DIY help: winterizing outdoor faucets

[Jetboogieman]

So I’ve got a bit of an issue, winter is upon us and I’ve been draining my outdoor line for awhile and there is a fair bit of distance for them to travel so the line is gonna have quite a bit of water.

Now it might be a matter of just not knowing the right term but I hope there’s some DIY people among you who could help.

the real issue is I’ve had to bleed is periodically because it’s ****ing vertical, so the main water is vertical coming up from the ground, the outdoor line branches off horizontal for about 20 centimeters then straight up with the valve and the bleed cap on the vertical part so unless there’s enough water there for it to shoot out it just dribbles everywhere.

Anyone ever had this issue, got any ideas how to catch this water so I can leave the bleed cap open for an extended period.

 

[Rexedgar]

So I’ve got a bit of an issue, winter is upon us and I’ve been draining my outdoor line for awhile and there is a fair bit of distance for them to travel so the line is gonna have quite a bit of water.

Now it might be a matter of just not knowing the right term but I hope there’s some DIY people among you who could help.

the real issue is I’ve had to bleed is periodically because it’s ****ing vertical, so the main water is vertical coming up from the ground, the outdoor line branches off horizontal for about 20 centimeters then straight up with the valve and the bleed cap on the vertical part so unless there’s enough water there for it to shoot out it just dribbles everywhere.

Anyone ever had this issue, got any ideas how to catch this water so I can leave the bleed cap open for an extended period.

I'm having trouble with the visuals, can you sketch?

 

[Jetboogieman]

I'm having trouble with the visuals, can you sketch?

I don’t have the ability to sketch it and I scoured for any diagram and picture of water lines that line resemble my setup and I came up empty so here’s my best shot.

So my main water line runs up the middle, the outdoor line branches off the left hand side and then straight up, the kill valve and the bleed cap are on the vertical section and face towards the main line and I can’t just leave the bleed cap open, put down a bucket and just let it go because it is actually a little sideways and it starts streaming out and dribbling everywhere, I dunno if there’s a diy thing I could wrap around it to move the water in just one direction.

Just worried as my far faucet has been totally dry but with I’m assuming condensation I’m still getting water out of the nearer faucet in the mornings.

 

[Rexedgar]

I don’t have the ability to sketch it and I scoured for any diagram and picture of water lines that line resemble my setup and I came up empty so here’s my best shot.

So my main water line runs up the middle, the outdoor line branches off the left hand side and then straight up, the kill valve and the bleed cap are on the vertical section and face towards the main line and I can’t just leave the bleed cap open, put down a bucket and just let it go because it is actually a little sideways and it starts streaming out and dribbling everywhere, I dunno if there’s a diy thing I could wrap around it to move the water in just one direction.

Just worried as my far faucet has been totally dry but with I’m assuming condensation I’m still getting water out of the nearer faucet in the mornings.

I don’t think condensation will build up enough to drain when the faucet is opened. What have you done in past winters?

 

[ttwtt78640]

So I’ve got a bit of an issue, winter is upon us and I’ve been draining my outdoor line for awhile and there is a fair bit of distance for them to travel so the line is gonna have quite a bit of water.

Now it might be a matter of just not knowing the right term but I hope there’s some DIY people among you who could help.

the real issue is I’ve had to bleed is periodically because it’s ****ing vertical, so the main water is vertical coming up from the ground, the outdoor line branches off horizontal for about 20 centimeters then straight up with the valve and the bleed cap on the vertical part so unless there’s enough water there for it to shoot out it just dribbles everywhere.

Anyone ever had this issue, got any ideas how to catch this water so I can leave the bleed cap open for an extended period.

The bleed valve needs to be at the low point of the line(s) to be bled by gravity, otherwise compressed air must be used to force the water out. Shut off the main, open the bleed valve and then all valves on the line(s) to be bled. There may be some water left in any "bellies" in the system but with adequate room to expand if (when?) it freezes without bursting a pipe.

 

[Jetboogieman]

The bleed valve needs to be at the low point of the line(s) to be bled by gravity, otherwise compressed air must be used to force the water out. Shut off the main, open the bleed valve and then all valves on the line(s) to be bled. There may be some water left in any "bellies" in the system but with adequate room to expand if (when?) it freezes without bursting a pipe.

I don’t think condensation will build up enough to drain when the faucet is opened. What have you done in past winters?

First time homeowner, first winter with the place and I’ve finally come to the conclusion the shut off valve must be faulty, there’s still tons of water regularly building up at the bleed valve and for whatever reason it’s still trickling up and through to the nearest spigot so I’ve had to call in plumbers, much as I hate to have to but today was the worst, it had frozen all the way into the pipe this morning so, fun times.

 

[ttwtt78640]

First time homeowner, first winter with the place and I’ve finally come to the conclusion the shut off valve must be faulty, there’s still tons of water regularly building up at the bleed valve and for whatever reason it’s still trickling up and through to the nearest spigot so I’ve had to call in plumbers, much as I hate to have to but today was the worst, it had frozen all the way into the pipe this morning so, fun times.

That (bolded above) is rarely the case with a ball valve (aka boiler valve), but if the shut off valve is a stem and seat type (like most hose bibs/sillcocks) then failure (incomplete shutoff) is quite common - usually due to mineral deposit buildup, but occasioanlly from seat washer wear.

Ball valves are very durable and usually have excellent shutoff even after years of use. They are generally preferred over globe valves in shutoff applications.

Globe Valves vs Ball Valves | Stromquist & Company

 

[Rexedgar]

That (bolded above) is rarely the case with a ball valve (aka boiler valve), but if the shut off valve is a stem and seat type (like most hose bibs/sillcocks) then failure (incomplete shutoff) is quite common - usually due to mineral deposit buildup, but occasioanlly from seat washer wear.



Globe Valves vs Ball Valves | Stromquist & Company

Agreed; the common seat/washer is not made for the long term. I have four 12” bibs on the house (Valve actually is inside the house at the far end of the handle). The cost is about $ 25. When you buy the guts the price goes up by a few $. I am constantly preaching about folks turning the water off and the adding all the torque they can muster.

Tex, I know you know all the stuff I spelled out. Good luck, JBM, update us when you get the bill; how far north are you?

 

[ttwtt78640]

Agreed; the common seat/washer is not made for the long term. I have four 12” bibs on the house (Valve actually is inside the house at the far end of the handle). The cost is about $ 25. When you buy the guts the price goes up by a few $. I am constantly preaching about folks turning the water off and the adding all the torque they can muster.

Tex, I know you know all the stuff I spelled out. Good luck, JBM, update us when you get the bill; how far north are you?

Stem and seat valves are better (than ball valves) at finely regulating pressure/flow, but a shutoff valve does not need that ability - it is either on (full flow) or off (no flow). The most common problem with using stem and seat valves for shutoffs results from scale (mineral deposit) build up in the seat, making it impossible to get them to completely shut off - ball valves do not have that problem.

 

[Jetboogieman]

Agreed; the common seat/washer is not made for the long term. I have four 12” bibs on the house (Valve actually is inside the house at the far end of the handle). The cost is about $ 25. When you buy the guts the price goes up by a few $. I am constantly preaching about folks turning the water off and the adding all the torque they can muster.

Tex, I know you know all the stuff I spelled out. Good luck, JBM, update us when you get the bill; how far north are you?

Cold enough that it was below -10 last night, came out to check it in the morning, nice icicle about 5 centimeters down from the spigot, had to melt it open.

That (bolded above) is rarely the case with a ball valve (aka boiler valve), but if the shut off valve is a stem and seat type (like most hose bibs/sillcocks) then failure (incomplete shutoff) is quite common - usually due to mineral deposit buildup, but occasioanlly from seat washer wear.

Globe Valves vs Ball Valves | Stromquist & Company

Hmm... it is a ball valve as far as I can tell, so that makes it all even more confusing then, but with draining it for a couple of weeks now periodically the fact that water builds up and with the cap left off slowly dribbles out and never stops, and I’ve drained it for half a day twice, set up a bucket and fan and just let it go, at first I thought it had to be that water stuck in the bellies but at this point the fact it’s been drained so much out of the spigot and bleed cap and just continues means it’s gotta be the valve, just nothing else explains it.

 

[Jetboogieman]

$150 bucks later, guy just installed two new valves to each outdoor line where they diverged, which is fine as he didn’t have the parts to replace the current valve, but the big thing is... now have horizontal bleed caps lol!

Happy days.