How President Eisenhower Dealt With America’s First Illegal Immigrant Crisis

[Helix]

Not in this thread, they didn't.

you forgot a bit of that quote.

 

[Harshaw]

you forgot a bit of that quote.

I had already responded to the Eisenhower stuff. Look back.

 

[Helix]

I had already responded to the Eisenhower stuff. Look back.

let's clarify.

 

[Harshaw]

let's clarify.

Post #14.

 

[Helix]

Post #14.

that's pretty vague. let's go back to post #11.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

that's pretty vague. let's go back to post #11.

That's kinda what I was saying. The moment a Democrat proposes an infrastructure program, Republicans will start screaming about socialism.
Harhaw thinks I am only talking about roads. I don't know if anyone has specifically ranted about ROADS being socialism.

When has roadbuilding or infrastructure spending ever been "treated as socialism" by anyone?

I know that FDR had to contend with hordes of righties who decried almost all of his WPA as socialism, the TVA as socialism, it was nonstop.
And the amazing thing is, the TVA lifted millions out of the kerosene and outhouse era down South and in Appalachia.
Not only did their quality of life improve, their ability to do business and manufacture improved as well.

Aahhhhhhh socialism, those poor Appalachians and Southerners, they had to submit to the yoke (sarcasm) the yoke of abundant infrastructure!

By the way, near as I can tell, only the post roads are mentioned in the Constitution.
But near as I can tell, we should be pondering whether or not these roads, infrastructure and any public goods can "by judicious management, become productive of great public conveniency. Nothing, which tends to facilitate the intercourse between the states, can be deemed unworthy of the public care."

I daresay that most public goods facilitate intercourse between the states. Things like high speed rail, nationwide smart grids and nationwide broadband ALL "become productive of great public conveniency."

 

[Hari Seldon]

He also built the socialist interstate highway system. He should have just given that money to the top 0.1 percent and waited for it to grow itself magically.

He also warned of the great military industrial complex. The never ending request to increase spending on the military. He was sure right about that one.

 

[Bullseye]

He also built the socialist interstate highway system. He should have just given that money to the top 0.1 percent and waited for it to grow itself magically.

Interstate highways are NOT Socialist. Civilizations have been building public infrastructure for centuries.

 

[Helix]

Interstate highways are NOT Socialist. Civilizations have been building public infrastructure for centuries.

I agree. See my explanation upthread.

 

[Bullseye]

i'm well aware that it isn't socialism. however, i can only imagine the cries of rage from the current right wing movement if a Democratic president proposed a similar infrastructure program.

You'd have to IMAGINE IT because it wouldn't happen in real life. Conservative understand infrastructure is a government responsibility.

since we're having a this & that about how great Eisenhower was, what say we return to a 91% top marginal tax rate and ~35% union membership? while i think that top rate's a bit too high, i suppose that i could be convinced to consider it.

Union membership wasn't Eisenhower's doing.

 

[Helix]

You'd have to IMAGINE IT because it wouldn't happen in real life. Conservative understand infrastructure is a government responsibility.

well, there's something new. i look forward to reminding you of that.

Union membership wasn't Eisenhower's doing.

i'll take that as a no. it's a no for the 91% top marginal rate, too, yes?

 

[Bullseye]

well, there's something new. i look forward to reminding you of that.



i'll take that as a no.

Take WHAT as a no?

[q it's a no for the 91% top marginal rate, too, yes?

Not only "no" but "**** no!"

 

[maxparrish]

This is what you need to know about how Eisenhower looked at this, and right from the article... The thinking behind it is similar, the nature of the plan is what Trump is going for today including championing loss of life, the derogatory name of the plan would be applauded by just about every racist group out there, and ultimately it will be the same stain on this nation's history from today as Operation Wetback was back then.

I'm sure the thinking of Eisenhower was the thinking of most Americans at the time; that America was being flooded by illegal immigrants (nicknamed wetbacks) who ignored the law and were in a system of peonage to growers, growers and wetbacks both avoiding the more expensive and lengthily process of the bracero program. Arrests had grown to close to a half million a month, proportionally equal to about 1,000,000 a month today. Moreover, most Americans believed that there was not enough jobs and that getting the flood under control would relieve some of those pressures (not unreasonable given that whites of the era were far more comfortable doing field labor).

The common nickname was accepted by just about everyone, including mainstream journalists who used it (rather than illegal immigrant) more often as a press standard - exactly how a word's common meaning of a past culture can be held accountable to a future decision to be deeply offended by it isn't clear, and is hardly worthy of being called a stain (although it might be if used today).

Finally, Trump is not the only one to have praised Operation Wetback - so did the flagship of liberalism, the New York Times. It raged in its headlines:

SOUTHWEST WINKS AT 'WETBACK' JOBS: Ethics Cast Aside as Growers Accept Peonage Idea and Bridle at Interference FEDERAL SANCTION NOTED Border Patrol Officers Report Pressures From Washington to 'Go Easy' in Raids "Gestapo" Tactics Charged Social Security Cards Issued "Wetbacks" Linked to Crime Southwest Winks at 'Wetbacks'; U.S. Sanction for Peonage Noted Arrest Trends Analyzed Agreement Called a Travesty Cross Border in Ritual

and

'Wetback' Invasion Is Broadening Despite All U. S. Counter-Moves: Arrests Last Year Totaled 518,000, Showing Vast Rise in Influx -- Meanwhile, Laws and New Treaty With Mexico Wait...

Fact is, the strong majority of Americans supported a crackdown on the flood of illegals, and by 1956 most were pleased with the results (which lasted to the end of the 50s). News services reported a 63 percent drop in crime in Calexico, the 40-50 buses a day that were routed through Nogales, filled with young males, had within nine months dwindled to 4 to 5 buses a day. Processing was routine: registered, lectured to either sign up under the bracero program or don't come back. And warned it they came back illegally, the government had the right to punish.

In the end, somewhere between 300,000 and 3,000,000 were deported or left under fear of arrest.

To be sure, there were "bleeding hearts" of the era, a few snoots and small town editors gushing tears about Gestapo tactics and the cooperative shipment by Mexican authorities of repatriated illegals deep into Mexico but for the most part it was accepted pragmatically. And, as to be predicted, if you were dumb enough to try and bring wife and children then they too would be repatriated, although perhaps separately.

Of course it resonates today; the program was effective, uncompromising, and morally confident. And most didn't whine over being called "wetback" or being summarily booted from the country when caught having broken the law.

 

[Helix]

Take WHAT as a no?


Not only "no" but "**** no!"

so, it's just the "kick out the Mexicans" part of the "let's go back to the 50s" right wing fantasy. all of that other stuff is somewhat inconvenient. i figured.

 

[Bullseye]

so, it's just the "kick out the Mexicans" part of the "let's go back to the 50s" right wing fantasy. all of that other stuff is somewhat inconvenient. i figured.

That's pure bull****.

 

[d0gbreath]

I must say that that "let's go back to the 50s" Beaver Clever thing chokes me up. <sniff>

 

[Harshaw]

that's pretty vague. let's go back to post #11.

What exactly would you like me to say?

You were, at most charitable, making a point about cherry-picking aspects of the Eisenhower era.

So was I.

Keep in mind, I didn't say what I thought of Eisenhower one way or the other. The only I thing I said was that building roads isn't socialism. So if you're trying to hold me responsible for someone else's cherry-picking, you're off the mark.

 

[Harshaw]

That's kinda what I was saying. The moment a Democrat proposes an infrastructure program, Republicans will start screaming about socialism.
Harhaw thinks I am only talking about roads. I don't know if anyone has specifically ranted about ROADS being socialism.



I know that FDR had to contend with hordes of righties who decried almost all of his WPA as socialism, the TVA as socialism, it was nonstop.
And the amazing thing is, the TVA lifted millions out of the kerosene and outhouse era down South and in Appalachia.
Not only did their quality of life improve, their ability to do business and manufacture improved as well.

Aahhhhhhh socialism, those poor Appalachians and Southerners, they had to submit to the yoke (sarcasm) the yoke of abundant infrastructure!

By the way, near as I can tell, only the post roads are mentioned in the Constitution.
But near as I can tell, we should be pondering whether or not these roads, infrastructure and any public goods can "by judicious management, become productive of great public conveniency. Nothing, which tends to facilitate the intercourse between the states, can be deemed unworthy of the public care."

I daresay that most public goods facilitate intercourse between the states. Things like high speed rail, nationwide smart grids and nationwide broadband ALL "become productive of great public conveniency."

OK, you are continuing to talk about things other than roadbuilding which, according to you, have been called "socialism." Granting for the sake of argument that they were, I say again, I asked you about roadbuilding.

I didn't ask you to justify roadbuilding. I didn't argue against roadbuilding. I simply asked who ever called it "socialism," as you said they did, and asked for examples.

I take it you haven't found even one.

 

[Helix]

That's pure bull****.

sure doesn't seem like it.

 

[Helix]

What exactly would you like me to say?

You were, at most charitable, making a point about cherry-picking aspects of the Eisenhower era.

So was I.

Keep in mind, I didn't say what I thought of Eisenhower one way or the other. The only I thing I said was that building roads isn't socialism. So if you're trying to hold me responsible for someone else's cherry-picking, you're off the mark.

i just like to remind the right of some of the other stuff that was going on in 1950s. you know, to prevent cherry picking.

 

[Bullseye]

sure doesn't seem like it.

Delusion is harmless - you'll be OK.

 

[Fledermaus]

He also built the socialist interstate highway system. He should have just given that money to the top 0.1 percent and waited for it to grow itself magically.

You mean the Interstate and Defense Highways system.... That was the original name.

"It was evident we needed better highways. We needed them for safety, to accommodate more automobiles. We needed them for defense purposes, if that should ever be necessary. And we needed them for the economy. Not just as a public works measure, but for future growth"

Defense and Capitalism...

And they are the American equivalent of the Autobahn...

 

[Helix]

Delusion is harmless - you'll be OK.

i'm quite ok in reality, thanks.

 

[Frigidweirdo]

How President Eisenhower Sent 3 Million Illegals Packing



Today, this person would be ostracised and a target of violence. How things have changed.

Obama deported 2.5 million illegal immigrants

 

[Helix]

You mean the Interstate and Defense Highways system.... That was the original name.

"It was evident we needed better highways. We needed them for safety, to accommodate more automobiles. We needed them for defense purposes, if that should ever be necessary. And we needed them for the economy. Not just as a public works measure, but for future growth"

Defense and Capitalism...

And they are the American equivalent of the Autobahn...

and still, if a project of this scale was proposed today with a top tax rate of 91% and a union membership rate of 35%, the right wing would lose its ****.