Women are Angry, Temporarily Powerful—and Very, Very Dangerous

reinoe said:

So it looks like, despite all the heat being thrown at Trump and the GOP, most of the rapist and abusers are liberals and other hollywood media types. How unsurprising. That they're already focusing on using this movement to destroy the careers of innocent minorities is also unsurprising. It very much reminds me of To Kill A Mockingbird...

In which a radical liberal woman tries to seduce an innocent Black man (who has only one arm) and then makes an obviously false rape accusation. The Republican Atticus Finch tries valiantly to defend him against these obvious lies, but the bloodthirsty town does not care and the obviously innocent Black man winds up convicted anyway.

It's a real life lesson on how most liberals care nothing for justice and will do and say anything to oppress minorities. Remember when Hillary Clinton said "ANYTHING COULD HAPPEN" on why she wouldn't concede the race to Obama? She was implying that he would be assassinated.

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Did you just "try" to make sexual assault political? More specifically try to imply its a liberal issue? Wow, congratulations YOU and views like yours are PART OF THE PROBLEM . . SMH

Signed a woman who leans right

Kal'Stang said:

Sexual assault (be it real or fake) is not a "liberal" or "conservative" thing. Why not address the actual topic instead of going after the opposing aisle with partisan drivel?

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Damn it you beat me to it but i basically said something similar. Completely repulsive to make this a right or left thing.

LaylaWindu said:

Did you just "try" to make sexual assault political? More specifically try to imply its a liberal issue? Wow, congratulations YOU and views like yours are PART OF THE PROBLEM . . SMH

Signed a woman who leans right

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I think women who make false accusations for the sake for the sake of attacking people and ruining careers are part of the problem. That it's the leftists who have weaponized sexual assault allegations for their own purposes is a fault of leftists. You should take it up with them.

reinoe said:

I think women who make false accusations for the sake for the sake of attacking people and ruining careers are part of the problem. That it's the leftists who have weaponized sexual assault allegations for their own purposes is a fault of leftists. You should take it up with them.

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Like I has soon as you claim it's a leftist thing you are part of the problem with them. I don't take up with either you or false accusers because your actions are both disgusting. :shrug:

truthatallcost said:

I've been worried that our current national climate of punishing men for sexual harassment would eventual spiral out of control, resulting in women abusing our willingness to listen... and it's happened.

Ansari is a married man, so infidelity is his only wrongdoing here, which I'm sure most of us would agree isn't something the world needs to know about.

We need to stand up and give women like this the collective boot when they try to compare this to sexual assault, which Grace is doing. Otherwise, we risk damaging men's lives who don't deserve it.

To be blunt, if you're a woman who throws herself at a man, then let's him eat you out at his apartment, then denies him any reciprocal exchange... that makes you a lousy date, not a sexual assault victim!

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Gee whiz, now women might make the same decision to take advantage of men and ruin their lives like men have been doing for centuries...and many still object to having to stop (or refuse to admit it's wrong: see Roy Moore.)

It makes women horrible and uncontrollable now! And men...still 'just being men' :roll:

There's no 'war on men,' what a pathetic victim would have to be to claim that.

It's not a surprise or unusual. When the social pendulum swings, it swings back comparable with where it originated. It takes awhile to moderate.

Very sorry good men today might end up suffering the way women have for centuries. I hope that things self-correct soon.

truthatallcost said:

I've been worried that our current national climate of punishing men for sexual harassment would eventual spiral out of control, resulting in women abusing our willingness to listen... and it's happened.

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One anonymous allegation of sexual assault, where the woman is not pressing charges, is things getting "out of control?" Seriously?

We need to stand up and give women like this the collective boot when they try to compare this to sexual assault, which Grace is doing. Otherwise, we risk damaging men's lives who don't deserve it.

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Oh, sort of like the way men have ignored and denigrated women who report abuse for pretty much all of human history? Yeah, that worked out well.

To be blunt, if you're a woman who throws herself at a man, then let's him eat you out at his apartment, then denies him any reciprocal exchange... that makes you a lousy date, not a sexual assault victim!

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Wow. Just... Wow.

Here's her description of events:
https://babe.net/2018/01/13/aziz-ansari-28355

If her allegations are true (which is not necessarily the case), then he acted like a ****ing creep to her the second they got into the apartment. She told him to slow down, said no several times, kept dropping hints, and he kept shoving his fingers in her mouth, groping her, and pushing her to do things she didn't want to do. At one point she thought he got the hint, but: Nope, he kept at it. No one, male or female, is obligated to "reciprocate" like you describe, no one "owes" anything on a first date or because you enter their apartment. He was even being aggressive after she told him she wanted to leave.

Ansari hasn't denied the events. He's said he thought it was consensual, and he felt bad about it when she told him how she felt about it.

Is this assault? I'm not sure, and it is an anonymous account. If her description is generally correct, and it isn't assault: It's still very creepy, and right on the line -- especially given that Ansari is supporting Time's Up.

At any rate, the idea that this is some sort of final straw that indicates the end of #MeToo is little more than wishful thinking. Men have pulled this kind of crap (and much worse) for decades, and outing harassers and assaulters is going to go on for some time. You might want to get used to it.

Well, his first mistake was go right to licking the pooper on the first date. You save tonguing the brown eyed starfish until at LEAST the 3rd time you bang, or so....

Lursa said:

Gee whiz, now women might make the same decision to take advantage of men and ruin their lives like men have been doing for centuries...and many still object to having to stop (or refuse to admit it's wrong: see Roy Moore.)

It makes women horrible and uncontrollable now! And men...still 'just being men' :roll:

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This thread wasn't supposed to be a Men vs Women argument. Do you have an opinion on Aziz Ansari's situation?

Visbek said:

One anonymous allegation of sexual assault, where the woman is not pressing charges, is things getting "out of control?" Seriously?



Oh, sort of like the way men have ignored and denigrated women who report abuse for pretty much all of human history? Yeah, that worked out well.



Wow. Just... Wow.

Here's her description of events:
https://babe.net/2018/01/13/aziz-ansari-28355

If her allegations are true (which is not necessarily the case), then he acted like a ****ing creep to her the second they got into the apartment. She told him to slow down, said no several times, kept dropping hints, and he kept shoving his fingers in her mouth, groping her, and pushing her to do things she didn't want to do. At one point she thought he got the hint, but: Nope, he kept at it. No one, male or female, is obligated to "reciprocate" like you describe, no one "owes" anything on a first date or because you enter their apartment. He was even being aggressive after she told him she wanted to leave.

Ansari hasn't denied the events. He's said he thought it was consensual, and he felt bad about it when she told him how she felt about it.

Is this assault? I'm not sure, and it is an anonymous account. If her description is generally correct, and it isn't assault: It's still very creepy, and right on the line -- especially given that Ansari is supporting Time's Up.

At any rate, the idea that this is some sort of final straw that indicates the end of #MeToo is little more than wishful thinking. Men have pulled this kind of crap (and much worse) for decades, and outing harassers and assaulters is going to go on for some time. You might want to get used to it.

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Here are some takeaways from the OP that I wanted to get across:

-The thread was intended to illustrate how the #metoo movement can be used as blackmail by unscrupulous women.

- If you throw yourself at a man because he's rich and famous, be prepared for him to invite you back to his apartment on the first date.

- When he invites you back to his apartment on the first date, and you say Yes, be prepared to assume that he thinks you want to get freaky.

- Either differentiate between legitimate sexual assault victims and opportunists, or be prepared for men to think the #metoo movement is just another scheme to dig for gold.

Crovax said:

I dont think so the "leader" of the #metoo moment Ashley Judd has praised James Franco's not refuting the allegations against him. We are at a place where being innocent and fighting the allegations derives more scorn that if you had actually done the whatever the accusations were. This is not a good place to be.

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Ashley Judd isn't a very good spokesperson for this movement imo. I heard her on BBC radio last night rambling on about 'toxic masculinity, patriarchy, & white male privilege', which to my ears sounds exactly like...

truthatallcost said:

Here are some takeaways from the OP that I wanted to get across:

-The thread was intended to illustrate how the #metoo movement can be used as blackmail by unscrupulous women.

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You said absolutely nothing of the sort in post #1. You suggested that Grace's complaint was "out of control," that people would stop listening to complaints about assault or harassment, and that "we" (who "we," exactly?) should give women like Grace "the boot" (whatever that means). You then justified potentially abusive behavior.

Your characterization of Grace's approach is completely unjustified. Grace did not demand payment in exchange for silence. She did not threaten to expose him. She hasn't filed a lawsuit, or called the police. She didn't threaten him in any way, nor has Ansari indicated anything remotely along those lines.

She wrote up her account because she saw him wearing a Time's Up pin at the Golden Globes, and it drove home to her the vast gulf between his public reputation as a guy who "gets it," and the creep who got way too aggressive when they were on a date.

- If you throw yourself at a man because he's rich and famous, be prepared for him to invite you back to his apartment on the first date.

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What the ****?

She went on a date with him. She wasn't shocked that he invited her home. She wasn't shocked that things got a bit physical. What she objected to was his high level of sexual aggression; and how when she thought he would chill out, he just amped it up.

- When he invites you back to his apartment on the first date, and you say Yes, be prepared to assume that he thinks you want to get freaky.

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No, that's bull****. When a woman enters an apartment, she is under no obligation to spread her legs and do whatever the man wants.

HonestJoe said:

I think it’s unfair to term this as the movement turning in to something else.

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I do not sadly. Women and children being coerced into situations where they are disadvantaged is something we all need to take very seriously. I think it's important with the me-too movement not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. It's not really a movement per say there are no leaders there is no hierarchy it is a trend.

One thing that would lend it credibility is to call out false accusations. This Feller asked her to perform a sexual act and she obliged. That is not sexual assault.

The questionable aspects of some people jumping on a bandwagon doesn’t mean the motives and intentions of all the others involved are suddenly less valid.

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I agree but it does take away from The credibility.

There certainly is a responsibility for those people to weed out the opportunists and nitwits though to be fair, this is only possible because we all failed as a society, and various sub-groups within it, to weed out the abusers and rapists in the first place.

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I would say it's not their Duty to weed out abusers. All they really have to do to regain credibility is simply denounce them.

molten_dragon said:

I wonder how many of the women who are cheering "Grace" on for bravely standing up and reporting her "assault" to the media (not to law enforcement you'll notice) are the same women who complain that sexual assault claims aren't taken seriously enough by the public. And importantly, how many of those women see no connection between these two things.

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You have made a very important observation. They did not report it to authorities.

And something this does is takeaway credibility from people who really are victims.

ttwtt78640 said:

One can't anonymously report a crime where the only evidence is what they personally allege had occurred. The state simply has no evidence to support charges that have any chance of holding up in court. This #metoo system allows a "conviction" in the press with absolutely no need for an arrest or trial. As a bonus, they get to harass those that dare interact with the accused monster since "they may not have known then but they surely know now" to no longer treat that monster as a human. Once outed, by some "Grace" like accusers, those monsters are now to be treated as registered (by the press and/or #metoo club) sex offenders for life.

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So it's about power?

truthatallcost said:

This thread wasn't supposed to be a Men vs Women argument. Do you have an opinion on Aziz Ansari's situation?

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I did discuss the OP. If you didnt want it discussed, you shouldnt have brought it up:

truthatallcost said:

I've been worried that our current national climate of punishing men for sexual harassment would eventual spiral out of control, resulting in women abusing our willingness to listen... and it's happened.

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truthatallcost said:

Here are some takeaways from the OP that I wanted to get across:

-The thread was intended to illustrate how the #metoo movement can be used as blackmail by unscrupulous women.

- If you throw yourself at a man because he's rich and famous, be prepared for him to invite you back to his apartment on the first date.

- When he invites you back to his apartment on the first date, and you say Yes, be prepared to assume that he thinks you want to get freaky.

- Either differentiate between legitimate sexual assault victims and opportunists, or be prepared for men to think the #metoo movement is just another scheme to dig for gold.

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There is zero new in that list. Nothing. Women always could, men always did, yada yada yada.

So, what is the point of your thread then?

truthatallcost said:

It's turning into a movement that has nothing to do with social justice or equality. Women involved in the movement need to be the first to weed out the opportunists and nitwits, like the woman in the OP.

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This is what happens when a movement gets hijacked for personal or political gain. Someone will get screwed...




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truthatallcost said:

It's turning into a movement that has nothing to do with social justice or equality. Women involved in the movement need to be the first to weed out the opportunists and nitwits, like the woman in the OP.

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Huh...what men have we seen coming forward BEfORE a woman accused a man of harassment or abuse? What men have come forward to weed out abusive men? Men taking advantage of women. Who have they accused? Name some.

Lursa said:

There is zero new in that list. Nothing. Women always could, men always did, yada yada yada.

So, what is the point of your thread then?

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Well in your case, it looks like the point is, Women Are Angry....

truthatallcost said:

Well in your case, it looks like the point is, Women Are Angry....

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Again...after centuries or longer of such harassment and abuse...who wouldnt be?

The pendulum is swinging in proportion to the abuse....

I see you had no real response, just going on defense..

truthatallcost said:

I've been worried that our current national climate of punishing men for sexual harassment would eventual spiral out of control, resulting in women abusing our willingness to listen... and it's happened.

Ansari is a married man, so infidelity is his only wrongdoing here, which I'm sure most of us would agree isn't something the world needs to know about.

We need to stand up and give women like this the collective boot when they try to compare this to sexual assault, which Grace is doing. Otherwise, we risk damaging men's lives who don't deserve it.

To be blunt, if you're a woman who throws herself at a man, then let's him eat you out at his apartment, then denies him any reciprocal exchange... that makes you a lousy date, not a sexual assault victim!

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iv harassed people on their social accounts it is abuse

some one letting you touch them dosent give you special privileges to them after words

i was horny and sure i would never get any when i did that bull**** whats wrong with you?

Visbek said:

You said absolutely nothing of the sort in post #1. You suggested that Grace's complaint was "out of control," that people would stop listening to complaints about assault or harassment, and that "we" (who "we," exactly?) should give women like Grace "the boot" (whatever that means). You then justified potentially abusive behavior.

Your characterization of Grace's approach is completely unjustified. Grace did not demand payment in exchange for silence. She did not threaten to expose him. She hasn't filed a lawsuit, or called the police. She didn't threaten him in any way, nor has Ansari indicated anything remotely along those lines.

She wrote up her account because she saw him wearing a Time's Up pin at the Golden Globes, and it drove home to her the vast gulf between his public reputation as a guy who "gets it," and the creep who got way too aggressive when they were on a date.

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You don't think that trying to ruin the man's reputation with his fans is on par with all those things you mentioned? Ansari would probably prefer to dole out a few bucks, then to have someone trying to ruin his standing in entertainment.

What the ****?

She went on a date with him. She wasn't shocked that he invited her home. She wasn't shocked that things got a bit physical.

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Lets review what the story says about those two things (going to Ansaris apartment, and 'getting a bit physical'.)

1. Grace says Aziz rushed through dinner, and wanted to get her back to his place ASAP. Hello?! Has Grace never heard of a booty call? He was being polite to offer dinner, but Grace should have known what going back to his apartment meant. No diamond ring waiting back there. No horse and carriage either.

2. You call 30 minutes of blowjobs & oral sex 'getting a bit physical'? Grace says she was mumbling her objections to having actual intercourse. How is it Aziz' fault that he didn't know what she was saying? It's not.

Aziz is not a Harvey Weinstein or a Bill Cosby type. Let's stop pretending like he's a bad guy for being unable to read minds, or understand mumbling.

What she objected to was his high level of sexual aggression; and how when she thought he would chill out, he just amped it up.

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None of that is reason enough to blab to the world about what happened. Aziz did the right thing by calling Grace an Uber, and apologizing afterwards. Grace DIDN'T do the right thing, which would be to realize her own naivety for thinking a movie star was going to make her his gf at the drop of a hat, & accept Aziz' apology with the new knowledge of a life lesson learned.

No, that's bull****. When a woman enters an apartment, she is under no obligation to spread her legs and do whatever the man wants.

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Think about it from a realistic point of view. Imagine that some movie star who you think is hot or cool invites you back to his apartment after barely knowing you. See what I mean? 23 is too old to not know what a booty call is. The chick is just mad that she didn't get what she wanted out of the deal.

Lursa said:

Again...after centuries or longer of such harassment and abuse...who wouldnt be?

The pendulum is swinging in proportion to the abuse....

I see you had no real response, just going on defense..

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Then I guess it's revenge time, because of 'centuries of abuse'. Don't say I didn't warn you when men start saying #sowhat to #metoo.

truthatallcost said:

Then I guess it's revenge time, because of 'centuries of abuse'. Don't say I didn't warn you when men start saying #sowhat to #metoo.

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No, that's not the same as a *reaction* which is what that pendulum swinging is. And it's proportionate to where it originated.

And if men choose to lower themselves (still) instead of reacting like they recognize the pain and disrespect that women have suffered all this time, then the pendulum swings will not lose momentum and not normalize.