Democrats ARE For Open Borders

[joko104]

It's not about the economics, it's about the color of their skin.

By your messages it definitely is to you.

 

[code1211]

CA = all democrats. Try again.

And uh... remind me how CA has ordered state officials to prevent the feds from securing that 100ish mile (out of thousands of total) border w/ Mexico. Because people in CA voting for and not voting out politicians who want to give benefits to illegals - rightly or wrongly - is not causing there to be open borders. The feds control the border, albeit crappily.

Shame Trump wants to take the dumbest approach possible rather than the mix recommended by people who actually do care: walls in some places, sensing equipment (fiberoptic wires, drones, etc), patrols, and more elsewhere. It's a difficult terrain in parts, and simply building a wall isn't going to do ****. If migration patterns adjust in response to changes, more changes should be made. But they need to be intelligent. It's a dynamic situation.

But Trump and his supporters want a show, not a result. So the fight has to be about a stupid ****ing wall, now doesn't it? Idiocracy.

Of course the dumbest thing about all this is if we had forced national e-verify (note: this can include playing games like withholding highway funds if unrelated state measures aren't adopted.....as they did with the drinking age) and a seriously ramped up penalty/enforcement system aimed at employers of illegals like Trump Organization, we'd cut off the purpose for people who aren't genuinely fleeing violence to come here. If they couldn't get a job, they wouldn't come here. You might get some, sure, and they'd go into cash-only or illegal businesses. But you'd cut out the vast bulk of anyone who is coming here simply to try to make more money.

And of course the sickest thing about it is that many are fleeing horrible situations. Maybe we can't afford to intervene in their country and rebuild it (and we wouldn't be able to get it right anyway. We never do). But if they're legit fleeing from violence and are good people willing to work what in the precise **** is supposed to be the problem?

Extra credit: we all know that Team Trump has been actively minimizing lawful asylum and other immigration procedures, right? He's not just going after illegal immigration.





I'll not just bold this but color code it: In fact, what he is doing - clamp down on lawful immigration, announce we'll be closing borders, then advocate for the one thing least likely to stop illegals - is designed to manufacture a crisis; to increase illegal immigration while providing a solution unlikely to be adopted which, if adopted, would not stop illegal immigration.




People who aren't lying in a bid to score an Internets Point against a perceived other side.

I couldn't open the link in your post describing the efforts of the Democrats in the US Congress to close the border to illegal immigration, criminal human trafficking and the illegal drug trade.

Could you please post that again?

 

[Moderate Right]

Here's some facts. About 8 million of illegal immigrants have jobs, making up 5 percent of the U.S. workforce. Most concentrated in border states like California and Texas, where they make up about 9 percent of both states' workforces, while in Nevada, their share is over 10 percent.

Another fact that I'll bet you didn't know is that undocumented immigrants pay millions of dollars in state taxes — even in the reddest states. Yes, you're surprised and you don't believe it, but it's the truth. In fact, undocumented immigrants contribute billions of dollars in federal taxes each year, and their income taxes and payroll tax dollars are keeping Social Security and Medicare solvent. It’s also worth noting that undocumented immigrants are paying billions of dollars in state and local taxes each year — in all 50 states.

That includes $7 billion in sales taxes and excise taxes, which are those paid on specific items like gas sales and vehicle registrations. Undocumented immigrants, like everyone else, pay for highway repairs, state courts, police, and firefighters. They also paid about $1.1 billion in state income taxes and $3.6 billion in property taxes that year — money that funds public schools, garbage collection, and other city services.

Undocumented workers contribute the most tax dollars to states with the largest populations: California, Texas, and New York. Yet some states that benefit the most from their tax money are red and blue states that Trump won in 2016: Florida, Georgia, Texas, North Carolina, and Arizona.

Oh, so you thought that undocumented workers are a drain on our government and take away your jobs? Well, you couldn't be more wrong. Health care is a right, not a privilege and giving subsidies to WORKING undocumented families is exactly the right thing to do. And guess what else? All those taxes they pay to the state and feds is money they'll never see. They can't ever collect the social security they're paying into, they can't go on Medicare when they turn 65, and they can't collect unemployment benefits.

Read more, get your mind out of the Trump anti-immigrant mindset gutter.

Illegal immigration taxes: Unauthorized immigrants pay state taxes - Vox

Nobody should come here illegally. Nobody. There is a front door for legal immigration.

 

[TheParser]

Why do they keep denying it?

Not to worry.

As soon as the Dems succeed in their coup d'état against our elected President and once again occupy the White House, they will proudly admit that they (and a lot of Republican businesspeople) want open borders.

They may actually withdraw all border agents so that people can simply walk/drive/fly across the "border" at will.


Some people have long dreamed of the United States and Mexico and Canada as one nation.

With each passing year, that goal is becoming a reality.

 

[HumblePi]

All of that is nonsense. Overall illegal migrants overwhelmingly cost more by every measure.

They're facts joko104. You're just uninformed so you reject the facts. Irregardless of whether you believe it or not, they're statistics.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

All of that is nonsense. Overall illegal migrants overwhelmingly cost more by every measure.

^^^^ Fantasy narrative.

 

[Luther]

Nobody should come here illegally. Nobody. There is a front door for legal immigration.

There is a front door for legal immigration.

You don't know it, but High number legal immigration is worst

There's a mini Amnesty happening every single year

They can vote

 

[HumblePi]

All of that is nonsense. Overall illegal migrants overwhelmingly cost more by every measure.

You have swallowed the poison pill that Trump has been feeding you on a regular basis.

Myth #1: Immigrants take more from the U.S. government than they contribute
Fact: Immigrants contribute more in tax revenue than they take in government benefits

Myth #2: Immigrants take American jobs
Fact: Immigrants workers often take jobs that boost other parts of the economy 4 myths about how immigrants affect the U.S. economy | PBS NewsHour

Immigrants often have jobs that Americans tend not to take. So instead of competing with Americans’ for work, immigrants tend to complement American workers. Here's another fact. The US and many other countries have since their inceptions relied on either a slave or immigrant workforce to create robust economies. Why do you think the south became extremely prosperous in the 1600's? With cash crops of tobacco, cotton and sugar cane, America’s southern states became the economic engine of the booming emerging nation. Their fuel of choice? Human slavery. The 14th Amendment, was ratified after the Civil War and guaranteed citizenship to “all persons born or naturalized in the United States,” including people who were formerly enslaved. Trump publicly criticized the 14th Amendment calling it “a crazy, lunatic policy”. If it was Trump's decision to make, Blacks would still be slaves picking crops in the south with no rights at all.

The same works in today's economy. Were it not for undocumented workers, many states would not be financially thriving. Undocumented workers are contributing billions of dollars a year to Social Security, but may never reap any retirement benefits from it. Every year, the Social Security Administration collects billions of dollars in taxes that it doesn’t know who paid. Whenever employers send in W-2 forms that have Social Security numbers that don’t match with anyone on record, the agency routes the paperwork to what’s called the Earnings Suspense File, where it sits until people can prove the wages were theirs, allowing them to one day collect retirement benefits. The Earnings Suspense File now contains Social Security tax forms that date back to 1937 and are linked to the taxes that were paid on nearly $1.3 trillion in wages. The Truth About Undocumented Immigrants and Taxes - The Atlantic


You've been fed a whole pile of lies regarding undocumented workers.

 

[Ikari]

Are you serious?

He did, but Open-Boarders is a very specific and extreme policy. It's more than healthcare or some other nonsense. In the speech you're quoting, he did take a shot at Trump's wall saying:

And many of you were in elementary school when you learned the toughest lesson of all on 9/11. There are no walls big enough to stop people from anywhere, tens of thousand miles away, who are determined to take their own lives while they target others. Not in a clash of civilizations, but in an assault, a raw assault on civilization itself.

So I think that everything that we’ve lived and learned tells us that we will never come out on top if we accept advice from soundbite salesmen and carnival barkers who pretend the most powerful country on Earth can remain great by looking inward and hiding behind walls at a time that technology has made that impossible to do and unwise to even attempt.

A bit of political grandstanding, but essentially saying that no wall is going to protect us from international terrorism. It's true, though one may argue that the point of the wall isn't to protect us from terrorism in and of itself, but to present a barrier to make illegal immigration tougher. But Republocrats love their grandstanding, so we have this little pot shot.

As for talking about a "complex and borderless world". This wasn't some endorsement of open border polices. If you actually read the commencement address he was giving, he wasn't talking of immigration when he referred to a borderless world.

Today, we face a world that is much more complicated, less hierarchical, where non-state actors play a central role; where disturbing images and outright lies can circle the globe in an instant; where dangers like climate change, terrorism, and disease do not respect borders or any of the norms of behavior; and where tribal and sectarian hatreds are as prominent as they have been in centuries.
...
It seems obvious that understanding to – the need to engage with the greater world, with the wider world should be a threshold requirement for those in high office. And yet the specter of isolationism once again hovers over our nation. I thought we had learned the lessons from the 20th century when an isolationist foreign policy and a protectionist tariff policy contributed to two global wars and the Great Depression.
...
One of those mountains is the effort to safeguard future generations from the harmful effects of climate change.
...
And in the years ahead, we will need an all-out global commitment to clean air, clean harbors, clean coasts, renewable energy, and the preservation of our endangered ocean and marine resources. And I say to you today with certainty, this is one of the great challenges of our time.
...
Today, extreme poverty worldwide has fallen below 10 percent for the first time in history. The revolution that is taking place on a global basis has brought hundreds of millions of people in India, hundreds of millions of people in China into the middle class. And while that’s welcome news, we’re not satisfied because 700 million people still have to survive on less than what it costs for us to grab a couple of Dunkin Donuts a day, because the gap – the gap that was referred to earlier between rich and poor – remains far too wide.
...
There is absolutely no reason – (applause) – there is absolutely no reason to believe that we can’t do the same for malaria and the same for the Zika virus. Right now, if we uphold and continue our commitments to critical global health programs in Africa, we can see the birth of the first AIDS-free generation – an extraordinary accomplishment.

And so on and so forth. So he's not talking about immigration, he's not talking open border policy. He's talking about the changing of technology and its global influence. He's talking of global climate change, of global poverty, of global health issues, of international terrorism, etc. These things do not hold to borders, When he said we're entering a complex borderless world, it's not an endorsement of open border immigration policy, but of larger issues which affect the globe on whole and the necessity of the US to be part of that solution.

Perhaps you agree, perhaps you disagree. That's not the point. The point is, he was not talking open border policies. There may be a handful of folk who may actually discuss and promote open border policies, but it's certainly not the stance of the overall Democratic Party. That's just political grandstanding and hysterics.

So your little quote means nothing because you tried to remove all context from what he was speaking to and pretended it meant something it did not. In other words....Fake News.

 

[Acadia]

Nobody should come here illegally. Nobody. There is a front door for legal immigration.

The Left forgets that the front door has been closed from time to time because America decided when, who and how many with regards to immigration. Now, it's like they believe America isn't allowed to exercise its sovereignty, because we have to take in all the world's poor and oppressed.
We're the most generous country in the world, yet it'll never be enough.

 

[OscarLevant]

Why do they keep denying it? They give illegals numerous incentives to come here.

California lawmakers agree to health benefits for immigrants

Yeah, that's probably why Obama became known as the "deportation King."

Hah!

 

[trixare4kids]

According to Trump's announcement, the illegal problem is fixed now.

Link where Trump said the illegal problem is fixed now?
:coffeepap:

 

[trixare4kids]

It's not about the economics, it's about the color of their skin.

Yours, like Jussie's Smollet's race card, has been denied.

 

[ultmd]

LOL :roll:
Turn off Maddow.

LOL, Don't know much about what "Maddow" would have to do with anything I've said, but I do recognize an empty-headed response from someone who's desperate to change the subject. Your problem here is that you are convicted by my previous remarks, and you know it.

And, for me, that's all very humorous to observe. Gives me a good chuckle, in fact.

So now, let's just both agree that you were wrong...I was right...and your fragile wingnut ego is what keeps you from acknowledging both, shall we?

Good.

Now, you are dismissed. Go back and watch Tucker and Laura. They'll sooth your overmatched intellect for a while. But remember, when you come back to this board, you can't get away with the same empty-headed fake news arguments that feel so "smart" within your alt-right circles, ok?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Link where Trump said the illegal problem is fixed now?
:coffeepap:

So you can't read either.

This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States.

Trump says "greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States", I consider taking him at his word and therefore consider the matter closed, and I can't help it if you don't believe him.

 

[trixare4kids]

So you can't read either.



Trump says "greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States", I consider taking him at his word and therefore consider the matter closed, and I can't help it if you don't believe him.

He did not say that either...

You snipped context.
You better believe that I can read...

Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump



Donald J. Trump
‏
Verified account

@realDonaldTrump
Following Following @realDonaldTrump
More
I am pleased to inform you that The United States of America has reached a signed agreement with Mexico. The Tariffs scheduled to be implemented by the U.S. on Monday, against Mexico, are hereby indefinitely suspended. Mexico, in turn, has agreed to take strong measures to....
....stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border. This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States

eta: link
Donald J. Trump on Twitter: "....stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border. This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States. Details of the agreement will be released shortly by the State Department. Thank you!"

 

[Trump]

So you can't read either.



Trump says "greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States", I consider taking him at his word and therefore consider the matter closed, and I can't help it if you don't believe him.

try harder....and next time be honest:2wave:

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

He did not say that either...

You snipped context.

The only context that matters. Sorry, you guys do it to us ALL the time. Don't like it? Tough beans.

"This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States."

I consider the matter closed and the issue solved.

 

[Trump]

The only context that matters. Sorry, you guys do it to us ALL the time. Don't like it? Tough beans.

"This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States."

I consider the matter closed and the issue solved.

:failpail::giggle1:

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

:failpail::giggle1:

You don't believe your own hero, that's your problem.
What part of "greatly reduce, or eliminate" don't you understand?

 

[CharisRose]

Oh I see. That makes all that Bircherite nonsense okay then. Got it.

Manifesto of the Communist Party

snippet

Section II has made clear the relations of the Communists to the existing working-class parties, such as the Chartists in England and the Agrarian Reformers in America.

The Communists fight for the attainment of the immediate aims, for the enforcement of the momentary interests of the working class; but in the movement of the present, they also represent and take care of the future of that movement. In France, the Communists ally with the Social-Democrats(1) against the conservative and radical bourgeoisie, reserving, however, the right to take up a critical position in regard to phases and illusions traditionally handed down from the great Revolution.

In Switzerland, they support the Radicals, without losing sight of the fact that this party consists of antagonistic elements, partly of Democratic Socialists, in the French sense, partly of radical bourgeois.

In Poland, they support the party that insists on an agrarian revolution as the prime condition for national emancipation, that party which fomented the insurrection of Cracow in 1846.

In Germany, they fight with the bourgeoisie whenever it acts in a revolutionary way, against the absolute monarchy, the feudal squirearchy, and the petty bourgeoisie.

But they never cease, for a single instant, to instill into the working class the clearest possible recognition of the hostile antagonism between bourgeoisie and proletariat, in order that the German workers may straightway use, as so many weapons against the bourgeoisie, the social and political conditions that the bourgeoisie must necessarily introduce along with its supremacy, and in order that, after the fall of the reactionary classes in Germany, the fight against the bourgeoisie itself may immediately begin.

The Communists turn their attention chiefly to Germany, because that country is on the eve of a bourgeois revolution that is bound to be carried out under more advanced conditions of European civilisation and with a much more developed proletariat than that of England was in the seventeenth, and France in the eighteenth century, and because the bourgeois revolution in Germany will be but the prelude to an immediately following proletarian revolution.

In short, the Communists everywhere support every revolutionary movement against the existing social and political order of things.

In all these movements, they bring to the front, as the leading question in each, the property question, no matter what its degree of development at the time.

Finally, they labour everywhere for the union and agreement of the democratic parties of all countries.

The Communists disdain to conceal their views and aims. They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions. Let the ruling classes tremble at a Communistic revolution. The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win.

Roseann

 

[joko104]

Not to worry.

As soon as the Dems succeed in their coup d'état against our elected President and once again occupy the White House, they will proudly admit that they (and a lot of Republican businesspeople) want open borders.

They may actually withdraw all border agents so that people can simply walk/drive/fly across the "border" at will.


Some people have long dreamed of the United States and Mexico and Canada as one nation.

With each passing year, that goal is becoming a reality.

Ironically, Mexico is the ONLY country that we can summarily deport their people back to. No one else, just Mexicans.

 

[trixare4kids]

The only context that matters. Sorry, you guys do it to us ALL the time. Don't like it? Tough beans.

"This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States."

I consider the matter closed and the issue solved.

Nothing wrong with admitting you took Trump's comment out of context while dishonestly pushing your own narrative.

Don't make me give you one of those Pinocchio(s) you give out to others without forethought.

 

[CharisRose]

He did not say that either...

You snipped context.
You better believe that I can read...

Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump



Donald J. Trump
‏
Verified account

@realDonaldTrump
Following Following @realDonaldTrump
More
I am pleased to inform you that The United States of America has reached a signed agreement with Mexico. The Tariffs scheduled to be implemented by the U.S. on Monday, against Mexico, are hereby indefinitely suspended. Mexico, in turn, has agreed to take strong measures to....
....stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border. This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States

eta: link
Donald J. Trump on Twitter: "....stem the tide of Migration through Mexico, and to our Southern Border. This is being done to greatly reduce, or eliminate, Illegal Immigration coming from Mexico and into the United States. Details of the agreement will be released shortly by the State Department. Thank you!"

When a person or persons snips or ignores context they can then use the :bs:spin: tactic to twist the words to fit their negative mindset concerning their opposition.

That is one of the many tactics used by the "any means necessary crowd" to spread their liberal open-minded :2funny:mindset.

Roseann

 

[poweRob]

Here's the kicker

Legal immigration is much worse

I'm so sorry that you are that crap-your-pants terrified of brown people.