Hormones, surgery, regret

[jmotivator]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

 

[CannonballB]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

This is why they're supposed to go through many months of counseling first. A therapist has full autonomy to ask a persons gender choice and even *why*, so I wouldn't go so far as to say it's "near criminal" to ask. Hyperbole is hyperbolic.

I agree with you overall, if the person has deeper seated issues, gender changes aren't going to suddenly make them better. People will do almost anything to avoid their issues. I say that as someone who's a complete stoner right now, for avoidance purposes.

 

[jmotivator]

This is why they're supposed to go through many months of counseling first. A therapist has full autonomy to ask a persons gender choice and even *why*, so I wouldn't go so far as to say it's "near criminal" to ask. Hyperbole is hyperbolic.

I agree with you overall, if the person has deeper seated issues, gender changes aren't going to suddenly make them better. People will do almost anything to avoid their issues. I say that as someone who's a complete stoner right now, for avoidance purposes.

I don't think it really hyperbole to say "near criminal". It actually HAS lead to jail time. We have seen an increase is sever social consequences too (job loss, friends, internet accounts) for people who even question whether a person's transgender claim is valid.

 

[HumblePi]

There's several steps one must do before reassignment surgery can be done. As the previous poster said, an exhaustive mental health evaluation is required to look for any mental health concerns that could influence an individual’s mental state, and to assess a person’s readiness to undergo the physical and emotional stresses of the transition. They may also be required to undergo a 'real life test'. The individual must take on the role of the desired sex in everyday activities, both socially and professionally through “real-life experience”.
Then there's hormone replacement therapy that may be used before, during, and after the surgical transition to another gender. Surgery is delayed until at least one year after the start of hormone therapy and at least two years after the first mental health evaluation.

This is a very long and very extensive process. It's not something that a person wakes up one day and makes an appointment to have reassignment surgery. It's been well planned and thought out far in advance.

 

[CannonballB]

I don't think it really hyperbole to say "near criminal". It actually HAS lead to jail time. We have seen an increase is sever social consequences too (job loss, friends, internet accounts) for people who even question whether a person's transgender claim is valid.

Sources? Specifically for the people who've used a wrong pronoun and been sent to jail.

There's several steps one must do before reassignment surgery can be done. As the previous poster said, an exhaustive mental health evaluation is required to look for any mental health concerns that could influence an individual’s mental state, and to assess a person’s readiness to undergo the physical and emotional stresses of the transition. They may also be required to undergo a 'real life test'. The individual must take on the role of the desired sex in everyday activities, both socially and professionally through “real-life experience”.
Then there's hormone replacement therapy that may be used before, during, and after the surgical transition to another gender. Surgery is delayed until at least one year after the start of hormone therapy and at least two years after the first mental health evaluation.

This is a very long and very extensive process. It's not something that a person wakes up one day and makes an appointment to have reassignment surgery. It's been well planned and thought out far in advance.

You don't understand. They want to change their SEX. How very dare they!! /s

 

[maquiscat]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

This kind of situation is exactly why anyone thinking they are transgender should be going through months if not years of therapy prior to any permenant changes. Many of the symptoms of transgenderism can be seen in other conditions, much like ADD and Asperger's share a lot of common symptoms. Additionally, there are lessor levels of transitioning, such as simply presenting, that will alleviate GD. These should always be tried first. Regardless, I can't think of any condition out there where we get it right first time every time.

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[jmotivator]

Sources? Specifically for the people who've used a wrong pronoun and been sent to jail.

Mother is arrested in front of her children after calling a transgender woman a man | Daily Mail Online

 

[Angel]

The treatment of transgenderism as it has evolved over the last decade is itself a cultural disorder aggravated, if not brought on, by the DSM-5.
More confused living through soft science.

 

[LadyMoonlight]

[QUOTE You don't understand. They want to change their SEX. How very dare they!! /s[/QUOTE]


NO ONE can change their sex/gender, it is not biologically possible. People can mutilate their bodies, change their outward appearance, but they CANNOT change their sex/gender. In 500 or 1000 years an archaeologist looking at human remains will classify male or female not male who used to be a male but changed to a female or, female who used to be a female but changed to a male.

 

[LadyMoonlight]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

https://www.thestranger.com/feature...oners-they-were-transgender-until-they-werent

 

[CannonballB]

Mother is arrested in front of her children after calling a transgender woman a man | Daily Mail Online

Thank you for this. I'm reading this as more about bullying than actually calling someone by a different gender. Specifically -

She is also alleged to have used accounts in two names to 'harass, defame, and publish derogatory and defamatory tweets' about Miss Hayden, including referring to her as male, stating she was 'racist, xenophobic and a crook' and mocking her as a 'fake lawyer'.

Mrs Scottow denied harassing or defaming Miss Hayden and said she holds a 'genuine and reasonable belief' that a human 'cannot practically speaking change sex', but Deputy Judge Jason Coppel QC issued an interim injunction that bans her from posting any personal information about Miss Hayden on social media, 'referencing her as a man' or linking her to her 'former male identity'.

I absolutely think that harassment, including potentially creating a second account to harass someone, should be a punishable offense. I'm down for listening to an explanation of why I'm wrong.

You don't understand. They want to change their SEX. How very dare they!! /s

NO ONE can change their sex/gender, it is not biologically possible. People can mutilate their bodies, change their outward appearance, but they CANNOT change their sex/gender. In 500 or 1000 years an archaeologist looking at human remains will classify male or female not male who used to be a male but changed to a female or, female who used to be a female but changed to a male.

Holy ****, can you do me a favor? When you travel into the future again to see how scientists will catalog findings, can you also get me winning lottery numbers?

I'm not going to refute your statement because it's an ignorant statement that has been disproven time and time again about gender. Sex, yes, I absolutely agree. Gender is mental, not physical.

You're dismissed.

 

[LadyMoonlight]

Thank you for this. I'm reading this as more about bullying than actually calling someone by a different gender. Specifically -



I absolutely think that harassment, including potentially creating a second account to harass someone, should be a punishable offense. I'm down for listening to an explanation of why I'm wrong.




Holy ****, can you do me a favor? When you travel into the future again to see how scientists will catalog findings, can you also get me winning lottery numbers?

I'm not going to refute your statement because it's an ignorant statement that has been disproven time and time again about gender. Sex, yes, I absolutely agree. Gender is mental, not physical.

You're dismissed.

Are you seriously stating that archaeologists will look at skeletal remains in the future and not be able to tell a male from a female?

 

[Omega Man]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

Sounds as if the patient may not have been forthcoming with all relative psychological information during the preoperative screening process, otherwise he should have been rejected.


OM

 

[lwf]

Thank you for this. I'm reading this as more about bullying than actually calling someone by a different gender. Specifically -

I absolutely think that harassment, including potentially creating a second account to harass someone, should be a punishable offense. I'm down for listening to an explanation of why I'm wrong.

It was in England. Hate speech alone can be a criminal offense there. She would not have been arrested in America.

 

[<alt>doxygen]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

In my view, quite a bit of talk therapy should precede a radical transformation like gender change. It's right for some, but I think it's better safe than sorry. I don't doubt this happens from time to time.

 

[CannonballB]

Are you seriously stating that archaeologists will look at skeletal remains in the future and not be able to tell a male from a female?

#SorryNotSorry it wasn't clear the first time.

 

[CannonballB]

It was in England. Hate speech alone can be a criminal offense there. She would not have been arrested in America.

Good. Too bad it's not like that here, not even gonna lie or hide it.

 

[LadyMoonlight]

#SorryNotSorry it wasn't clear the first time.

View attachment 67250661

I suspect that you are quite young with such a silly little image response. Then again, you are "very Liberal" so, one can expect little else.

 

[maquiscat]

It was in England. Hate speech alone can be a criminal offense there. She would not have been arrested in America.

Where in this thread has the discussion, either on being arrested for such things, or the topic in general, been limited to the US?

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[SheWolf]

Transgender sex change regret: Transitioning won't heal real issues

"The reprieve I experienced through surgery was only temporary. Hidden underneath the makeup and female clothing was the little boy hurt by childhood trauma. I was once again experiencing gender dysphoria, but this time I felt like a male inside a body refashioned to look like a woman. I was living my dream, but still I was deeply suicidal."

I'm not posting this as a "usual" case, or even a "common case", but I think there is something interesting to be gleaned from this man's story.

If someone experiences transgenderism that is built around a childhood trauma, it is possible that the transgenderism is a form of escapism, a way of not being the person who suffered the trauma? In those cases it seems that transgender surgery is the exactly wrong solution.

I mean, the point of Transgender surgery is to mesh the outward appearance to the person they are already comfortable being inside... if they are instead role playing the opposite sex to avoid being themselves, then changing outward sexual appearance doesn't fix their problem, they just start wanting to switch back... because they are still themselves.

However many people in the transgender community fall into this category, I wonder if it is even possible to adequately treat them now. Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice. Those who make the wrong decision can never fully be made whole, but who is going to suggest to someone that maybe a sex change isn't really what they need?

It's not criminal or near criminal to question a person's transgender status. You are so dramatic.

Secondly, these people should get proper therapy before and after surgery and hormones. It should be required. I don't understand transgenderism, but I also know people in America have the right, and should always have the right to make decisions about how they live. The government shouldn't baby sit and protect people from making decisions, and regretting decisions. That has always been a bad argument imo.

 

[SheWolf]

I don't think it really hyperbole to say "near criminal". It actually HAS lead to jail time. We have seen an increase is sever social consequences too (job loss, friends, internet accounts) for people who even question whether a person's transgender claim is valid.

Social consequences and legal, criminal consequences are not the same.

 

[SheWolf]

[QUOTE You don't understand. They want to change their SEX. How very dare they!!


NO ONE can change their sex/gender, it is not biologically possible. People can mutilate their bodies, change their outward appearance, but they CANNOT change their sex/gender. In 500 or 1000 years an archaeologist looking at human remains will classify male or female not male who used to be a male but changed to a female or, female who used to be a female but changed to a male.

I am sure an archeologist or scientist could examine human remains or a burial, and determine if they were transgender based on the clothing, DNA, and other evidence. They will never change their biology.

 

[lwf]

Where in this thread has the discussion, either on being arrested for such things, or the topic in general, been limited to the US?

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The op, who is in Virginia, said "Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice."

I disagree with this. It is not criminal, nor should it be. It is rude and ignorant, but it is also protected speech in America.

 

[maquiscat]

The op, who is in Virginia, said "Our society is increasingly making it near criminal to question a person's transgender choice."

I disagree with this. It is not criminal, nor should it be. It is rude and ignorant, but it is also protected speech in America.

One of the problems is that many will be in on the conversation from other countries. Unless the topic was specified as US, then the OP, wittingly or unwittingly, leaves the topic open to be discussed about anywhere. Additionally, the person asking the one question could have asked, "Where in the US has someone been arrested for improper pronoun use?" That too would have limited the scope of the answer. This is an internationally accessed forum. We can't assume US without more clues than the OP's location.

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[lwf]

One of the problems is that many will be in on the conversation from other countries. Unless the topic was specified as US, then the OP, wittingly or unwittingly, leaves the topic open to be discussed about anywhere. Additionally, the person asking the one question could have asked, "Where in the US has someone been arrested for improper pronoun use?" That too would have limited the scope of the answer. This is an internationally accessed forum. We can't assume US without more clues than the OP's location.

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Fair point.