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Thread: Thomas Jefferson

  1. #21
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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    I am asking here for referral to reliable sources concering this issue:

    Who, if anyone, ever pointed out at the time to Thomas Jefferson the groteque contradiction of shouting that "All Men Are Created Equal"
    while simultaneously being a slave owner, supporting slavery, and opposing women's right to vote?

    I mean at the time the document was released?
    When it was debated.
    Who spoke up, and said,......."UH, hold on. Shouldn't that say all PERSONS are created equal, so it includes blacks and women?"

    Yeah he said he had the wolf by the ears. But who called him on his Bullsh**>?
    God, this has got to be the most hackneyed crap ever. Do some friggin' research before spewing trite LW bull****. Most of the founding fathers who owned slaves were highly conflicted on the topic. But trying to judge them by the social mores of two and a quarter centuries later is a fool's errand.
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  2. #22
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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by DebateChallenge View Post
    Back then the word “man” and the rights that came along with it only applied to white adult males who owned land. Times have changed since then, of course, but things were done differently back in that day and age. But as other posters have pointed out, this has nothing to do with the gun debate. Your OP doesn’t belong in this folder.
    I will explain why it might. One of the current tactics of those who try to undermine the second amendment is by trying to undermine the standing of our founders. they claim Jefferson, et al, were hypocrites, slave owners etc, so by definition,the constitution in general, and the second amendment specifically, should be ignored.
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    Yeah; a shotgun IS a rifle; it uses a different load.
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    You know that Reagan signed the Brady Bill - right?
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    I'm smart on the gun issue and what we need to do about it.

  3. #23
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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Wow someone showed up with a big chip on their shoulder. If they care I reported most of their posts for what they were. Maybe another site would suit them better.

  4. #24
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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    Good to see your "veteran" status has not made YOU at all pompous, snide or arrogant.
    Thanks, though I'm not sure why one would have anything to do with the others.

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    Your warmth and tolerance are overwhelming, Taylor. Have a nice day.
    Nice of you to notice. Hope you have a nice day too.

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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    I am asking here for referral to reliable sources concering this issue:

    Who, if anyone, ever pointed out at the time to Thomas Jefferson the groteque contradiction of shouting that "All Men Are Created Equal"
    while simultaneously being a slave owner, supporting slavery, and opposing women's right to vote?

    I mean at the time the document was released?
    When it was debated.
    Who spoke up, and said,......."UH, hold on. Shouldn't that say all PERSONS are created equal, so it includes blacks and women?"

    Yeah he said he had the wolf by the ears. But who called him on his Bullsh**>?
    Take a look at the book Jefferson, by Saul K Padover, 1942; Konecky & Konecky. Jefferson was a widower with many kids and a large farm. He was also gone a great deal and needed people to help him raise his kids and manage his estate. At the time, slaves were about the best way men without much spending money could cope. The same thing happened to my own ancestor: 6 girls, two boys and 400 acres.

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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    Thank you for being so polite, patient, tolerant and helpful to a newcomer Captain Adverse.
    Clearly what people say about you is completely false.
    If I mistakenly posted in the wrong forum category, I humbly apologize to your greatness.
    .
    .
    .
    what do people say about him?

  7. #27
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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post
    Cougarbear, could you please cut-and-paste a quote of me saying anywhere that I "hate the United States"?

    No? You can't? Then would you like to apologize for that blatant lie and patheticly dishonest attack?

    You sound like the person who says, "You don't like Hitler? Then you obviously hate Germany!"

    Or maybe, "If you don't love Trump, you must hate America!" I think that is the current version.

    I guess I'm just not the genius constitutional scholar you clearly are. It appeared to me to be a document
    subject to perpetual revision, even to the point of establishing a monarchy if so voted. But I guess I'm too stupid to read
    correctly.

    If Jefferson was "only 33" and you use this as an excuse for his mistakes, how do you justify calling that "utterly fantastic"?
    Clearly they knew it wasn't, because the Articles of Confederation soon collapsed.

    The ENTIRE POINT of our history and government IS to constantly criticize and evolve it.

    As for slavery, are you claiming that Jefferson, Washington and all the rest were Prohibitied by, as you say "the laws back then" from REFRAINING
    from buying slaves in the first place? Are you claiming that at any time they could not set their slaves free?

    No?

    maybe you need to go lie down and take a nap, Cougarbear. The adults are talking now.
    You might want to look at the laws about slave ownership and whether they could just set slaves free. You would be enlightened on why they had to keep those slaves until their deaths.

    With respect to what evolves and what doesn't, the Bill of Rights evolves. The rest does not. There will always be 3 branches of Government as long as the people don't simply discard the entire Constitution to fundamentally change America, exactly what Progressives want to do. Although, I would argue we are in a state of post-Constitution because of the extremely large Federal Government. But, we still have 3 branches of Government.

    A person doesn't need to state the words, "I hate America" to hate America. Rep. Omar is a great example as well as the other 3 musketteers. Obama hated America as well. That's why he wanted to fundamentally change America. Somehow, get rid of the Constitution and Declaration of Independence. Still the Progressive's design. That's why they call everyone who doesn't agree with them racists. Anyone who doesn't agree with socialism is a racist. Anyone who doesn't agree with open boarders is a racist. So, maybe you should stop calling everyone racists because they disagree with you

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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by bearcat22 View Post

    Yeah he said he had the wolf by the ears. But who called him on his Bullsh**>?
    You miss the point completely. Jefferson was a brave revolutionary genius whose first concern was his own freedom and the freedom of people like him. Obviously after a million years of no freedom for anybody this represented one of the greatest advancements in all of human history. This is why we love him beyond words. It wasn't the end of freedom any more than the Wright Brothers were the end of flying? Does the liberal understand now?

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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by Bullseye View Post
    God, this has got to be the most hackneyed crap ever. Do some friggin' research before spewing trite LW bull****. Most of the founding fathers who owned slaves were highly conflicted on the topic. But trying to judge them by the social mores of two and a quarter centuries later is a fool's errand.
    yes its called presentism but liberals are shameless so how would they know that?

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    Re: Thomas Jefferson

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I will explain why it might. One of the current tactics of those who try to undermine the second amendment is by trying to undermine the standing of our founders. they claim Jefferson, et al, were hypocrites, slave owners etc, so by definition,the constitution in general, and the second amendment specifically, should be ignored.
    yes its called deconstruction. Some even attack the language we use itself. I mean look at the long checkered past. It was used by the Romans as they raped and plundered their way across the globe!

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