A Question about Christ [W 77, 186]

[Logicman]

If god were a species that would make Christianity polytheistic.. so that analogy is incorrect. Your explanations fall short , since that does not appear to what to me what Christianity is trying to say. those explinations do not make Christianity appear to be consistant.

Wrong again Give it up, Ramoss.

 

[RAMOSS]

That shield is derived from the Athanasian Creed:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athanasian_Creed

The origins of that still does not make it a good argument for the description of what the belief is. When translated , using the equal word, it shows that that explanation has contradictions. The exploitation attributed to Saint Patrick , while not convincing to me, does not demonstrate the same fallacies that shield does.

 

[RAMOSS]

Wrong again Give it up, Ramoss.

Would you expand on that, and instead of just declaring things wrong, show where the logic fails? It would be nice to see something other than unsupporrted one liners and raw links, and cut/pastes from poorly written blogs

 

[Logicman]

Would you expand on that, and instead of just declaring things wrong, show where the logic fails? It would be nice to see something other than unsupporrted one liners and raw links, and cut/pastes from poorly written blogs

I have better things to do than waste my time with you.

 

[RAMOSS]

I have better things to do than waste my time with you.

yet, you waste your time with one line snarky responses, raw links, and cut/pastes from poorly written blogs. .. which do not answer or respond to the points being made.

 

[it's just me]

The origins of that still does not make it a good argument for the description of what the belief is. When translated , using the equal word, it shows that that explanation has contradictions. The exploitation attributed to Saint Patrick , while not convincing to me, does not demonstrate the same fallacies that shield does.

 

[RAMOSS]

I guess that shows that what makes logical sense might not make theological orthodoxy... and theological orthodox might not make logical sense.

 

[it's just me]

I guess that shows that what makes logical sense might not make theological orthodoxy... and theological orthodox might not make logical sense.

You have to have some familiarity.

 

[RAMOSS]

You have to have some familiarity.

That still does not stop the logical fallacies of the explanation.. which is why that piece of satire could work as humor to being with. It does show that there have been many variations and explanations of the trinity over the centuries. Perhaps the least controversial explanation is when someone throws up their hands and declares 'It's a mystery'.

 

[it's just me]

That still does not stop the logical fallacies of the explanation.. which is why that piece of satire could work as humor to being with. It does show that there have been many variations and explanations of the trinity over the centuries. Perhaps the least controversial explanation is when someone throws up their hands and declares 'It's a mystery'.

Your explanation of the Trinity is incorrect. You have the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit being the same and both the Creed and the shield say they are not.

 

[it's just me]

That still does not stop the logical fallacies of the explanation.. which is why that piece of satire could work as humor to being with. It does show that there have been many variations and explanations of the trinity over the centuries. Perhaps the least controversial explanation is when someone throws up their hands and declares 'It's a mystery'.

The video works as humor because Patrick supposedly using a metaphor to explain the Trinity was theologically unsound.

 

[RAMOSS]

The video works as humor because Patrick supposedly using a metaphor to explain the Trinity was theologically unsound.

Yet, the way that the trinity is explained via that shield is logically unsound. It makes for an interesting conundrum.

 

[John Prewett]

Exactly, Ramoss...I think this particular doctrine makes it more complicated/difficult to understand than it really is...
a doctrine that was not introduced into the congregation until the 4th century AD...not what Jesus or his apostles taught while they were on earth...

Amen ..........

 

[John Prewett]

Re: A Question about Christ [W 77]

You pretty much nailed it...whatever torturous hell there is,
we make for ourselves while we're living...when we're dead, we're dead...and no,
God is not an evil bastard who would torture people forever...

46 “And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” Matt 25

"Jesus didn't make it difficult to understand..."

 

[it's just me]

Yet, the way that the trinity is explained via that shield is logically unsound. It makes for an interesting conundrum.

I don't think it is, but then again, I am okay with God and thinking of God as infinite.

 

[RAMOSS]

I don't think it is, but then again, I am okay with God and thinking of God as infinite.

One does not have to accept the trinity to be ok with God..

 

[John Prewett]

Re: A Question about Christ [W 77]

............. Job was spoken of as being in hell while he was in the belly of the fish ...........

Jonah

 

[it's just me]

One does not have to accept the trinity to be ok with God..

This is true, many people can't get their minds around it but there is a difference between unbelief and being an enemy of the body of Christ because of it.

And that's all I have time for right now.

 

[John Prewett]

Re: A Question about Christ [W 77]

Tsk tsk...

Daniel 12:2 - "Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt."

What's the name of the place where there's "shame and EVERLASTING contempt"?

not to mention:

24 And they shall go forth and look on the corpses of the men who have transgressed against Me.
For their worm shall not die, nor shall their fire be quenched. And they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh. Isaiah 66

 

[RAMOSS]

This is true, many people can't get their minds around it but there is a difference between unbelief and being an enemy of the body of Christ because of it.

And that's all I have time for right now.

From the perspective of other religions, one does not have to be a Christian and believe in Jesus as the son of God to be ok with God.

 

[John Prewett]

Trinitarianism is insidious.

Contending Jesus “IS” God seems to honor Jesus,
but actually is a refusal to abide in the word of Jesus who identified Himself as Son OF God [John 10:36] and endorsed being identified as the Son OF God. [Matt 16]

Christians contend Jesus is the Son OF God.
Trinitarians contend Jesus IS God.

See Matt 16 Peter's confession that Jesus endorsed.

Listen to following:
"Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God." 1 John 4:15 ......

"...I [Jesus] said, I am the Son of God"” John 10:36


“And this is life eternal, that they should know thee the only true God, and him whom thou didst send, even Jesus Christ” John 17:3

“Jesus said …. go unto my brothers, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God” John 20:17

TRINITARIANS put a stumbling block in the way of the blind [Muslims and Jews].

Trinitarianism is insidious.

Contending Jesus “IS” God seems to honor Jesus,

but actually is a refusal to abide in the word of Jesus who identified Himself as Son OF God.

By contending and demanding confession that Jesus IS God, TRINITARIANS have been putting stumbling block in front of Muslims and Jews
since the state church of the Roman Empire was established on 27 February 380 with the Edict of Thessalonica,
when Emperor Theodosius I made Nicene [TRINITARIAN] "Christianity" the Empire's sole authorized religion.

The Roman empire empowered the TRINITARIAN imitation "church" that the deceived world has thought the real Church ever since.

With the Edict of Milan of 313, Constantine I gave/established tolerance for Christianity, thus at this time Christians ceased being deemed enemies of the state.

The Trinitarian cult, imposed on the Roman empire in 380ad caused Christians to be persecuted as “heretics.”

State church of the Roman Empire - Wikipedia

 

[it's just me]

From the perspective of other religions, one does not have to be a Christian and believe in Jesus as the son of God to be ok with God.

Same answer.

 

[Daisy]

Re: A Question about Christ [W 77]

Jonah

Oh yeah...thanks:3oops:...surprised no one else caught that...

 

[Logicman]

Trinitarianism is insidious.

Contending Jesus “IS” God seems to honor Jesus,
but actually is a refusal to abide in the word of Jesus who identified Himself as Son OF God [John 10:36] and endorsed being identified as the Son OF God. [Matt 16]

Christians contend Jesus is the Son OF God.
Trinitarians contend Jesus IS God.

See Matt 16 Peter's confession that Jesus endorsed.

Listen to following:
"Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God." 1 John 4:15 ......

"...I [Jesus] said, I am the Son of God"” John 10:36


“And this is life eternal, that they should know thee the only true God, and him whom thou didst send, even Jesus Christ” John 17:3

“Jesus said …. go unto my brothers, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God” John 20:17

TRINITARIANS put a stumbling block in the way of the blind [Muslims and Jews].

Trinitarianism is insidious.

Contending Jesus “IS” God seems to honor Jesus,

but actually is a refusal to abide in the word of Jesus who identified Himself as Son OF God.

By contending and demanding confession that Jesus IS God, TRINITARIANS have been putting stumbling block in front of Muslims and Jews
since the state church of the Roman Empire was established on 27 February 380 with the Edict of Thessalonica,
when Emperor Theodosius I made Nicene [TRINITARIAN] "Christianity" the Empire's sole authorized religion.

The Roman empire empowered the TRINITARIAN imitation "church" that the deceived world has thought the real Church ever since.

With the Edict of Milan of 313, Constantine I gave/established tolerance for Christianity, thus at this time Christians ceased being deemed enemies of the state.

The Trinitarian cult, imposed on the Roman empire in 380ad caused Christians to be persecuted as “heretics.”

State church of the Roman Empire - Wikipedia

The scriptures showing Jesus as the Son only, coincide with his earthly incarnation when he temporarily appeared as a man. However, there's all kinds of verses that demonstrate that Jesus is divine. Here's two separate lists of scriptures to that effect:

The Deity of Jesus

https://righterreport.com/2013/03/21/the-deity-of-jesus-christ-in-scripture/

Jesus Must Be Jehovah

https://righterreport.com/2011/09/29/jesus-must-be-jehovah-god/

 

[gfm7175]

Re: A Question about Christ [W 77]

Many of the disciples account differ drastically so at times the NT seem contradictory.

As you can see I do not believe in gods. So please don't be too angry with my account.

You would have to quote some of the things that you are confused about, but some of it has to do with how the four different Gospels focus on four different aspects of Jesus Christ. John focuses on the God aspect of Jesus Christ, Luke focuses on the man aspect of Jesus Christ. Matthew shows the lineage and kingship of Jesus Christ, and Mark shows the lowly servant side of Jesus Christ. Also, the four writers each have their own talents and backgrounds, which will account for a portion of that as well.