Corvid is man made, now it's official.

[Thoreau72]

I think the number of lies are way up now, but much less believable. Until covid 19, this administration was dominated by malevolent incompetency, which minimized the damage done. However, with covid 19, the incompetency magnified the number of deaths.

IMO, believing the statements of known liars is a demonstration of irrational behavior that humans are prone to.

Yes, the Covid Apocalypse has been delivered masterfully by the mainstream media. It is no surprise that the herd was stampeded by fear mongering about a virus that kills less than 1% of those it infects.

No surprise at all.

The land of the socially distanced and home of the not-so-brave is limping right along under the leadership and control of special interests.

 

[RAMOSS]

IMO, believing the statements of known liars is a demonstration of irrational behavior that humans are prone to.

Yes, the Covid Apocalypse has been delivered masterfully by the mainstream media. It is no surprise that the herd was stampeded by fear mongering about a virus that kills less than 1% of those it infects.

No surprise at all.

The land of the socially distanced and home of the not-so-brave is limping right along under the leadership and control of special interests.

When you have known multiple people who had more sever reactions, that's not quite true. Also, the toll on the body for many people is far beyond the flu, even if they don't go to the hospital. So, your statement is showing a depth of ignorance.

Also, another thing you are not taking into account is how much more contagious it is. Many more people will catch it, and that drives fatalities up, even if the death rate '1%'. If half the people in the u.s. get it, a 1% death rate still is 1.5 million people. Think about that one.

 

[Thoreau72]

When you have known multiple people who had more sever reactions, that's not quite true. Also, the toll on the body for many people is far beyond the flu, even if they don't go to the hospital. So, your statement is showing a depth of ignorance.

Also, another thing you are not taking into account is how much more contagious it is. Many more people will catch it, and that drives fatalities up, even if the death rate '1%'. If half the people in the u.s. get it, a 1% death rate still is 1.5 million people. Think about that one.

Well, I won't argue about that, but I am also colored by my own personal experiences and knowledge related to this infection.

I stopped counting at 30 several weeks ago. It seems that every day I see old friends again after the shut down, I meet more people who had the infection, did not seek medical help, and survived with no apparent ill effects.

I do understand that people died, and that's too bad, but while I know dozens who survived just fine, I don't know of a single person that died from it. I just ran into a friend yesterday, airline pilot whose wife is nurse practitioner, and both of them had no symptoms but do carry the antibodies.

Life goes on.

 

[RAMOSS]

Well, I won't argue about that, but I am also colored by my own personal experiences and knowledge related to this infection.

I stopped counting at 30 several weeks ago. It seems that every day I see old friends again after the shut down, I meet more people who had the infection, did not seek medical help, and survived with no apparent ill effects.

I do understand that people died, and that's too bad, but while I know dozens who survived just fine, I don't know of a single person that died from it. I just ran into a friend yesterday, airline pilot whose wife is nurse practitioner, and both of them had no symptoms but do carry the antibodies.

Life goes on.

I had someone who I had to deal with at work get it, and he was in the hospital 57 days, with being on a ventilator more than 40. He survived, so he is not a death statistic. He has inflammation in the nerves of his arm, so he can't use it. He has trouble walking. His organs had started shutting down, so frankly it's amazing he's alive.

Another of the coworkers that is a 'trainee' for coming into my department had it. He was sick for 3 weeks, even though he didn't need to go to the hospital. He said he is finding taking the stairs a chore.

A third person I know that had it lost her sense of taste and smell, and those senses did not come back yet even though she recovered.

So, given that, I think I am taking it a lot more seriously. Yep. The local nursing homes in the county also had many deaths.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Does that make the Chinese government equal to the US government in the mendacity index?

Is that like arguing over whether it is better to be buried in feces up to the bridge of you nose or up to your eyebrows?

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

IMO, believing the statements of known liars is a demonstration of irrational behavior that humans are prone to.

Yes, the Covid Apocalypse has been delivered masterfully by the mainstream media. It is no surprise that the herd was stampeded by fear mongering about a virus that kills less than 1% of those it infects.

The US mortality rate for COVID-19 is 5.28% for those infected, and 11.27% for "closed" cases. The world mortality rate for COVID-19 is 5.27% for those infected (the rate for "closed" cases is not available).

No surprise at all.

Indeed, it is absolutely no surprise at all that you completely ignore the actual data in pursuit of "an agenda".

The land of the socially distanced and home of the not-so-brave is limping right along under the leadership and control of special interests.

And having the United States of America being "along under the leadership and control of special interests" is a change from normal? How?

 

[wcsu1975]

IMO, believing the statements of known liars is a demonstration of irrational behavior that humans are prone to.

Yes, the Covid Apocalypse has been delivered masterfully by the mainstream media. It is no surprise that the herd was stampeded by fear mongering about a virus that kills less than 1% of those it infects.

No surprise at all.

The land of the socially distanced and home of the not-so-brave is limping right along under the leadership and control of special interests.

It's 5.3% in the US.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Just possible that it was natural and just possible that such a random thing would happen just outside the lab and just just... well, no it was the lab.

Stating that with absolute certainty, is not very wise...

 

[Tim the plumber]

Stating that with absolute certainty, is not very wise...

Well beyond the level of a legal beyond reasonable doubt.

 

[Lursa]

Or the question;

How come the virology scientists of the world have decieded that there is and can be no evidence of the lab origin despite the fact that an overwhelming ammount of circumstantial evidence points that way and the Chineese will not allow an investigation?

Is it that most of the funding for virology comes through programs which the Chineese are involved in to some degree even if that is simply that they get all the grunt work done over there at a tenth the cost of it being done in the west where we have good standards of biosecurity to pay for?

I wonder?

I wonder why it is that people here are quite sooooo passionate about the idea that it could not possibly be the lab hypothesis? I wonder why it was that when I started this thread I got a whole thread dedicated to attacking me as a person? A thread where a load of people piled on to me in an attempt to bully me into silence? I know it may be that they all just wanted to have a crack at me or it might be that some of them are Chineese/communist bots. Who can say?

Because you've demonstrated very little actual understanding of the scientific process or virology or historic foreign relations with China or the history of how countries in general handle outbreaks??

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa

 

[Tim the plumber]

Because you've demonstrated very little actual understanding of the scientific process or virology or historic foreign relations with China or the history of how countries in general handle outbreaks??

Has the professor of biology demonstrated any of those skills?

 

[Lursa]

Has the professor of biology demonstrated any of those skills?

Which one? Please quote one of those in your links. You havent even understood what your own links have meant...but please, offer some again.

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa

 

[Lord of Planar]

Well beyond the level of a legal beyond reasonable doubt.

It's so hard to say. I do see reasonable doubt. If you read the articles from the likes of the Epoch Times, They lay out a path of certainty that the virus escaped from a laboratory. That make claims of how the outside of the virus is 100% like one thing and another part 100% like another. There is a Chinese scientists that admits to experimenting with a similar virus. However, the Epoch Times references Nature and other journals that I have access to, and the Epoch Times is lying about how similar these are. Other places are probably using the same misrepresentation of facts.

This is very compelling, but not completely factual:



That said, I will not dismiss that it might be correct, that China did manufacture the virus.

 

[Thoreau72]

It's 5.3% in the US.

If you've been paying attention from the beginning, you know that the statistics offered in support of the official narrative have been wildly inaccurate. Many individuals working within the system have pointed that out, from doctors and nurses to funeral directors.

Pardon me if I see your number as wildly inaccurate as any others from the media.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Has the professor of biology demonstrated any of those skills?

As soon as you can demonstrate how AMERICAN media and AMERICAN political people have convinced the entire world to lie about the existence/extent of the threat that COVID-19 poses, I will reconsider my opinion that your "theory" (which appears to be based solely on the premise "I don't want to face reality.") is nothing more than sub-standard, second-rate, male bovine excrement.

 

[Tim the plumber]

As soon as you can demonstrate how AMERICAN media and AMERICAN political people have convinced the entire world to lie about the existence/extent of the threat that COVID-19 poses, I will reconsider my opinion that your "theory" (which appears to be based solely on the premise "I don't want to face reality.") is nothing more than sub-standard, second-rate, male bovine excrement.

So authority is all in your view then?

 

[Ethel2]

It's 5.3% in the US.

When you aren't sure of either the numerator or the denominator you cannot know the mortality rate. Pretty simple.

 

[wcsu1975]

If you've been paying attention from the beginning, you know that the statistics offered in support of the official narrative have been wildly inaccurate. Many individuals working within the system have pointed that out, from doctors and nurses to funeral directors.

Pardon me if I see your number as wildly inaccurate as any others from the media.

Newflash. Statistics from the health sources differs from the politicians.

 

[Thoreau72]

Newflash. Statistics from the health sources differs from the politicians.

These days it seems the mainstream "health sources" behave very much like politicians. That is, they are absolutely as corrupt as the political establishment.

If you happened to catch last night's 60 Minutes regarding the opioid events, you can see it there very well documented and explained. In short, there are many (not all) doctors who write as they are paid to write.

Judy Mikovits' book Plague Of Corruption corroborates. Cover up and pencil whipping is what too many of them do.

In this Covid time, those inside who expose the pencil whipping are quickly censored, proving that what they say is essentially true.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

So authority is all in your view then?

Not in the least. You have made an "assertion of fact" that the whole COVID-19 situation is fake. For that to be true, then either

1. EVERY country that is reporting COVID-19 cases/deaths would have to be lying;
   *
   or
   *
2. the United States of America would have to be the ONLY country in the world that COVID-19 is not affecting.

I challenged you to produce EVIDENCE to support what I perceive to be your actual "assertion of fact" and told you that I would reconsider my opinion that your "theory" (which appears to be based solely on the premise "I don't want to face reality.") is nothing more than sub-standard, second-rate, well ripened, male bovine excrement should you do so.

You chose not to do so in the first instance, so I extend the offer again.

Over to you, Sir.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

When you aren't sure of either the numerator or the denominator you cannot know the mortality rate. Pretty simple.

Right, and since you cannot know the mortality rate with 100% certainty then the only logical options are to either

1. make up whatever number makes you feel best;
   *
2. ignore reality;
   *
3. take the position that one "unknown number" is as good as any other number;
   *
4. take the position that zero and an "unknown number" are the same;
   *
5. believe what the people who have an agenda tell you to believe;
   *
6. believe what the people who have a known and documented history of lying tell you to believe;
   *
   or;
   *
7. a combination of two or more of the above.

​

 

[Ethel2]

Right, and since you cannot know the mortality rate with 100% certainty then the only logical options are to either

1. make up whatever number makes you feel best;
   *
2. ignore reality;
   *
3. take the position that one "unknown number" is as good as any other number;
   *
4. take the position that zero and an "unknown number" are the same;
   *
5. believe what the people who have an agenda tell you to believe;
   *
6. believe what the people who have a known and documented history of lying tell you to believe;
   *
   or;
   *
7. a combination of two or more of the above.

View attachment 67284726
​

If I am reading this chart correctly the mortality rate in the US, for example, is about 5%. I assume that is simply the number of deaths as a numerator divided by the confirmed cases. Is that correct?

If so, the problem I have with it is that according to the IMEH model they are using about a factor of three times the confirmed cases (approximately) as the suspected cases. There was a study done in California that showed that the number of actual infections was up to 50x the number of confirmed cases. Of course that was before we markedly increased testing. I realize that the number of deaths from Covid is likely higher than the reported total, but if you use the IMEH assumption that only about a third of the cases are actually confirmed the mortality rate would be 5/3=about 1.7%. In addition, in S Korea, which has a very robust testing machine, a study was done dividing mortality by age as follows:

30-39=.14%
40-49=.19%
50-59=.68%
60-69=2.5%
70-79=9.9%
80-89=25.7%

The overall mortality rate was about 2.2%. I don't think our mortality rate would be much different unless our hospitals get over-run. So my best guess is that the overall US mortality rate from actual cases is somewhere between 1.7% and 2.2%. Of course, that is just my guess based on some data. Its really no better a guess than anyone else's.

 

[Lord of Planar]

If I am reading this chart correctly the mortality rate in the US, for example, is about 5%. I assume that is simply the number of deaths as a numerator divided by the confirmed cases. Is that correct?

If so, the problem I have with it is that according to the IMEH model they are using about a factor of three times the confirmed cases (approximately) as the suspected cases. There was a study done in California that showed that the number of actual infections was up to 50x the number of confirmed cases. Of course that was before we markedly increased testing. I realize that the number of deaths from Covid is likely higher than the reported total, but if you use the IMEH assumption that only about a third of the cases are actually confirmed the mortality rate would be 5/3=about 1.7%. In addition, in S Korea, which has a very robust testing machine, a study was done dividing mortality by age as follows:

30-39=.14%
40-49=.19%
50-59=.68%
60-69=2.5%
70-79=9.9%
80-89=25.7%

The overall mortality rate was about 2.2%. I don't think our mortality rate would be much different unless our hospitals get over-run. So my best guess is that the overall US mortality rate from actual cases is somewhere between 1.7% and 2.2%. Of course, that is just my guess based on some data. Its really no better a guess than anyone else's.

Yep.

As contagious as it is, so many more people have caught it and not even known they had it.

This lock-down is stupid.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

If I am reading this chart correctly the mortality rate in the US, for example, is about 5%. I assume that is simply the number of deaths as a numerator divided by the confirmed cases. Is that correct?

Indeed, that is how it is done. You might want to take a look at the daily updates of the COVID-19 data which are available at Daily Statistical Summary of COVID-19 for more information.

If so, the problem I have with it is that according to the IMEH model they are using about a factor of three times the confirmed cases (approximately) as the suspected cases. There was a study done in California that showed that the number of actual infections was up to 50x the number of confirmed cases. Of course that was before we markedly increased testing. I realize that the number of deaths from Covid is likely higher than the reported total, but if you use the IMEH assumption that only about a third of the cases are actually confirmed the mortality rate would be 5/3=about 1.7%.

If you want to imagine that the numbers are something other than what the numbers are, you can come up with any result you want. Heck, why not "imagine" that the number of infections is 30 times what the reported number is - that would give a mortality rate of 0.17%, or even 300 times, and that would give a mortality rate of 0.017%.

Your assumption is that, even though the US is using the same reporting criteria as the rest of the world, the US data is all wrong - even though the data from the rest of the world is 100% correct.

In addition, in S Korea, which has a very robust testing machine, a study was done dividing mortality by age as follows:

30-39=.14%
40-49=.19%
50-59=.68%
60-69=2.5%
70-79=9.9%
80-89=25.7%

The overall mortality rate was about 2.2%. I don't think our mortality rate would be much different unless our hospitals get over-run. So my best guess is that the overall US mortality rate from actual cases is somewhere between 1.7% and 2.2%. Of course, that is just my guess based on some data. Its really no better a guess than anyone else's.

As I said, if you want to introduce a "fudge factor" you can make the data produce any conclusion that you want it to produce.

There are no "fudge factors" in any of

​

Nor in

The “Rolling 7 day US average deaths per day” TODAY is 616 (YESTERDAY it was 629).

For the US, the 10 day average of the 7 day rolling averages remains below 900 for the NINTH day in a row and below 800 for the FIFTH day in a row.

IF the current trends continue, THEN the number of daily deaths from COVID-19 in the US should fall below the average number of daily murders in the US by the middle of July.
​

and it remains a fact that

COVID-19 is now the SIXTH largest cause of death in the United States of America,
having passed the annual rate (116,103) for Alzheimer’s Disease.​