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US to lift ban on elephant hunting trophy imports

jaeger19 said:
Yeah.. so says a fellow that's never hunting dangerous game. or probably never hunted. There is definite skill in hunting an elephant. You have to go out day after day generally.. long hard days of walking, following elephant spoor.. and then when you find them.. generally its in very tough cover, and you have to stalk within basically maybe 50 yards or closer.. of one of the most dangerous of animals. While a herd.. with excellent hearing, excellent sense of smell.. and all capable of turning you into a bloody, muddy mess.. mills around. And then.. when and a huge IF you get close enough to the one animal that is appropriate to take.. then you have to be able to put a killing shot into an area not much bigger than a football, with your adrenaline pumping so hard that your hands shake.. And then hope its a clean kill and the rest of the herd doesn't decide to turn you into mush.
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I have absolutely no use for sport hunters. As I said -- I'd like to put them all on an island and watch them hunt one another.

I get requests every year for hunters to hunt my land and every year I tell them NO, unless they've already tagged a deer, and then I allow them to track it.

Sport hunting, however is not a sport -- it's a mental illness.

All the hardships you described, the long walks, the sneaking around -- all of them are for wienies. In the end it comes down to an animal and a high-powered rifle and that's no sport. That's simply what some men do to compensate for their "shortcomings" in other areas. Any couch potato can pull it off.

Those who thrill to the kill are worth keeping an eye on.

As far as your last sentence goes -- I'm rooting for the herd to turn the hunting party into mush.
 
Manc Skipper said:
The Donald has frozen the reversal of the ban for now. Those elephants better get busy thanking him ASAP!
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"Nice try" said an anonymous elephant. "But we never forget!"
 
American said:
Why don't you explain to us the technical aspects of how that would work?
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Why should I, the joke obviously went over your head. Judging by the response from the gun huggers, I would say I hit a nerve.
 
Goshin said:
The venom and lack of understanding in this thread, towards hunters, is quite remarkable.

Specific to the hunting of elephants and lions,etc in Africa: I am given to understand that licensed legal hunters are only allowed to take animals that are sicky or are causing problems for humans in the area, or which are deemed to be "excess population" beyond what the area can easily support. The licenses and so forth are quite expensive and the money is used to fund conservation efforts in the region... indeed, it is my understanding many conservation parks could not exist without the funds provided by lawful hunters.
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When those situations occur, and I'm sure they do, they should be handled by the park rangers. Individuals with obvious mental illnesses should not be encouraged to look at killing as a sport.

As far as money for conservation goes -- get it another way.

I am given to understand that the meat of the animal typically goes to the nearest village, at least in some countries, providing some relief from the lack of sustenance to which many African villages are subjected.
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I specifically said that hunting for food was allowable. Let those who need the food hunt in that case. Keep the crazies out.

As for hunting in general, "sport" or otherwise... in America, hardly anyone hunts out of actual necessity. However, most hunters do use the meat. Offhand I don't know of anyone, even those who do take "trophies", who do not also keep and consume the meat, often giving some of it away to people they know.
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I've seen the rotting carcasses of headless deer. I do, however, agree that most hunters, at least those around here, want the meat. The problem is the trophy hunters who wouldn't know how to clean a deer if they tried.

Even with a rifle, hunting (under the rules as established by most States) is a challenge. To do so successfully requires knowledge of the area and the animal's habits, and may involve skills of tracking and stealth as well as marksmanship. Even veteran hunters come back empty-handed quite often, never having been able to generate an opportunity for a clean shot.
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No it's not a challenge. A matchup between a high-powered rifle and a wild animal isn't a challenge. It's a slaughter. The majority of hunters don't hunt alone. They go with one or two buddies. It's a "bonding" thing. But, it doesn't take brains or balls to outwit a defenseless animal.

It just takes a certain throwback of a person.


Given the relative lack of natural predators in North America, if it were not for hunters deer would overpopulate in many areas, stripping away edible plants and becoming even bigger garden/farm pests than they already are, and then starve to death unpleasantly by the hundreds of thousands, along with many other animals that depend on the same food sources.
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Fish and Game have moved them into areas where they shouldn't have, spreading deer ticks and other problems. It is true that a hard winter can kill a number of grazing animals, but there again, that doesn't justify catering to the mental illness known as a desire to "sport" hunt.

Given the choice between slow starvation and a bullet, I know which I'd prefer.

And again, in America the licenses and fees hunters pay commonly go to help fund conservation and parks enjoyed by all.


This haste to damn all "sport" hunters is ill-considered.
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Oh, I've had many, many years of dealing with hunters and my opinion isn't ill-considered at all. Trying to justify killing for sport is an abomination in my mind.
 
American said:
How would an anti-gun person know that? What is Trump style?
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Trumps style is to rip off disabled Veterans, though I would class that as greed, not style. Do be careful what you ask for in the age of Trump.
 
jaeger19 said:
Not credible. Certainly it does not describe the vast vast vast.. majority of hunting.
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Helicoptered in to shoot your specimen, witha fifty cal. then off to lunch at a luxury hotel... It's a test of manhood sure enough. The remaing wild dangerous man-eating elephants chew on their 500lb of grass and wonder WTF?

Barely a crease in his expensive hunting gear, and not a drop of blood on the fearsome knife. (Bet daddy's is bigger!)

54394f3e3fdbb8b142c7b6aee974e27d--donald-trump-son-donald-oconnor.jpg
 
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Manc Skipper said:
Helicoptered in to shoot your specimen, witha fifty cal. then off to lunch at a luxury hotel... It's a test of manhood sure enough. The remaing wild dangerous man-eating elephants chew on their 500lb of grass and wonder WTF?
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Back in the 1920's it was quite common for wealthy Americans to go to Africa, and pop off animals thru the window of a moving vehicle, not much sport in that.
 
yankintx said:
Back in the 1920's it was quite common for wealthy Americans to go to Africa, and pop off animals thru the window of a moving vehicle, not much sport in that.
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To be fair, it wasn't just Americans. Much like today, it's classless ****s with money.
 
Trump style? Look at the obvious natural hunters skills as he blends into his surroundings...

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Real men with guns shoot sleeping bears in their winter den. How is that sport ?
 
HowardBThiname said:
When those situations occur, and I'm sure they do, they should be handled by the park rangers. Individuals with obvious mental illnesses should not be encouraged to look at killing as a sport.

As far as money for conservation goes -- get it another way.



I specifically said that hunting for food was allowable. Let those who need the food hunt in that case. Keep the crazies out.



I've seen the rotting carcasses of headless deer. I do, however, agree that most hunters, at least those around here, want the meat. The problem is the trophy hunters who wouldn't know how to clean a deer if they tried.



No it's not a challenge. A matchup between a high-powered rifle and a wild animal isn't a challenge. It's a slaughter. The majority of hunters don't hunt alone. They go with one or two buddies. It's a "bonding" thing. But, it doesn't take brains or balls to outwit a defenseless animal.

It just takes a certain throwback of a person.




Fish and Game have moved them into areas where they shouldn't have, spreading deer ticks and other problems. It is true that a hard winter can kill a number of grazing animals, but there again, that doesn't justify catering to the mental illness known as a desire to "sport" hunt.



Oh, I've had many, many years of dealing with hunters and my opinion isn't ill-considered at all. Trying to justify killing for sport is an abomination in my mind.
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Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.

You realize the locals in Africa are typically not well equipped for hunting elephant? And telling the conservationists "find the money elsewhere" is like telling the desperately poor "find bread elsewhere"?

Your opinion on the lack of any challenge in sport hunting suggests you've never attempted to hunt. Especially not in an actual wilderness area.

Oddly enough I can't find "hunting" as a mental illness on the AMA list of known mental illnesses.... :)


Some of us are of the opinion that if you're willing to eat meat, you ought to be willing to hunt and kill a prey animal for same, at least once in a while, as a matter of principle.

I don't expect you to understand, obviously.

Just as I doubt you'd understand that for many of us who hunt, the killing itself is not a thing of joy, simply a necessary part of the process in between "going hunting" and "bringing home the meat".
 
yankintx said:
Real men with guns shoot sleeping bears in their winter den. How is that sport ?
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The only bear hunter I know personally uses a bow, and would certainly disdain shooting a sleeping animal.
 
jaeger19 said:
wow.. so you prefer that the elephant suffer a slow, and agonizing death over days as the wounds from the spears, slowly weaken it and the wounds become infected? Why would you want the animal to suffer so much?
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Wait, is that an elephant's he shot?! Do people hunt elephants? I thought it was a hippo's tail or something. Why would someone shoot an elephant?
 
Diving Mullah said:
It is always good to know we as country and humanbeings have regressed under the current administration

On a related note....

Wondering what kind of SubHuman, dickless being shoots an majestic endangered animal...not for food, but as a "Sport" then cut the animals tails and posses for photo in hopes of some sort of reprieve for being left over disgraded loins of another emotionally stunted human being?


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Diving Mullah
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This is an order that Obama put in place in 2014. No need to say more about Trump’s motivation. He has been making it very clear since he took office.
 
Carleen said:
This is an order that Obama put in place in 2014. No need to say more about Trump’s motivation. He has been making it very clear since he took office.
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I am amazed that Trump can even move his bowels daily since Obama was known to have performed that function while President.
 
Goshin said:
Well, I'm sorry you feel that way.

You realize the locals in Africa are typically not well equipped for hunting elephant? And telling the conservationists "find the money elsewhere" is like telling the desperately poor "find bread elsewhere"?

Your opinion on the lack of any challenge in sport hunting suggests you've never attempted to hunt. Especially not in an actual wilderness area.
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I believe the natives have been providing their food for centuries.

Oddly enough I can't find "hunting" as a mental illness on the AMA list of known mental illnesses.... :)
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Neither is gangland killings, but we all know those who take part in that "sport" are also mentally ill.

Some of us are of the opinion that if you're willing to eat meat, you ought to be willing to hunt and kill a prey animal for same, at least once in a while, as a matter of principle.

I don't expect you to understand, obviously.
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I understand that. Fortunately for me, I don't eat meat so I don't have to face killing for it. But, those who eat mean ought to have to do that.

Just as I doubt you'd understand that for many of us who hunt, the killing itself is not a thing of joy, simply a necessary part of the process in between "going hunting" and "bringing home the meat".
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Again, I'm not talking about hunting for food -- I understand that.

I'm talking about sport hunting. That's despicable.
 
HowardBThiname said:
I have absolutely no use for sport hunters. As I said -- I'd like to put them all on an island and watch them hunt one another.

I get requests every year for hunters to hunt my land and every year I tell them NO, unless they've already tagged a deer, and then I allow them to track it.

Sport hunting, however is not a sport -- it's a mental illness.

All the hardships you described, the long walks, the sneaking around -- all of them are for wienies. In the end it comes down to an animal and a high-powered rifle and that's no sport. That's simply what some men do to compensate for their "shortcomings" in other areas. Any couch potato can pull it off.

Those who thrill to the kill are worth keeping an eye on.

As far as your last sentence goes -- I'm rooting for the herd to turn the hunting party into mush.
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Whatever. The truth is. that the reason that this country has the abundance of wildlife it has.. game animals and non game animals is because of the efforts of hunters. Your claim that "in the end it all comes down to an animal and a higher powered rifle and that's "not sport"

Here is a fact.. beyond the facts that stalking an alert animal within 50 yards is a feat in itself.. and the walking and the tracking etc.. The reality is that in animals that are hunting in this country.. a high success rate is something like 20% or maybe 30% for some. That means that hunters will hunt for years before being able to connect on an animal. that's more than just a "high powered rifle and an animal".

But your argument is based in ignorance and you wish to remain there.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Helicoptered in to shoot your specimen, witha fifty cal. then off to lunch at a luxury hotel... It's a test of manhood sure enough. The remaing wild dangerous man-eating elephants chew on their 500lb of grass and wonder WTF?

Barely a crease in his expensive hunting gear, and not a drop of blood on the fearsome knife. (Bet daddy's is bigger!)

54394f3e3fdbb8b142c7b6aee974e27d--donald-trump-son-donald-oconnor.jpg
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Yeah, your post is not credible.
 
yankintx said:
Real men with guns shoot sleeping bears in their winter den. How is that sport ?
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You understand that's illegal right? And that any actual hunter would never do that and if a hunter were to discover someone doing that.. they would report it to the authorities and there is a hotline for hunters to report any suspicious activity?

The ignorance being displayed by you is astounding.
 
Manc Skipper said:
Trump style? Look at the obvious natural hunters skills as he blends into his surroundings...

872.jpg
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Well.. obviously he is hunting. Wait.. how is he hunting? ???
 
HowardBThiname said:
I believe the natives have been providing their food for centuries.
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Which is in part why many species of animal became endangered. The same in the US. Largely from habitat destruction from farmers like yourself.

I understand that. Fortunately for me, I don't eat meat so I don't have to face killing for it. But, those who eat mean ought to have to do that.
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And as a non meat eater.. you actually account for much more animal death. Since you don't eat meat particularly meat that you have hunted. .. you must rely in farming.. largely intensive farming.. which causes more harm to the environment and animal populations.

Again, I'm not talking about hunting for food -- I understand that.

I'm talking about sport hunting. That's despicable
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You don't know what sport hunting is. Sport hunting also requires the hunting for food.. unless you are talking about predator hunting or pest control. That elephant went to feed probably a whole village. And it also provided valuable money for that village AND it also decreased the destruction by elephants.. etc.
 
Diving Mullah said:
Wondering what kind of SubHuman, dickless being shoots an majestic endangered animal...not for food, but as a "Sport" then cut the animals tails and posses for photo in hopes of some sort of reprieve for being left over disgraded loins of another emotionally stunted human being?
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Well, as to something like elephants, generally agreed. They are quite intelligent.

But hunting in general? If they really do carve it up, freeze or give away the meat, and it is consumed, I'm not going to complaint. But killing simply for fun is bitterly sadistic.




Before all the challenges: yeah, I eat meat; yeah, I make an effort to pay more for meat form animals that haven't been treated callously. No, I'm not a hypocrite because maybe we also get meat from Costco.
 
jaeger19 said:
Here is a fact.. beyond the facts that stalking an alert animal within 50 yards is a feat in itself.. and the walking and the tracking etc.. The reality is that in animals that are hunting in this country.. a high success rate is something like 20% or maybe 30% for some. That means that hunters will hunt for years before being able to connect on an animal. that's more than just a "high powered rifle and an animal".
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The emboldened part above indicates some sort of throwback to caveman or jungle days. Pretending one still has to do that to survive is a practice in self-deception. In my opinion.

If you must hunt for food -- fine -- we all have to survive. But, to hunt for trophies -- to kill for "sport" indicates a less-evolved sort of a person. Anyone who actually enjoys the kill, has a screw loose. A big one.
That loose screw has been found to be a common link in serial killers and others who graduate from killing animals to killing humans. It's aberrant behavior.

You don't have to believe me -- do your own research.

I'm not talking about the old Indian who hunted for food and then, because he understood that a life was precious, used virtually every bit of the animal for something useful. I'm talking about the people who kill for "sport." Because, at the end of the day -- those are incredibly sick ****ers.
 
Mr Person said:
Well, as to something like elephants, generally agreed. They are quite intelligent.

But hunting in general? If they really do carve it up, freeze or give away the meat, and it is consumed, I'm not going to complaint. But killing simply for fun is bitterly sadistic.




Before all the challenges: yeah, I eat meat; yeah, I make an effort to pay more for meat form animals that haven't been treated callously. No, I'm not a hypocrite because maybe we also get meat from Costco.
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I agree completely.

Well said.
 
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