of the word

my god ,I know and it is used as a negative word in many parts of the world

 

[justabubba]

I would say context- Jewed is without doubt a slur.
Now if I was asked a question ref a person- what religion is he? Jew/Jewish. If asked how he is when doing business on price - answers- be careful as he will Jew you. Last is using the word as a slur

i agree with that
what i was writing in opposition to was eco's position that because 'gypped' was a slur, it's base word, 'gypsy', must also be a slur
however, i did not see that connection relative to the slur 'jewed' and the accepted 'jew' reference
essentially, what i was asking is "what's the difference?"