Arkansas To Remove Confederate Statue In U.S. Capitol, Add Johnny Cash, Daisy Bates

[WCH]

Uh.....yes, actually. Compared to just about every other army facing similar opposition in recorded history up to that point, Sherman was incredibly lenient.

Take a look at what the Brits did in Ireland as just one example.

And considering that you are in Texas, which surrendered well before the Union launched any such campaign on your land, your hysterics are amusing.

Being in Chicago , I can see why you believe the raping, burning and pillaging of the civilian population is perfectly humane.

FWIW we don't get hysterical in TX.

 

[WCH]

Everything he said was accurate; the Confederacy was absolutely dependent on slavery, and explicitly went to war to protect it

Your feelings being hurt don’t change the facts.

The elite in the South used slave labor. The majority of those in battle did not.

Keep your critique of my feelings to yourself, tough guy.

 

[americanwoman]

For once we disagree in part want to remove them but put them where they can still be viewed. They are History, one cannot ignore it or they are doomed to repeat it. Use them as a tool to teach.

I agree they should be put somewhere where they can be viewed like a museum.

 

[WCH]

Taking down statues doesn't erase history. Glad to ease your mind about that!

Once you remove the pictures in history books and off the Internet, where will they be mentioned?

 

[WCH]

You don't speak for people in the South. I'm from the South, born, bred, lived my entire life here, and I'm thrilled the confederate statues are coming down. Stay in your lane - speak for yourself.

TN was split. Guess you still are.

 

[WCH]

Right just like no one remembers the Nazis since Germany tore down all their statues.... This argument that you are using is incredibly dumb. Why not put those statues in history museums where they belong rather than having them as monuments to cause of chattel slavery?

Many of us [on both sides] consider those as a tribute to fallen soldiers, not a romancing of slavery. That's my argument.

 

[JasperL]

uh huh. Boo hoo, I’m offended, please take down this statue, I just can’t see every day...it makes me sick, I’m shaking, boo hoo.

You're whining about censorship if the statue you like isn't allowed to stand FOREVER. It's a dumb argument. Times change, statues get replaced. Shockingly in 2019 a lot of people don't want a dead confederate loser representing the best of their state or occupying prime public spaces. Get over it snowflake.

 

[Thingfish]

You're whining about censorship if the statue you like isn't allowed to stand FOREVER. It's a dumb argument. Times change, statues get replaced. Shockingly in 2019 a lot of people don't want a dead confederate loser representing the best of their state or occupying prime public spaces. Get over it snowflake.

yeah okay frosty

 

[Tigerace117]

Being in Chicago , I can see why you believe the raping, burning and pillaging of the civilian population is perfectly humane.

FWIW we don't get hysterical in TX.

Ah yes, more hysterical whining about Chicago. I get it, you have an inferiority complex.

Atlanta was a major rail center and no sane general would have left it intact before setting off unsupported through the heartland of the enemy. That’s just basic facts buddy. And I hate to break it to you but pillaging was a normal part of warfare at that time—literally everyone, especially your beloved Confederates, did it.

Sherman’s March to the Sea gutted your beloved slaveocracy. That is the simple fact of the matter.

As for your fairy tale about Texans not being hysterical....

:lamo
Two words for you bud.


Jade. Helm.

 

[Tigerace117]

The elite in the South used slave labor. The majority of those in battle did not.

Keep your critique of my feelings to yourself, tough guy.

The common southerner was even more enthusiastic about slavery than the elites were, because they felt it kept them from being at the bottom of social pecking order.

The Confederacy could not have waged war without the suppport of the common southerner for slavery. Again,, that is simply a fact.

 

[JasperL]

Once you remove the pictures in history books and off the Internet, where will they be mentioned?

What pictures are you talking about? You said, "erase history so it will never be repeated....knowingly." I'm unclear what history you're referring to if you're now worried about pictures....

 

[JasperL]

TN was split. Guess you still are.

You speak only for you. Don't pretend your views represent all we southerners, because they do not. Very simple concept. My dad was born and raised in West Tennessee which was solid slave country. He also knew the south seceded over slavery. Not everyone in the south peddles Lost Cause BS.

 

[JasperL]

Many of us [on both sides] consider those as a tribute to fallen soldiers, not a romancing of slavery. That's my argument.

The statues coming down from the Capitol were of a lawyer and judge (founder of the Rose law firm...), and a white supremacist politician. Neither were soldiers, fallen or otherwise.

 

[JasperL]

The elite in the South used slave labor. The majority of those in battle did not.

Keep your critique of my feelings to yourself, tough guy.

OK, and the majority of those in battle were drafted, had no choice but to fight. So what's your point? It's always the "elite" who send people to war, and it's the non-elites who fight. But the elites had the support of the regular (white) people, both with regard to slavery and later Jim Crow.

 

[Port & Starboard]

It is a state by state decision and nobody else's.

The same goes for city to city.

If you don't live there........ then why should it bother you?

 

[WCH]

What pictures are you talking about? You said, "erase history so it will never be repeated....knowingly." I'm unclear what history you're referring to if you're now worried about pictures....

Your intent to take away all references to any remnant of the Confederacy. Who will remember to include that in history lessons.? Surely not those full of white guilt.

 

[WCH]

OK, and the majority of those in battle were drafted, had no choice but to fight. So what's your point? It's always the "elite" who send people to war, and it's the non-elites who fight. But the elites had the support of the regular (white) people, both with regard to slavery and later Jim Crow.

Those were Democrats who use minorities to this day for political purposes.

 

[JasperL]

Your intent to take away all references to any remnant of the Confederacy. Who will remember to include that in history lessons.? Surely not those full of white guilt.

No I'm not. I've never suggested any such thing so I'm not sure what point you think you're making by making things up and dishonestly attributing those made up beliefs to me. The Civil War is a key event in American history. Of course it should be taught in schools as part of any American history curriculum. We can do that without a statue of a dead confederate loser in a town square. Why would you think otherwise?

And as for "white guilt" the people you should lecture about that are the peddlers of Lost Cause nonsense, which is the concerted attempt by former confederates to change the history of the era, and the civil war, into a fight for noble ideals like "states' rights" and "economic freedom" versus the slavery that was the ultimate cause of secession and the war that followed. You linked to a bad example of that garbage earlier in the thread. Bottom line is pre-war the South was proud to tell us why - slavery - and afterwards that didn't sell very well and so we're bombarded with Lost Cause narratives, and the monuments are a key part of that narrative.

 

[JasperL]

Those were Democrats who use minorities to this day for political purposes.

Ah, good, the "Democrats are the REAL racists" drivel. You should alert minorities, who apparently in the view of you right wingers are too stupid to recognize that the Democratic party that they vote for, run for office as, etc. are just using them. I'm sure they'll appreciate the heads up from you right wingers.

FWIW, "those" were whites in the South. Yes, they were Democrats because Lincoln was a Republican. You might have noticed there's been a big shift since the CRA, and the parties have flipped. Back in pre-CRA era, blacks were to the extent they were allowed to vote and run for office Republicans. Now they're Democrats. White conservatives who used to all be Democrats pre-CRA are now Republican. I don't suggest that all whites in the south are racists or bigots because that's not true, but what is true is those who are don't join the Democratic party in 2019, or run for office as Democrats because they're not welcome and it would make no sense for them TO join the party that's the home for the vast majority of the area's black population.

And this thread is about monuments to dead confederates. One of them in the capitol representing Arkansas was a proud white supremacist in his era. The only people I've seen on this thread opposed to removing his statue are you right wingers. We Democrats are just fine with taking down statues of proud white supremacists in places of honor and replacing those statues with Johnny Cash and Daisy Lee Gatson, a civil rights activist.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Many of us [on both sides] consider those as a tribute to fallen soldiers, not a romancing of slavery. That's my argument.

More than 5 million German soldiers died in World War II, many of them were just fighting out of patriotism and duty to country, yet Germany does not have monuments to Nazi Leaders and Generals.

 

[Stealers Wheel]

Every American participant in the American Revolution was a traitor too, weren't they?

Yes, they were, and they knew it. The last sentence of the Declaration of Independence makes that clear:

And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

There is no doubt what would have happened to the signers of that document if the American Revolution had failed.

The Confederacy failed. The leaders of that failure should have be held to account for the quarter-million American deaths that resulted in that failure. Instead, they are revered by too many whites in the south as if their cause was just and noble.

 

[WCH]

More than 5 million German soldiers died in World War II, many of them were just fighting out of patriotism and duty to country, yet Germany does not have monuments to Nazi Leaders and Generals.

There are for the warriors themselves.

German War Memorials

 

[Deuce]

Your intent to take away all references to any remnant of the Confederacy.

You invented that part.

I've never seen a statue of a confederate general in person, and yet somehow I'm aware the confederacy existed.

Because history books still exist, genius.

 

[LouC]

Arkansas To Remove Confederate Statue In U.S. Capitol, Add Johnny Cash, Daisy Bates This just made my day.

Good for them!

Great news from the Heartland!

Sell the traitor statutes at a silent auction and use the money to help defray the cost of installing the new ones.

Win Win!!!

 

[OrphanSlug]

Another thread off the rails...

Removing statues does not remove history. The whole point of history, as an academia, is still there and all the means are still available to learn about this time period of our history.