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BREAKING: Dramatic Escalation in Syria

Fenton said:
Prior to WWII there was no global economy, at least not to the extent that there is today.

Russia's highly dependent on revenues gained from natural gas piped into Western Europe.

If Russia goes to war with NATO, that revenue will be grind to a halt.

And when I said Russian provocations I meant the following....
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...-buzz-u-s-ship-rules-of-engagement/index.html
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So the answer is to die a death by a thousand cuts as sanctions and encroachment constantly hits them? No country would put up with the same level of provocation that Russia has dealt with, least of all the U.S. Pushing a powerhouse to the point where they don't feel like they have many other options is the same thing as what happened with Germany leading up to WWII. And if China decides to side against us it would be a very tough fight as it would basically be the U.S. against them all on two fronts. There's nothing army to speak of in the European theater to stop Russia, outside of the U.S. forces we have there, but we are weak in the Asian theater outside of our Navy.

As far as their jets buzzing our ships....that's silly to complain about in the face of other things like expanding NATO to their borders and doing military exercises there as well. We are messing around on the other side of the globe, right in their back yard. Buzzing a few ships is nothing. I hope for the day when people can finally look at this situation from an objective POV and then we can move forward and progress.

russia-wants-war.jpg
 
beerftw said:
For one they have an exellent air defense system, that is no joke to mess with. Two even though the russian navy is inferior to ours, and lacks force projection, they are designed for defense, to the extent any navy battle with them in their own waters would end in a stalemate or the us navy retreating unless the us navy concentrated it's forces solely on russia.

Third their current air fleet is more advanced that ours due to decades of lethargic advances and funding. Our f-35 when fully functional will blow their new jets out of the water, plus their updated migs as well. However our big issue has been putting everything in the f-22 and the f-35, the f-22 was scrapped, while the f-35 is in limited numbers, due to technichal issues halting adoption. They have progressed their fighter jets since the cold war, while ours are updated versions of cold war jets.

We have the superior army, navy and airforce, even with their recent advancements in tanks and aircraft, we have the better trained and equipped overall force. It is however a grave mistake to assume a bring it on position, as the most powerful military in the world and the second most powerful fighting it out would end nothing short of a bloodbath.
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The S-400 anti-air system is pretty solid and the cost to benefit ration of anti-air missiles and anti-ship missiles is almost always going to make it pay off. Sending 20 anti-ship missiles to take out even two ships pays for itself and then some.

However, ultimately if it was just Russia, we would steam roll them. It would be a little more of a struggle but it would still happen. It would be if China joined in on Russia's side, making a China/Russia block that we'd be in some serious trouble. We couldn't fight that war very easily, just due to our small size alone.
 
Vox said:
They got nothing.

We could beat their air force with F-16s. Their technology is inferior and unreliable and their few good pilots still lack the superior training that U.S. pilots receive.

Remember Al Capp's "Lower Slobbovia?" That was Russia. Still is.

Our military ALWAYS and CONSTANTLY tries to make it look like the enemy is a giant, unbeatable boogyman.

That's part of a strategy to get even more money.

We could easily beat the whole world in a world war.......we wouldn't have to use more than a few nukes.

:2usflag:
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Using any nukes at all means we lose, they lose, everyone loses because then nukes would be flying everyone. That's ridiculously naive. That aside, we don't have the numbers to take on the whole world, not by a long shot.
 
Vox said:
Fact: Russia will do nothing because they know how outmatched they are.

If you want to worry about something......worry about North Korea--who could kill MILLIONS of South Koreans and Japanese with chemical weapons delivered by artillery and missiles.

The damage to Japan alone could crash the world economy.

:2usflag:
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That's definitely a reality. There is enough conventional artillery pointed at Seoul that it would basically be flattened in no time.
 
Vox said:
Our nukes are the reason they'd back down.

They have a life wish.......not a death wish.

Putin loves his luxurious life.

:2usflag:
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Again, this is a non-point. Russia has plenty of nukes as well. We both have enough nukes to kill everyone. There is no advantage there.
 
Fishking said:
The S-400 anti-air system is pretty solid and the cost to benefit ration of anti-air missiles and anti-ship missiles is almost always going to make it pay off. Sending 20 anti-ship missiles to take out even two ships pays for itself and then some.

However, ultimately if it was just Russia, we would steam roll them. It would be a little more of a struggle but it would still happen. It would be if China joined in on Russia's side, making a China/Russia block that we'd be in some serious trouble. We couldn't fight that war very easily, just due to our small size alone.
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If it was just russia, it would depend on where we fought them, from syria to their homeland, to their neighboring countries,in a just us vs russia war russia has the advantage, due to their homefield advantage.

If that war went to say egypt of france or saudi arabia russia would be sent packing, we are better at fore projection and logistics, russias however have focused on home defense and preventing us from advancing into their turf, rather than moving into our.
 
beerftw said:
That is actually because of budget cuts, and you kind of have to ignore the whole space race, and how many russians died to get there, but that was not from lack of tech, rather it was them being in such a rush to beat america in space exploration that they put safety as a secondary concern.
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Yet they are the ones that have the capabilities, budget or not. If they were so shoddy then we wouldn't be.
 
Fishking said:
Again, this is a non-point. Russia has plenty of nukes as well. We both have enough nukes to kill everyone. There is no advantage there.
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That's why Putin will back down.......he loves his life of luxury.

He has no choice but to watch while we destroy Assad's forces.

His military can't stop ours......they don't have the expertise, the technology or the training.

He's checkmated.

:2usflag:
 
Vox said:
That's why Putin will back down.......he loves his life of luxury.

He has no choice but to watch while we destroy Assad's forces.

His military can't stop ours......they don't have the expertise, the technology or the training.

He's checkmated.

:2usflag:
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Huh? What are you talking about? You think the elites in the U.S. don't equally care about all their luxury? Nukes isn't even a point worth bringing up. And it's not Russia alone we have to worry about, conventionally, it's what China will do. While we could stomp Russia we can't stomp both. We don't have the numbers for that and there isn't another military worth mentioning to stop them besides us as well. Hell, even North Korea could be used by China for tons of fodder.
 
Fishking said:
Huh? What are you talking about? You think the elites in the U.S. don't equally care about all their luxury? Nukes isn't even a point worth bringing up. And it's not Russia alone we have to worry about, conventionally, it's what China will do. While we could stomp Russia we can't stomp both. We don't have the numbers for that and there isn't another military worth mentioning to stop them besides us as well. Hell, even North Korea could be used by China for tons of fodder.
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China???

LOL! China would probably Nuke Russia to protect their best and primary customer........AMERICA.

They know which side their bread is buttered on.

:2usflag:
 
Vox said:
China???

LOL! China would probably Nuke Russia to protect their best and primary customer........AMERICA.

They know which side their bread is buttered on.

:2usflag:
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For now but they are flexing their muscles and may take an opportunity to try and become the new big man on campus. They are definitely angling for it. Right now they are building fake islands and arming them with missiles in the South China Sea to claim huge swaths of sea zones as theirs.

China is the real future threat, not Russia. This is further exacerbated due to the fact that we don't have the balls to do anything to put them in their place because we are so reliant on them. Look at what we did when they hacked all the personal data of millions of U.S. citizens with security clearances, which was nothing.
 
Fishking said:
For now but they are flexing their muscles and may take an opportunity to try and become the new big man on campus. They are definitely angling for it. Right now they are building fake islands and arming them with missiles in the South China Sea to claim huge swaths of sea zones as theirs.

China is the real future threat, not Russia. This is further exacerbated due to the fact that we don't have the balls to do anything to put them in their place because we are so reliant on them. Look at what we did when they hacked all the personal data of millions of U.S. citizens with security clearances, which was nothing.
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We are not reliant on China.......China is reliant on us.

Yes, we like their products......yes, we could easily survive without their products........but their economy would crash without us buying.

:2usflag:
 
Vox said:
We are not reliant on China.......China is reliant on us.

Yes, we like their products......yes, we could easily survive without their products........but their economy would crash without us buying.

:2usflag:
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Wut? No...we are definitely reliant on China. We don't make any of our own **** anymore. Further, China's culture and economy is much more able to adapt to an economic crash than we are, and make no mistake, both our economies would crash.

The war machine would get both going again and whoever came out on top would result in who's economy stayed up and who's economy would go into the dumpster.
 
Fishking said:
Wut? No...we are definitely reliant on China. We don't make any of our own **** anymore. Further, China's culture and economy is much more able to adapt to an economic crash than we are, and make no mistake, both our economies would crash.

The war machine would get both going again and whoever came out on top would result in who's economy stayed up and who's economy would go into the dumpster.
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I'm only partially in agreement with that.......but, whatever......it all feeds into the fact that there will be no war between China and the U.S.

There may be a lot of angry talk, but we're FRIENDS.

:2usflag:
 
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