JackTheRipper
New member
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- Feb 9, 2012
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- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
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- Political Leaning
- Libertarian - Right
Option 2. I'm Pro-Choice.
Option 2. I'm Pro-Choice.
Me too. Now, if only we could persuade Ron Paul.
I vote in favor of being tired of hearing about abortions. There are so many more important issues facing our nation.
I have more trouble with the options listed.
I prefer we find ways to make abortion unneeded. No law, just win the debate and prevent unwanted pregnacies.
I can't, because you haven't fully addressed the issue. Obviously, you wish to stop abortions. And I would assume you wish to stop as many abortions as possible, even illegal ones. Therefore, you HAVE to confront the fact that the majority of miscarriages take place outside a hospital...
THEREFORE, what is your solution to the matter of private in-home abortions done under the guise of a spontaneous miscarriage?
I find PETA's work to be low class, superficial and ultimately counter-productive.
View attachment 67122259
ps. "A carnivorous act of nature"? haha
Miscarriage =/= abortion. One is spontaneous, the other is induced. There is always a medical reason for a spontaneous miscarriage.
As I said, twice now, the solution is to improve their personal financial status; which does not mean how much money they have, but how they manage it. Personal finance can be given in an age appropriate format in all grades.
Women will do and/or sacrifice absolutely anything for the feeling of security. By empowering them economically they will feel more secure and turn away from abortion.
I haven't seen any statistics. But it is the views of the majority of posters I have read on this forum, and it is also a logical conclusion to the issue of punishing baby-killing murderers.
You keep dodging the issue.
A self-induced miscarriage is an abortion. And as I said, most miscarriages before 10 weeks don't even require medical attention.
Do you see the loophole?
Women who wish to avoid criminal punishment (and I imagine an abortion ban will entail criminal penalties for the woman, despite what you support) or who can't find the abortion doctor or who can't afford to pay black market price for the procedure will try to induce themselves.
There are a number of reasons a pregnant ve woman might induce herself and then cover up her tracks by claiming it was a miscarriage. Obviously, you have no solution to confronting this scenario.
But keep in mind that Roe v. Wade was passed largely because of deaths related to self-induced abortions. And many conservatives fought tooth and nail, because obviously they cared more about the ZEF than they did the pregnant woman.
McCorvey revealed herself to the press as being "Jane Roe" of the decision within days of its issuance and stated that she sought an abortion because she was unemployable and greatly depressed. In the 1980s, McCorvey asserted that she had been the "pawn" of two young and ambitious lawyers (Weddington and Coffee) who were looking for a plaintiff with whom they could challenge the Texas state law prohibiting abortion.
http://ravingatheist.com/2009/01/trivia-question-answer
^ CNN.com - Who is 'Jane Roe'?, Jun. 18, 2003
So anecdotal statement broadly condemning a giant segment of people based off no actual facts but your own reading on this forum, an observation surely others disagree with in terms of the scope of our posters that feel that way, and what YOU believe to be the logical conclusion due to your misguided notion that somehow your biased and prejudiced view of those that are pro-life allows you to accurately determine exactly how they must think on an issue.
Thanks, I figured that was the case but just wanted to be sure before I completely wrote off your worthless mass insults and attacks as the trash they appeared to be.
If you mean I'm not cooperating with how you're trying to bend the truth, you're right.
Most abortions are not at-home self induced miscarriages.
90% of illegal abortions occurred at a doctor's office, not at home, as sourced.
These account for 2% of all illegal abortions.
That's correct, I can't save the world.
Norma Leah McCorvey, "Jane Roe" of Roe v. Wade, never had an abortion, adopted the child out, and later converted to Christianity and was an active Pro-Life supporter in Operation Rescue.
Roe herself, your model victim of man's oppression, wanted an abortion because 1. she was unemployable, 2 depressed, and 3. had an abused history; and you think I'm going to, for one second, doubt that empowering women is the best way to reduce abortion?
I see you aren't checking sources when they're provided. According to the links to guttmacher, the other 8% are abortions performed my Nurses, midwives, and other trained medical professionals other than doctors. A full 98% of all illegal abortions were performed under clean, safe medical conditions. Of the remaining 2%, most were induced with 'natural' remedies in very early pregnancy, not wire hangers later on.Where are you getting your figures? And so far, 90% + 2% = 92%. Where's the other 8%?
I see you aren't checking sources when they're provided. According to the links to guttmacher, the other 8% are abortions performed my Nurses, midwives, and other trained medical professionals other than doctors. A full 98% of all illegal abortions were performed under clean, safe medical conditions. Of the remaining 2%, most were induced with 'natural' remedies in very early pregnancy, not wire hangers later on.
Wouldn't you agree that killing an animal for food is a carnivorous act of nature?
And what is the year of these statistics? And what proof do you have that such abortions took place under "clean, safe" medical conditions? If they're performed in a clean and sanitary, reputable, clinic, then maybe they are clean. But such reputable clinics don't last long when faced with heavy scrutiny from authorities, and they have a lot more to lose.
Instead, I imagine they'd most likely take place in a facility such as the one run by Kermit Gosnell. Also, without legalization, the black market encourages higher rates of partial birth abortions and other horrific abortions that otherwise would have been regulated and restricted in a legal setting. And without legalization, education regarding abortion options goes out the window.
Where's the rest of your response? Where's the response to teen abortions, or a response to the fact you're using dated statistics and applying them to a future, hypothetical setting?
http://www.physiciansforlife.org/content/view/2157/26/5 Myths About “Back Alley” Abortions
Myth #1. Illegal abortions were performed by unlicensed, unskilled hacks.
Prior to legalization, 90 percent of illegal abortions were done by physicians. Most of the remainder were done by nurses, midwives or others with at least some medical training.
The term “back alley” referred not to where abortions were performed, but to how women were instructed to enter the doctor’s office after hours, through the back alley, to avoid arousing neighbors’ suspicions.
An illegal abortion may be called a "back-alley", "backstreet", or "back-yard" abortion.
The wire coat hanger method was a popularly known illegal abortion procedure, although they were not the norm. In fact, Mary Calderone, former medical director of Planned Parenthood, said, in a 1960 printing of the American Journal of Public Health:
"Abortion is no longer a dangerous procedure. This applies not just to therapeutic abortions as performed in hospitals but also to so-called illegal abortions as done by physician. In 1957 there were only 260 deaths in the whole country attributed to abortions of any kind, second, and even more important, the conference [on abortion sponsored by Planned Parenthood] estimated that 90 percent of all illegal abortions are presently being done by physicians. Whatever trouble arises usually arises from self-induced abortions, which comprise approximately 8 percent, or with the very small percentage that go to some kind of non-medical abortionist. Abortion, whether therapeutic or illegal, is in the main no longer dangerous, because it is being done well by physicians."
Unsafe abortion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I shall post my Standard Issue Response #23 for you again: