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Too Many Guns, Another Example

CaughtInThe said:
what else can you say. it's not like i can't post stories of women getting blown away in every fashion and in every circumstance by their husbands/boyfriends/exes.

it's really weird that once i brought attention to a real problem where kids are orphaned (with their dad locked up or dead) that you guys started attacking me.

really, really weird stuff. talk about being on the wrong side of an argument.
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Have you any evidence that the women you refer to would be alive if there was no gun involved?
 
Bullseye said:
UH, yeah, that's where the "probably" comes in....
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Er no, you don't understand English

"Probably" means there is a high likelihood of something happening. "Probably not" means there is a low likelihood of something happening.


As shown, there is is high likelihood of police using a national registry (though not in every case).

Literally hundreds of thousands of times per year.




So, then we don't need a registry.
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How so ?


Wouldn't a national registry not add data for law enforcement to call upon ?
 
TurtleDude said:
what makes things easier for the police is not more valuable than the rights of the citizens. This is why we are not a police state. Having been in law enforcement for 30 years I can tell you that these rights are far more vexing to police and prosecutors than the second amendment

1) fourth amendment-requiring a warrant to search a suspect's home etc

2) Miranda warnings-a court created "right" that has caused numerous prosecutions and arrests to go south when the police failed to warn someone that they can refuse to talk to cops and they can request an attorney at any time

3) Gideon "rights" "If you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed for you"

4) Presumption of Innocence. the burden is on the state to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt

5) double jeopardy.

All of those rights hinder prosecution and investigations but we are supposed to be a free society where it is better 10 guilty go free than one innocent man hanged.
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So the police shouldn't finger print you ever ?

I'm hardly the policeman's best friend and there are reasons why we guard against police power. In this case though, despite your claim that a mandatory gun register wouldn't help law enforcement, you are wrong.


Restrictions on police power are to protect the innocent, how does having the details of a gun on file, not protect a law abiding citizen?
 
TurtleDude said:
Think this through

Rich wants to ban all guns

Rich admits he wants to disarm victims and he doesn't care if they are disarmed before violent criminals are

Rich wants a registry.

Why? because a registry helps facilitate a gun ban
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Well it would but you're adamant in your certainty that such a ban will never be passed into US law.


So, aside from your paranoia, why do you oppose a mandatory gun registry. What harm could it do to the innocent?
 
Court Jester said:
Checked the dozens of guns in my gun safe-- as well as the half dozen of other loaded firearms laying around my house, and still none of them has suddenly killed anyone.

Pretty good record going on nearly 50 years I'd say!
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So after how many years should we be certain that a gun won't be deliberately mis-used.
 
Fledermaus said:
So there was no purpose in posting her picture.
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dude. go back and read. it was an example for a specific post.

did somebody cut the oxygen to the US today???
 
Rich2018 said:
Well it would but you're adamant in your certainty that such a ban will never be passed into US law.


So, aside from your paranoia, why do you oppose a mandatory gun registry. What harm could it do to the innocent?
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When, not if but when, the database of registered guns is hacked and posted online it will subject gun owners to unesecary harassment from rabid anti gun zealots and put them at unnecessary risk to criminals who will have a virtual shopping list of firearms to choose from. IMO the downsides out way the minimal benefit law enforcement may see.
 
Chillfolks said:
When, not if but when, the database of registered guns is hacked and posted online it will subject gun owners to unesecary harassment from rabid anti gun zealots and put them at unnecessary risk to criminals who will have a virtual shopping list of firearms to choose from. IMO the downsides out way the minimal benefit law enforcement may see.
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Oh right !!!


So you don't have a checking account, a driver's licence, a credit card, a passport...


Wait, do you have a CCW ? - you know that the details of all such holders are kept on a computer database right ?
 
Rich2018 said:
Oh right !!!


So you don't have a checking account, a driver's licence, a credit card, a passport...


Wait, do you have a CCW ? - you know that the details of all such holders are kept on a computer database right ?
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Checking account that I don't use online same with my credit cards, except for the one dedicated for online use. I manage the risk as much as possible.

A CCW doesn't mean that I own a gun. Don't you supposedly have a CCP but don't own any firearms.

What your asking is for someone to open themselves up to being targets to criminals by listening what type of firearms they own. I'm not willing to put my family in danger for your idiotic feel good purposel. Therefore will oppose any form of registration.
 
Chillfolks said:
Checking account that I don't use online same with my credit cards, except for the one dedicated for online use. I manage the risk as much as possible....
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But if you have a credit card and/or a checking account your details are on a computer database...why do you take the risk of your details being hacked ?

A CCW doesn't mean that I own a gun. Don't you supposedly have a CCP but don't own any firearms.
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Of course not, I have a CCW issed by the state of Georgia but own no gun
My details are still on a computer database as are yours if you have a CCW - so do you have one ?


What your asking is for someone to open themselves up to being targets to criminals by listening what type of firearms they own. I'm not willing to put my family in danger for your idiotic feel good purposel. Therefore will oppose any form of registration.
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But are you willing to put your family at risk by opening yourself to targeting by criminals by having the details of your income, cash holdings and financial records on file

And aren't owning guns supposed to be a deterrent against physical attack ?


And doesn't having a CCW mark you as a (likely) gun owner - someone hacking that database might publish your name and address on the 'Net. And your family could be targeted by criminals.
 
Rich2018 said:
But if you have a credit card and/or a checking account your details are on a computer database...why do you take the risk of your details being hacked ?
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I trust my local bank and the security they have in place more than I do the federal government. One has never been hacked the other has.

Of course not, I have a CCW issed by the state of Georgia but own no gun
My details are still on a computer database as are yours if you have a CCW - so do you have one ?
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That's between me and my state and isn't any of your concern.




But are you willing to put your family at risk by opening yourself to targeting by criminals by having the details of your income, cash holdings and financial records on file
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A magnitude less risky than advertising what guns are in my home. If the government required a database of the exact cash I had on hand then you would have a legitimate comparison.
And aren't owning guns supposed to be a deterrent against physical attack ?
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They are, but part of that is whomever breaks in doesn't know if they will meet someone lwho only has there pecker in their hands or someone who has a pistol.
And doesn't having a CCW mark you as a (likely) gun owner - someone hacking that database might publish your name and address on the 'Net. And your family could be targeted by criminals.
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Having a CCP doesn't provide information either way. There are probably people like you who hold one but don't have any weapons. I've used mine as a second form of ID more than it being asked for by a LEO. Having a registration would provide details of the exact number make model and caliber. I see a huge difference in the two, they are not equivalent.
 
Casper said:
You seem to think it is legal gun owners that are shooting into the air, we both know who enjoys that activity and it isn't people that obey the law. So go get their guns, good luck, you will need it
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Excuse 3.1


Illegally owned guns are seized all the time.
 
Chillfolks said:
I trust my local bank and the security they have in place more than I do the federal government. One has never been hacked the other has.
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Clearly you just pulled that out of your @ss and did zero research. Have you never heard of the data breach that Capital One suffered?


Capital One Breach Shows a Bank Hacker Needs Just One Gap to Wreak Havoc - The New York Times


That's between me and my state and isn't any of your concern.
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So you'd trust your state to keep your records safe on a CCW database, but not the federal government's database on a gun registry

Interesting that you'd admit to owning a gun but not to a CCW
Could it be your argument (such that you have one) is falling apart here


A magnitude less risky than advertising what guns are in my home...
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Capital One (above)


They are, but part of that is whomever breaks in doesn't know if they will meet someone lwho only has there pecker in their hands or someone who has a pistol.
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They'd be less likely to rob you if they DID know you were armed with a gun


More likely to rob you if there was a chance you were unarmed ?


Having a CCP doesn't provide information either way....
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But data about those who have one, and I'm assuming you do, is kept on a computer database you claim that you're so afraid of being hacked.

Why would you not fear your details being on a state database but fear them being on a federal one ?
 
calamity said:
Celebratory gunfire, now there's something that wasn't around when I was growing up in the 70's. Today, it's all the rage.

Well, meet last night's victim.

Family loses matriarch after she's killed, likely by celebratory gunfire in N. Harris Co.

Yes, we are looking at one more reason we need to get guns under control. It's literally nuts out there these days because of them.
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HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! What a ridiculous reason to attack the 2nd Amendment. One person dies by accident while hundreds die in big cities from gang warfare where none of the gang shootings happened with legally obtained guns. Evil people will do evil things regardless of the preventative measures. See, the bullet that killed this unfortunate woman probably came from a gunman high on pot. Colorado and all. Liberals legalize a drug for recreational purposes and try to make illegal something all people have a right to. Not to mention the 480,000 people that are still alive this year because they had a gun when personally attacked. One person is killed because of Colorado pothead shooting off a gun on New Years Eve. Get a grip Liberals.
 
Casper said:
Which means criminals have access to more and will continue to have the avenue.
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And where do they get their guns from?
Every gun in the USA (except maybe home made guns) were legally held at one time.


Also do you ascribe "good luck" to officers seizing illegally held guns on a daily basis across the USA ?
 
Rich2018 said:
Clearly you just pulled that out of your @ss and did zero research. Have you never heard of the data breach that Capital One suffered?


Capital One Breach Shows a Bank Hacker Needs Just One Gap to Wreak Havoc - The New York Times




So you'd trust your state to keep your records safe on a CCW database, but not the federal government's database on a gun registry

Interesting that you'd admit to owning a gun but not to a CCW
Could it be your argument (such that you have one) is falling apart here




Capital One (above)





They'd be less likely to rob you if they DID know you were armed with a gun


More likely to rob you if there was a chance you were unarmed ?





But data about those who have one, and I'm assuming you do, is kept on a computer database you claim that you're so afraid of being hacked.

Why would you not fear your details being on a state database but fear them being on a federal one ?
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Capital One has had a breech.... And you want MORE personal information to include addresses and firearms owned available to hackers?
 
Rich2018 said:
Clearly you just pulled that out of your @ss and did zero research. Have you never heard of the data breach that Capital One suffered?


Capital One Breach Shows a Bank Hacker Needs Just One Gap to Wreak Havoc - The New York Times
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Besides they high interest rates their poor security is one of the reasons I don't bank with Capital One.
So you'd trust your state to keep your records safe on a CCW database, but not the federal government's database on a gun registry
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A CCP databases provides no details about if you do own a weapon or not much less a detailed description of all the firearms you own.
Interesting that you'd admit to owning a gun but not to a CCW
Could it be your argument (such that you have one) is falling apart here
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It's not falling apart in the least. You just arent honest enough to admit having a CCP database is not the same as having a detailed list of all firearms owned.
Capital One (above)

[/quoye]
Don't use them

They'd be less likely to rob you if they DID know you were armed with a gun


More likely to rob you if there was a chance you were unarmed ?
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Not true. Guns are valuable to theives. If you're going to break in when noone is home why not target a house you know has valuable items in it verse just wishing to find something of value.
But data about those who have one, and I'm assuming you do, is kept on a computer database you claim that you're so afraid of being hacked.

Why would you not fear your details being on a state database but fear them being on a federal one ?
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Again this time read it slower see if that helps. A CCP database doesn't show anyone if you even own a gun. A registry would not only show if you did but exactly what types and how many you own. Do you see the difference yet?
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Rich2018 said:
Er no, you don't understand English

"Probably" means there is a high likelihood of something happening. "Probably not" means there is a low likelihood of something happening.


As shown, there is is high likelihood of police using a national registry (though not in every case).

Literally hundreds of thousands of times per year.
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That's not what's been shown. Your examples come nowhere near being a national registry.





Rich2018 said:
How so ?


Wouldn't a national registry not add data for law enforcement to call upon ?
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You just showed they already have that.
 
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