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For Pete's Sake: Buttigieg rises in Iowa. Are we going to see a Buttigieg surge?

BrotherFease

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The last two DNC-approved polls for Iowa have Buttigieg in 3rd and 4th place, and in double digits. Are we going to see a Pete Buttigieg surge? :shock:

CBS NEWS POLLS
Biden & Warren 22%, Sanders 21%, Buttigieg 14%, Harris is the next highest at 5%

USA TODAY (released today)
Biden 18%, Warren 17%, Buttigieg 13%, Sanders 9%, Harris is next highest at 3%.

MEAN
1. Biden & Warren - 20%
3. Sanders - 15%
4. Buttigieg - 14%
5. Harris - 4%
6. Steyer & Klobuchar - 3%

We still have a long ways to go, but Buttigieg is rising in Iowa. Can anybody explain why?
 
Least crazy seeming of the plutocracy approved?
 
Easy to explain... Buttigieg seems like the only remaining sane somewhat center left hopeful for the Democratic nod left standing... all the others wanting the chance have all gone full tilt on one upping each other in appealing to the furthest left leaving everyone else wondering if they will stay home in 2020.

Buttigieg has a chance... not a great chance, but a chance.
 
The last two DNC-approved polls for Iowa have Buttigieg in 3rd and 4th place, and in double digits. Are we going to see a Pete Buttigieg surge? :shock:

CBS NEWS POLLS
Biden & Warren 22%, Sanders 21%, Buttigieg 14%, Harris is the next highest at 5%

USA TODAY (released today)
Biden 18%, Warren 17%, Buttigieg 13%, Sanders 9%, Harris is next highest at 3%.

MEAN
1. Biden & Warren - 20%
3. Sanders - 15%
4. Buttigieg - 14%
5. Harris - 4%
6. Steyer & Klobuchar - 3%

We still have a long ways to go, but Buttigieg is rising in Iowa. Can anybody explain why?
He had a pretty darn good debate last week! And he went on the attack.
 
Easy to explain... Buttigieg seems like the only remaining sane somewhat center left hopeful for the Democratic nod left standing... all the others wanting the chance have all gone full tilt on one upping each other in appealing to the furthest left leaving everyone else wondering if they will stay home in 2020.

Buttigieg has a chance... not a great chance, but a chance.
I could see him as Warren's VP. Regardless, he's earned his spot on the national stage of the Dem Party. I think we're going to be hearing from him for a long time.
 
I've always said that I bet he's the only one who could beat Trump.
 
He's a rising star.

Rush and Sean will lie about him thousands of times.
 
i'm fine with Buttigieg if he's the nominee. i'm significantly to the left of him, but he is light years better than Mango.
 
The last two DNC-approved polls for Iowa have Buttigieg in 3rd and 4th place, and in double digits. Are we going to see a Pete Buttigieg surge? :shock:

CBS NEWS POLLS
Biden & Warren 22%, Sanders 21%, Buttigieg 14%, Harris is the next highest at 5%

USA TODAY (released today)
Biden 18%, Warren 17%, Buttigieg 13%, Sanders 9%, Harris is next highest at 3%.

MEAN
1. Biden & Warren - 20%
3. Sanders - 15%
4. Buttigieg - 14%
5. Harris - 4%
6. Steyer & Klobuchar - 3%

We still have a long ways to go, but Buttigieg is rising in Iowa. Can anybody explain why?

I beat you to this thread, maybe mods will be willing to consider a merge.
 
Easy to explain... Buttigieg seems like the only remaining sane somewhat center left hopeful for the Democratic nod left standing... all the others wanting the chance have all gone full tilt on one upping each other in appealing to the furthest left leaving everyone else wondering if they will stay home in 2020.

Buttigieg has a chance... not a great chance, but a chance.

It's still Biden's to lose here. He's leading in the national polls, tied in Iowa, and leading in Nevada and South Carolina. Plus, he's the favorite among black voters, a pivotal demographic in the primaries.

With that said, Buttigieg moves into 2nd or 3rd place in Iowa would give his campaign a great boost, and will help him place well in NH, NV and SC.

It should be noted that the Iowa Caucus winner has gone on to win the nomination for the last six elections. Buttigieg wins Iowa and he becomes the favorite to win the nomination.
 
He had a pretty darn good debate last week! And he went on the attack.

While being largely rebutted on MFA. His blows mostly stuck concerning Tulsi though. Beyond that not exactly impressed, and he hasn't exactly demonstrated why, despite only being a mediocre mayor of a small city embroiled in racial tensions and controversy, that he should be given the most powerful, prominent and responsibility rife job on the face of the planet. Again, what I saw was largely the same empty hypocritical platitudes as usual, half the time solidly eyeroll worthy: "we shouldn't beat each other up, etc" even as he takes disingenuous stabs against the policies of others, trying so hard to present himself as being above the fray even when he gets into the thick of the mud, etc. To be entirely frank and blunt, Obama did the florid orator in the empty suit bit far better, and he at least had some federal level experience.

Better than Biden obviously and certainly better than Trump, but there's not much more I can say than that.
 
I think we're about to reach... Peak Buttigieg.

But yeah, Buttigieg is going to surge, but he's definitely not going to win. He is polling at like 0% among blacks, unlike Joe Biden, the guy whose position he's trying to usurp. Buttigieg would get destroyed in the general.
 
I could see him as Warren's VP. Regardless, he's earned his spot on the national stage of the Dem Party. I think we're going to be hearing from him for a long time.

At present I see him as a potential VP but I think he would do better seeking something else in a new administration, but I must say this guy would give Trump absolute fits as an opponent. He is unconventional in so many ways with no hint of scandal, he appears to very comfortable discussing his Christian faith, and he actually walked the walk of a soldier. He's like a mix of a young Bill Clinton and John Kerry.

There has to be more vetting, especially his husband who will get scrutiny like you and he have never seen before. This is going to be one of the nastiest campaigns in American history. Chasten's a teacher in a middle school. I know how desperate some people with a lot of power and money, will be to smear these two. The Buttigiegs will have to stay very calm, very deliberate and incredibly patient and Pete will have to stay on message and on offense and not allow for distractions based on his orientation or marriage.

If they can accomplish those goals throughout a long campaign, they can certainly be effective in taking this man down. Its just hard for me to imagine my party taking this big a risk with so much at state. I was cynical we'd pick this young black senator over the Clinton team and McCain.

In retrospect I might have been wrong about Obama's chances...
 
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While being largely rebutted on MFA. His blows mostly stuck concerning Tulsi though. Beyond that not exactly impressed, and he hasn't exactly demonstrated why, despite only being a mediocre mayor of a small city embroiled in racial tensions and controversy, that he should be given the most powerful, prominent and responsibility rife job on the face of the planet. Again, what I saw was largely the same empty hypocritical platitudes as usual, half the time solidly eyeroll worthy: "we shouldn't beat each other up, etc" even as he takes disingenuous stabs against the policies of others, trying so hard to present himself as being above the fray even when he gets into the thick of the mud, etc. To be entirely frank and blunt, Obama did the florid orator in the empty suit bit far better, and he at least had some federal level experience.

Better than Biden obviously and certainly better than Trump, but there's not much more I can say than that.
I think you're a harsh critic, but thanks for the opinion.
 
Mayor Pete is the exact opposite of Trump in so many ways.

intelligent.

Well spoken.

Young.

Faithful to one person.

Patriotic (without faking it).

I think he has a great future in politics. But he will not get the nomination.
 
I think you're a harsh critic, but thanks for the opinion.

I feel I'm just being honest. Too many are sucked in by his oratory (even when it is plainly and glaringly ironic as it was when he tried to elevate himself above the very sort of aggression he took part in) and fail to see what lies beneath or, in this case more accurately, doesn't. There's no shame in this; Obama certainly tricked me the first time when I was younger, far more naive and less savvy in matters of politics. His florid, pretty words swept away my apprehensions about his campaign funding sources (particularly the big banks for whom he made many sweet heart deals and concessions in the wake of the 2007-8 crisis), lack of experience and lack of a demonstrable track record that might be used to cement where he actually stood as a candidate, and only after he was a scathing disappointment in the White House did I come to know better. On the plus side, it was most definitely a formative experience that taught me the value of thinking and perceiving critically, the worthlessness of rhetoric, and to be focused on and attentive to the facts and receipts above all else.

An empty suit like Obama or Buttigieg will never fool me again.
 
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At present I see him as a potential VP but I think he would do better seeking something else in a new administration, but I must say this guy would give Trump absolute fits as an opponent. He is unconventional in so many ways with no hint of scandal, he appears to very comfortable discussing his Christian faith, and he actually walked the walk of a soldier. He's like a mix of a young Bill Clinton and John Kerry.

There has to be more vetting, especially his husband who will get scrutiny like you and he have never seen before. This is going to be one of the nastiest campaigns in American history. Chasten's a teacher in a middle school. I know how desperate some people with a lot of power and money, will be to smear these two. The Buttigiegs will have to stay very calm, very deliberate and incredibly patient and Pete will have to stay on message and on offense and not allow for distractions based on his orientation or marriage.

If they can accomplish those goals throughout a long campaign, they can certainly be effective in taking this man down. Its just hard for me to imagine my party taking this big a risk with so much at state. I was cynical we'd pick this young black senator over the Clinton team and McCain.

In retrospect I might have been wrong about Obama's chances...
My friend, I find this a great post. Measured, sane, sensible. I couldn't have written it better. Well done!

And the point about the unlikelihood of Obama? Well said! In fact, I see similarities between Buttigieg & he, which might be why I so like Buttigieg. Buttigieg would completely disarm Trump on the debating stage. His deployment in Afghanistan as an Intelligence Officer would give him gravitas Trump could never touch. And what a contrast between the two men in demeanor!

As to the unlikelihood of Buttigieg, besides Obama's unlikelihood, what about Trump? What was trump's government experience? Hell, I was even suggesting Oprah earlier. It's a brave new world & populism reigns!

Side note: Pete B did a stint as an investigative reporter in Chicago. He seems to be quite the versatile guy.
 
I feel I'm just being honest. Too many are sucked in by his oratory (even when it is plainly and glaringly ironic as it was when he tried to elevate himself above the very sort of aggression he took part in) and fail to see what lies beneath or, in this case more accurately, doesn't. There's no shame in this; Obama certainly tricked me the first time when I was younger, far more naive and less savvy in matters of politics. His florid, pretty words swept away my apprehensions about his campaign funding sources (particularly the big banks for whom he made many sweet heart deals and concessions in the wake of the 2007-8 crisis), lack of experience and lack of a demonstrable track record that might be used to cement where he actually stood as a candidate, and only after he was a scathing disappointment in the White House did I come to know better. On the plus side, it was most definitely a formative experience that taught me the value of thinking and perceiving critically, the worthlessness of rhetoric, and to be focused and attentive to the facts and receipts above all else.

An empty suit like Obama or Buttigieg will never fool me again.
Well, you may (possibly) be reflecting your somewhat more liberal roots than mine, at least in the case of Obama. I admit I'm a sucker for soaring rhetoric & bold idealism. I felt Obama fell short on delivering the results, but I felt pretty much in perfect harmony with him. I always felt Obama had my best interests, and the best interests of the country at heart. And I do believe he was both saddened and perplexed when he could not bring the country together.

But crazy as it sounds, do you know who Buttigieg reminds me a bit of? In age, and demeanor? He strikes me a bit like JFK. Young, Democrat, educated, a soldier, youthful thinking with bold creative ideas, and talking unity and service to their country. I love this stuff! Butigieg in a crazy way reminds me of a JFK for the new millennia, for the place America is heading in the future, 60 years post the 60's JFK.
 
Mayor Pete is the exact opposite of Trump in so many ways.

intelligent.

Well spoken.

Young.

Faithful to one person.

Patriotic (without faking it).

I think he has a great future in politics. But he will not get the nomination.
Yeah, he's almost too good for politics! :mrgreen:
 
Well, you may (possibly) be reflecting your somewhat more liberal roots than mine, at least in the case of Obama. I admit I'm a sucker for soaring rhetoric & bold idealism. I felt Obama fell short on delivering the results, but I felt pretty much in perfect harmony with him. I always felt Obama had my best interests, and the best interests of the country at heart. And I do believe he was both saddened and perplexed when he could not bring the country together.

But crazy as it sounds, do you know who Buttigieg reminds me a bit of? In age, and demeanor? He strikes me a bit like JFK. Young, Democrat, educated, a soldier, youthful thinking with bold creative ideas, and talking unity and service to their country. I love this stuff! Butigieg in a crazy way reminds me of a JFK for the new millennia, for the place America is heading in the future, 60 years post the 60's JFK.

The key difference between Buttigieg and JFK was that JFK was probably sincere, deserved the office, and had a track record he could be held to and judged by. I agree that's crazy as I don't think Buttigieg is remotely worthy of the comparison, and is nowhere near in the same league as JFK. Moreover his ideas aren't particularly bold or creative; they've been there. Bold is MFA, not something that should have and probably would have been passed in Obama's first term if he weren't either such a pathetic, sniveling weakling or someone otherwise not particularly interested in seeing even the public option of the Republican, 90s conservative Heritage Foundation plan he drafted come to fruition: Lieberman: Obama Never Pressed Me On Public Option | HuffPost Canada

That's right; the man never even confronted health insurance industry shill-in-chief Joe Lieberman over the latter's singlehanded block and take down of ACA's public option.

More reading: Obama the Conservative | Tracking Obama's abandoning of the progressive agenda, and the disconnect between his words and deeds.

At best Obama was, lacking any sort of spine or conviction, steamrolled by advisors and Republicans who held him to more conservative, pro-corporate policies, and at worst, he was lying through his teeth about his priorities and intent; neither option is really palatable.
 
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I feel I'm just being honest. Too many are sucked in by his oratory (even when it is plainly and glaringly ironic as it was when he tried to elevate himself above the very sort of aggression he took part in) and fail to see what lies beneath or, in this case more accurately, doesn't. There's no shame in this; Obama certainly tricked me the first time when I was younger, far more naive and less savvy in matters of politics. His florid, pretty words swept away my apprehensions about his campaign funding sources (particularly the big banks for whom he made many sweet heart deals and concessions in the wake of the 2007-8 crisis), lack of experience and lack of a demonstrable track record that might be used to cement where he actually stood as a candidate, and only after he was a scathing disappointment in the White House did I come to know better. On the plus side, it was most definitely a formative experience that taught me the value of thinking and perceiving critically, the worthlessness of rhetoric, and to be focused on and attentive to the facts and receipts above all else.

An empty suit like Obama or Buttigieg will never fool me again.
Well I found his plan, sorta. The Buttigieg Proposal: Medicare for All Who Want It
 
I don't see the US electing an openly gay president anytime soon.

I would have to agree in normal times, but it might be possible against Trump. If he was a heterosexual, I believe he would be the front runner. He reminds me of a Kennedy like figure, odds of winning aside, as of now he's my favorite.

It'll be interesting how he polls against Don as the primaries approach. If he does well in Iowa he could really shake up the field...
 
I think we're about to reach... Peak Buttigieg.

But yeah, Buttigieg is going to surge, but he's definitely not going to win. He is polling at like 0% among blacks, unlike Joe Biden, the guy whose position he's trying to usurp. Buttigieg would get destroyed in the general.
He's got two big demographic challenges blacks and older voters, which coincidently were two difficult nuts to crack for Sanders. Biden is very familiar, just as the Clintons were, he's been around awhile and fighting the good liberal battles for decades. Blacks still are not very engaged, and won't be until after Iowa because urban issues are not really discussed with focus until later and South Carolina is the first southern contest with a high black population. older voters tend to be a bit more cautious about radical social or political movements and that generation is more suspect of socialism and less comfortable with gay marriage, neither of which got a lot of good press in their younger days. Sanders grabbed the party's anti-Clinton vote ( there was no where else to go) and had the far left of the party and the nation to meld together with young and independent voters who were naturally suspicious of party loyalty and two party myopathy.

Buttigieg sells himself rather differently as representing a new generation both in vision and talent with a techno-savy and innovation centered approach to problem solving, rather than a European social democrat centered approach. But I agree he is unseasoned, and inexperienced on the big stage and we really don't know nearly enough yet beyond his clichés.

The point is that Iowa is a caucus, and passion and commitment is everything in a caucus state. Sanders was a fresh bowl of granola with nuts and berries four years ago, and well - the cereal is a bit soggy now and the oats have molded a bit. Its very difficult for an older flame to re-ignite twice on the same kindling. I don't know how Sanders does that and I think that is going to impede him especially among a younger college crowd. Sanders has literally plateaued in Iowa among likely caucus attendees. He was a 9% last survey in June. He still is. He's not making any headway there while Buttigieg has usurped him to 13%.

Speaking of those college kids that Sanders owned to himself in 2016. Well one thing about South Bend Indiana ,I ts most famous as the stomping ground of a few college kids University of Notre Dame - Wikipedia I think Pete's pretty comfortable on a campus after graduating from Harvard University and then from Pembroke College, Oxford, on a Rhodes Scholarship. He is particularly adept at reflecting that vision.
 
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