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I actually agree with Kamala Harris on something.

Mental health professionals are getting paid cause those patients don't have the capital to give to them.

Nope, that is what Harris wants to have enacted into law. There is no such legal right to have your bills paid by the general public.
 
Precisely because CA has become a "crazy-magnet". Why should folks in TX, OH or NE be forced to fund mental health facilities in "crazy-magnet" CA?

There are always going to be x number of people who need this help.

Unless the US divides into 50 (or more) separate countries, it's a national problem.

California not breeding them as much as attracting them; you're going to pay one way or the other.

:shrug:
 
There are always going to be x number of people who need this help.

Unless the US divides into 50 (or more) separate countries, it's a national problem.

California not breeding them as much as attracting them; you're going to pay one way or the other.

:shrug:

Perhaps, but the crazy folks in CA don't cost me (living in Texas) anything now.
 
It is more disturbing to me that such state government mismanagement is said to deserve a federal reward.

State government mismanagement is real in Cali to be sure.

But the homeless/crazy?

The national affordable housing crisis is all too real.

Even Warren's 3.2 million plan would be a drop in the bucket, and it's not happening.

California weather = Very nice

The crazy/homeless = Love California

If you solved the Cali homeless/crazy problem overnight, you know what you'd have the next morning?

A huge Cali homeless/crazy problem.
 
Addressing the core issues that deal with mental health such as drug addiction, post traumatic stress or psychological trauma caused by death, emotional abuse, or sexual abuse won't be solved by increasing the numbers of beds in mental health facilities. Russia has dealt with mental health by providing shelter for mentally ill people in Russia. We found out how well that worked during the Soviet Union days when there had been an increase of the bed numbers because psychiatric services had been used to treat dissidents.

Mental health has always been a very low priority in the health care system in Russia. It may surprise some people but according to the WHO (World Health Organization) -- in developed countries, around 66% of people with mental disorders do not receive treatment, but in developing countries this figure reaches 90%. Those are pretty stunning statistics.

Adding beds, then adding more beds to that adding of beds equals what? It equals a lot of mentally ill people being sheltered in sub-standard institutions or long term care facilities that will further drain the resources of our State and Federal government. I've worked in mental health and there is a population of unfortunate people that were born with mental deficiencies and are unable to live on their own but there is a much greater population of mentally ill people who are just not given access to free, or at least affordable, mental health care. This is where we fail as a country, it has nothing to do with numbers of beds for mentally ill.

I'm old and can speak from personal experience because I've been to a mental institution. My first time was when I was a Girl Scout and our 'troop' was taken on a day trip to a mental institution. We were all carrying little gifts to hand out to 'patients' there. I have to say, it was possibly one of the worst memories of my childhood. The photo below was taken in a mental hospital in Ohio during the 1950's. Those State-run mental hospitals were all over the country. They were nothing more than holding bins for people that society wanted to be shielded from, hidden from view. Nearly all mental hospitals are nonexistent in the U.S., for good reason. By adding more beds, and/or opening up State or Federally run 'institutions', aren't we just going backwards in mental health care?

893f43aed651fb666b5f4e41ba01c02d.jpg

Some good comments.

But the intractably ill are just that, and all you can do is keep them safe, warm and fed.

Kamala = Monster, but she's right
 
Nope, that is what Harris wants to have enacted into law. There is no such legal right to have your bills paid by the general public.

Intractable and/or severe mental illness = Real

National affordable housing crisis = Real

:(
 
Nope, that is what Harris wants to have enacted into law. There is no such legal right to have your bills paid by the general public.

I mixed up my words. I was stating that there is no money in it for the health care professionals to provide their expertise to help the mentally ill. So Kamala wants to put tax payers money into those doctors bank accounts to see if they can treat more patients. Cause I think you will agree here that the mental health illnesses are increasing in this country rapidly. Maybe a study could be done to see if treatment by doctors is a cheaper way to spend tax money then the tax we spend on homeless and emergency service, Fire dept, police, etc.
 
I mixed up my words. I was stating that there is no money in it for the health care professionals to provide their expertise to help the mentally ill. So Kamala wants to put tax payers money into those doctors bank accounts to see if they can treat more patients. Cause I think you will agree here that the mental health illnesses are increasing in this country rapidly. Maybe a study could be done to see if treatment by doctors is a cheaper way to spend tax money then the tax we spend on homeless and emergency service, Fire dept, police, etc.

Those are all good ideas and should be addressed at the state government level. Perhaps, with up to 50 attempts to find a working solution, this problem could be better managed.
 
Addressing the core issues that deal with mental health such as drug addiction, post traumatic stress or psychological trauma caused by death, emotional abuse, or sexual abuse won't be solved by increasing the numbers of beds in mental health facilities. Russia has dealt with mental health by providing shelter for mentally ill people in Russia. We found out how well that worked during the Soviet Union days when there had been an increase of the bed numbers because psychiatric services had been used to treat dissidents.

Mental health has always been a very low priority in the health care system in Russia. It may surprise some people but according to the WHO (World Health Organization) -- in developed countries, around 66% of people with mental disorders do not receive treatment, but in developing countries this figure reaches 90%. Those are pretty stunning statistics.

Adding beds, then adding more beds to that adding of beds equals what? It equals a lot of mentally ill people being sheltered in sub-standard institutions or long term care facilities that will further drain the resources of our State and Federal government. I've worked in mental health and there is a population of unfortunate people that were born with mental deficiencies and are unable to live on their own but there is a much greater population of mentally ill people who are just not given access to free, or at least affordable, mental health care. This is where we fail as a country, it has nothing to do with numbers of beds for mentally ill.

I'm old and can speak from personal experience because I've been to a mental institution. My first time was when I was a Girl Scout and our 'troop' was taken on a day trip to a mental institution. We were all carrying little gifts to hand out to 'patients' there. I have to say, it was possibly one of the worst memories of my childhood. The photo below was taken in a mental hospital in Ohio during the 1950's. Those State-run mental hospitals were all over the country. They were nothing more than holding bins for people that society wanted to be shielded from, hidden from view. Nearly all mental hospitals are nonexistent in the U.S., for good reason. By adding more beds, and/or opening up State or Federally run 'institutions', aren't we just going backwards in mental health care?

893f43aed651fb666b5f4e41ba01c02d.jpg

But in all of that, I didn’t see a solution offered up. Thus, we are stuck in neutral. The other issue is we lack the constitutional power we need to get it done.

You no doubt know about the ACLU suing California in the 70’s alleging warehousing as you describe. The agreement was to let out those “who could function with a minimum of supervision”. Well, the releases happened and the supervision didn’t. I worked at the Capitol at that time and the craziest were still walking among us. Many were murdered on the street. Crazy + crazy never ends well.

The other issue is diluting the drug laws regarding possession and being under the influence of narcotics**. We need to be tougher so we can offer diversion programs, etc.

I appreciate your expertise, but the state have to work within the framework we are given.

** You may want take a gander at this:
The Los Angeles District Attorneys Association Warns Public About Soros-Backed Candidates - California Globe

This doesn’t help.
 
But in all of that, I didn’t see a solution offered up. Thus, we are stuck in neutral. The other issue is we lack the constitutional power we need to get it done.

You no doubt know about the ACLU suing California in the 70’s alleging warehousing as you describe. The agreement was to let out those “who could function with a minimum of supervision”. Well, the releases happened and the supervision didn’t. I worked at the Capitol at that time and the craziest were still walking among us. Many were murdered on the street. Crazy + crazy never ends well.

The other issue is diluting the drug laws regarding possession and being under the influence of narcotics**. We need to be tougher so we can offer diversion programs, etc.

I appreciate your expertise, but the state have to work within the framework we are given.

** You may want take a gander at this:
The Los Angeles District Attorneys Association Warns Public About Soros-Backed Candidates - California Globe

This doesn’t help.

My point is that adding more beds will not resolve the growing mental illness epidemic. Only government and state funded programs which focus on treating depression and other mental health disorders, as well as changing behaviors that lead to chronic illnesses and untimely deaths will do anything to address this problem.

Children with depression and autism, ethnic minorities and older adults with chronic illnesses that are living at 100% below the poverty level are going un-diagnosed and subsequently untreated. People in rural areas and veterans are going untreated. It's all because of lack of resources and it's the obligation of the U.S. government to step up to provide those resources.
 
OK, but why is that a federal government responsibility?

I tend to think it is

IF

mental patients are roaming the streets homeless.

No one else takes care of them. some have no family at all.
 
here's the problem though:

Harris doesn't like Catholics, doesn't think they can be good judges (said as much in reference to Kavanaugh & probably others)

so she could possibly come up with some policy whereby Catholics would be denied mental health care.

Vote for T r u m p

:)
 
I tend to think it is

IF

mental patients are roaming the streets homeless.

No one else takes care of them. some have no family at all.

Are those streets not in states, counties and cities? What absolves the state/local governments of any responsibility?
 
Are those streets not in states, counties and cities? What absolves the state/local governments of any responsibility?

nothing.

things should always start at the local level. But what if the local yocals don't do anything?

I think it is a shame people don't take care of their own family members.. just bc said family members don't agree w/ them about this or that or whatever..

The most local place to begin is the family. Maybe it should be a crime to not let your troubled adult child return home when in need?

sounds good to me

govt should not be involved unless absolutely necessary.
 
nothing.

things should always start at the local level. But what if the local yocals don't do anything?

I think it is a shame people don't take care of their own family members.. just bc said family members don't agree w/ them about this or that or whatever..

The most local place to begin is the family. Maybe it should be a crime to not let your troubled adult child return home when in need?

sounds good to me

govt should not be involved unless absolutely necessary.

Hmm... is the failure to do anything about a problem cause for a federal reward? Once we start using the federal government to reward the failure of lower levels of government then we are in deep trouble as a nation.
 
Of all the Dem candidates, she's certainly not my favorite, but her idea of expanding treatment of mental health issues is a good one. Multiple lives could be saved by this.

Kamala Harris proposes doubling mental health treatment beds



I remember when Reagan was governor of California. He slashed budget for mental health hospitals in half, which caused a big surge in homelessness.

Hasn't recovered since. So, good idea on her part. Much needed. Will greatly reduce homelessness, but have to deal with the ACLU to sweep crazies off the street an into the hospitals. But, as an issue one of public health danger, I say damn rights and put them in hospitals for treatment, and clean up the streets, as much as it can be done. Of course, not all homeless are mentally ill, but a lot of them are.
 
I remember when Reagan was governor of California. He slashed budget for mental health hospitals in half, which caused a big surge in homelessness.

Hasn't recovered since. So, good idea on her part. Much needed. Will greatly reduce homelessness, but have to deal with the ACLU to sweep crazies off the street an into the hospitals. But, as an issue one of public health danger, I say damn rights and put them in hospitals for treatment, and clean up the streets, as much as it can be done. Of course, not all homeless are mentally ill, but a lot of them are.

See, there are some things we can agree on. The streets aren't the place for these people.
 
See, there are some things we can agree on. The streets aren't the place for these people.


If you're a moderate, probably much more, or compromises to be made if we were on opposite sides in the legislature.
 
There is no capitalistic incentive to provide such a thing

If conservatives call can't make a good profit from the mentally ill, we must be a socialist country...
 
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