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U.S. Economy Added 162,000 Jobs in March, Most in 3 Years

The Conference Board's Leading Economic Indicators (LEI) rose a robust 1.4% to 109.6 in March. In addition, as a further evidence of labor market stabilization and perhaps another indication of a resumption in employment growth, the Conference Board observed, "Payroll employment made its first substantial contribution to the coincident economic index, suggesting a recovery that is beginning to gain traction."
 
The Conference Board's Leading Economic Indicators (LEI) rose a robust 1.4% to 109.6 in March. In addition, as a further evidence of labor market stabilization and perhaps another indication of a resumption in employment growth, the Conference Board observed, "Payroll employment made its first substantial contribution to the coincident economic index, suggesting a recovery that is beginning to gain traction."


It's all a mirage. The economy can not recover until the housing sector is back to normal and that is still years away.
 
It's all a mirage. The economy can not recover until the housing sector is back to normal and that is still years away.

The economy can't recover until the jobs start coming back.

What, they're coming back?

Oh, well, in that case the economy can't recover until the housing sector is back to normal.

What's the next condition of economic recovery?
 
The economy can't recover until the jobs start coming back.

What, they're coming back?

Oh, well, in that case the economy can't recover until the housing sector is back to normal.

What's the next condition of economic recovery?

A Republican president.
 
The economy can't recover until the jobs start coming back.

What, they're coming back?

Oh, well, in that case the economy can't recover until the housing sector is back to normal.

What's the next condition of economic recovery?

Jobs are coming back? Most are temps and government jobs and the jobs created don't even keep up to new people joining the workforce. The collapse in the housing sector caused this recession and a sustained recovery can't happen until the housing sector corrects.

WASHINGTON – A spike in unemployment claims Thursday underscored the bumpiness of the economic rebound: Consumers are spending more. Factories are making more. But layoffs have not tapered off as fast as expected.

So can the recovery gather much steam if 17 percent of working-age Americans remain jobless or underemployed?

Employers have begun to add jobs recently, including 162,000 in March. Yet much stronger job creation is needed to ease the current 9.7 percent unemployment rate. And if layoffs were to spike and job creation sputter, the recovery could fall back into a “double-dip” recession.
 
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Jobs are coming back? Most are temps and government jobs and the jobs created don't even keep up to new people joining the workforce. The collapse in the housing sector caused this recession and a sustained recovery can't happen until the housing sector corrects.

WASHINGTON – A spike in unemployment claims Thursday underscored the bumpiness of the economic rebound: Consumers are spending more. Factories are making more. But layoffs have not tapered off as fast as expected.

So can the recovery gather much steam if 17 percent of working-age Americans remain jobless or underemployed?

Employers have begun to add jobs recently, including 162,000 in March. Yet much stronger job creation is needed to ease the current 9.7 percent unemployment rate. And if layoffs were to spike and job creation sputter, the recovery could fall back into a “double-dip” recession.

This explicits an entirely different perception of the March jobs spike than the one implied in the post I responded to.

Regardless, I'm not sure of my opinion on the March spike myself. But it seemed interesting to me you seem to be precipating the event of a job growth with an accusation that it is meaningless until the housing market is back in order.
 
The economy can't recover until the jobs start coming back.

What, they're coming back?

Um no they're not coming back, first of all 54% of those 162,000 jobs were temp position, 2nd of all the participating labour force increased by 625,000 over the first three months of the year which means a job increase of 208,000 would have been required just to stay afloat and keep the unemployment rate where it is.

What's the next condition of economic recovery?

How about an actual decrease in the unemployment rate for starters?
 
It's all a mirage. The economy can not recover until the housing sector is back to normal and that is still years away.

I don't know how you define "normal." IMO, and from a macroeconomic perspective, if the housing prices are stable in real terms and later increase at a rate that is fairly consistent with real economic growth, that would be beneficial.

If housing prices were to rise rapidly toward the levels attained during the recent housing bubble, that would be detrimental and would result in fresh housing-related risks, an unhealthy rebuilding of leverage, and future financial system fragility. As of 2009 Q4, total U.S. mortgage debt is still 98% of GDP. That remains much above the pre-bubble historic peak of just under 70% of GDP. As a result, the optimal way to work that ratio down to a healthier figure would be for house prices to increase at a rate that is below overall economic growth for an extended period of time.
 
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I don't know how you define "normal." IMO, and from a macroeconomic perspective, if the housing prices are stable in real terms and later increase at a rate that is fairly consistent with real economic growth, that would be beneficial.

If housing prices were to rise rapidly toward the levels attained during the recent housing bubble, that would be detrimental and would result in fresh housing-related risks, an unhealthy rebuilding of leverage, and future financial system fragility. As of 2009 Q4, total U.S. mortgage debt is still 98% of GDP. That remains much above the pre-bubble historic peak of just under 70% of GDP. As a result, the optimal way to work that ratio down to a healthier figure would be for house prices to increase at a rate that is below overall economic growth for an extended period of time.


http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/04/foreclosures-hit-new-high-in-march-up-19/38954/

We really are no better off now than we were when the economic collapse began. The housing sector caused it and it is worse now than before.
Foreclosures have to drop to levels before the collapse in order for a sustained recovery to occur..
 
from the imf's april 20 report:

"if the legacy of the present crisis and emerging sovereign risks are not addressed, we run the very real risk of undermining the recovery and extending the financial crisis into a new phase”

IMF Survey: Government Borrowing Is Rising Risk to World Financial System

well, isn't that interesting?

unfortunately, the "legacy of sovereign risks" is NOT being "addressed"

you know what that means...
 
from the imf's april 20 report:

"if the legacy of the present crisis and emerging sovereign risks are not addressed, we run the very real risk of undermining the recovery and extending the financial crisis into a new phase”

IMF Survey: Government Borrowing Is Rising Risk to World Financial System

well, isn't that interesting?

unfortunately, the "legacy of sovereign risks" is NOT being "addressed"

you know what that means...

The drill is to try and figure out where the next bubble is and have Goldman Sachs create a synthetic derivative for you.
 
Restating a central part of the economic debate, as to whether the U.S. is in an economic recovery (it is), I noted back on April 9:

...the IMF's forthcoming World Economic Outlook (to be released April 21) will add to the growing number of public and private reports showing a U.S. recovery. Furthermore, it could project 2010 real GDP growth of +2.5% to +3.0% for the U.S., with perhaps ~2.5% +/- 0.25% growth for 2011 (under the assumption that fiscal stimulus would be winding down, interest rates would remain low, and the financial system would continue its slow recovery).

Needless to say, there could be some wildcards e.g., an external shock that could adversely impact the U.S. economy. But right now, there is mounting evidence that a cyclical recovery is underway even as some weaknesses and headwinds persist.


It is April 21 and the IMF has just released its full World Economic Outlook.

With respect to real GDP growth in the U.S., the IMF projected:

2010: +3.1% (slightly better than my thinking)
2011: +2.6%

In its discussion, the IMF noted that the U.S. fiscal stimulus has contributed positively to U.S. economic growth. It explained:

A stimulus-led recovery is under way in the United States, but private demand remains soft. Substantial monetary and fiscal easing, alongside other policies aimed directly at the financial and housing sectors, has provided a broad-based fillip to growth--the IMF staff estimates that the fiscal stimulus boosted real GDP growth by about 1 percentage point in 2009. In response to the stimulus and a robust inventory cycle, real GDP grew at a seasonally adjusted annualized rate of 2.2 percent in the third quarter of 2009 and by 5.6 percent in the fourth quarter. But private final demand is still subdued and remains well below precrisis levels. In the fourth quarter, consumption rose by only 1.6 percent as households continued to rebuild wealth; reduced inventory drawdowns contributed more than half of growth. During the same period, net exports also made a modest positive contribution to growth, as the rebound in global trade and recovery in partner economies boosted exports.

IMO, it is the handoff between fiscal stimulus and private demand that could be somewhat trickly later this year and next year. It is that handoff that leads me to suspect that next year's growth could be slower than this year's. Indeed, the IMF adds, "The removal of policy stimulus will subtract from growth...in 2011." With respect to possible "wildcards," the IMF noted that "uncertainty around the outlook remains elevated but is lower than in the October 2009 WEO..."

Key points from the IMF's report:

1. The U.S. economy is recovering.
2. Fiscal stimulus has contributed to the recovery (1 percentage point in 2009).
3. Moderate growth is forecast for 2010 and 2011.
4. The withdrawal of stimulus in 2011 will have a damping effect on growth, as private final demand remains sluggish.
5. Uncertainty remains "elevated."

Having said that, once the current recovery is sustained, the U.S. will need to pursue credible fiscal consolidation. The IMF has also discussed that need, but that is a topic that is beyond the scope of this thread.
 
Restating a central part of the economic debate, as to whether the U.S. is in an economic recovery (it is), I noted back on April 9:

...the IMF's forthcoming World Economic Outlook (to be released April 21) will add to the growing number of public and private reports showing a U.S. recovery. Furthermore, it could project 2010 real GDP growth of +2.5% to +3.0% for the U.S., with perhaps ~2.5% +/- 0.25% growth for 2011 (under the assumption that fiscal stimulus would be winding down, interest rates would remain low, and the financial system would continue its slow recovery).

Needless to say, there could be some wildcards e.g., an external shock that could adversely impact the U.S. economy. But right now, there is mounting evidence that a cyclical recovery is underway even as some weaknesses and headwinds persist.


It is April 21 and the IMF has just released its full World Economic Outlook.

With respect to real GDP growth in the U.S., the IMF projected:

2010: +3.1% (slightly better than my thinking)
2011: +2.6%

In its discussion, the IMF noted that the U.S. fiscal stimulus has contributed positively to U.S. economic growth. It explained:

A stimulus-led recovery is under way in the United States, but private demand remains soft. Substantial monetary and fiscal easing, alongside other policies aimed directly at the financial and housing sectors, has provided a broad-based fillip to growth--the IMF staff estimates that the fiscal stimulus boosted real GDP growth by about 1 percentage point in 2009. In response to the stimulus and a robust inventory cycle, real GDP grew at a seasonally adjusted annualized rate of 2.2 percent in the third quarter of 2009 and by 5.6 percent in the fourth quarter. But private final demand is still subdued and remains well below precrisis levels. In the fourth quarter, consumption rose by only 1.6 percent as households continued to rebuild wealth; reduced inventory drawdowns contributed more than half of growth. During the same period, net exports also made a modest positive contribution to growth, as the rebound in global trade and recovery in partner economies boosted exports.

IMO, it is the handoff between fiscal stimulus and private demand that could be somewhat trickly later this year and next year. It is that handoff that leads me to suspect that next year's growth could be slower than this year's. Indeed, the IMF adds, "The removal of policy stimulus will subtract from growth...in 2011." With respect to possible "wildcards," the IMF noted that "uncertainty around the outlook remains elevated but is lower than in the October 2009 WEO..."

Key points from the IMF's report:

1. The U.S. economy is recovering.
2. Fiscal stimulus has contributed to the recovery (1 percentage point in 2009).
3. Moderate growth is forecast for 2010 and 2011.
4. The withdrawal of stimulus in 2011 will have a damping effect on growth, as private final demand remains sluggish.
5. Uncertainty remains "elevated."

Having said that, once the current recovery is sustained, the U.S. will need to pursue credible fiscal consolidation. The IMF has also discussed that need, but that is a topic that is beyond the scope of this thread.

Not sure where this report puts the monetary stimulus from the Fed in this equation. Surprised there could be any discussion about what happens to the economy going forward without talking about how the Fed exits the mortgage market and when they start to raise interest rates to a level which if held steady is sure to create a bubble somewhere in our economy.

It would be interesting if you have more information as to what the IMF considered when talking about the fiscal stimulus. Were they talking about the approximately $200 billion from the stimulus package ot more broadly the $1.5 trillion deficit.

It would also be good to know how much of the upturn is due to the turnaround on wall street. As this impacts the wealth effect you mentioned.
 
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OKSrMWCw1k&feature=player_embedded"]YouTube- Peter Schiff vs Obama's Stimulus - 3-25-2009 on MSNBC[/nomedia]
 
Not sure where this report puts the monetary stimulus from the Fed in this equation. Surprised there could be any discussion about what happens to the economy going forward without talking about how the Fed exits the mortgage market and when they start to raise interest rates to a level which if held steady is sure to create a bubble somewhere in our economy.

The IMF appeared to believe a gradual withdrawal of monetary stimulus is appropriate, but that the speed at which such stimulus can be withdrawn will vary from country to country.

It would be interesting if you have more information as to what the IMF considered when talking about the fiscal stimulus. Were they talking about the approximately $200 billion from the stimulus package ot more broadly the $1.5 trillion deficit.

The IMF was talking about the increased stimulus spending not the increase in the budget deficit. The IMF noted that approximately 20% of the deficit increase occurred from the fiscal stimulus. The rest was attributable to other factors, namely a decline in tax revenue on account of the severe recession.

It would also be good to know how much of the upturn is due to the turnaround on wall street. As this impacts the wealth effect you mentioned.

The IMF did not attempt to allocate what share of the recovery was due to non-stimulus factors. It only suggested that about 1 percentage point from 2009 was due to fiscal stimulus. My guess is that the figure was provided to counter political claims that suggest that the stimulus was "worthless." Those claims have little basis in economic literature when it comes to aggregate demand shocks and the IMF likely wanted to quantify the value of the stimulus package, especially as the IMF was out in front advising the advanced economies to undertake fiscal stimulus remedies well ahead of their actually having done so. Needless to say, a large part of the stimulus 2009 package was carried out to accommodate political desires (tax provisions, Medicaid increases, etc.) not economic ones.
 
The IMF appeared to believe a gradual withdrawal of monetary stimulus is appropriate, but that the speed at which such stimulus can be withdrawn will vary from country to country.



The IMF was talking about the increased stimulus spending not the increase in the budget deficit. The IMF noted that approximately 20% of the deficit increase occurred from the fiscal stimulus. The rest was attributable to other factors, namely a decline in tax revenue on account of the severe recession.



The IMF did not attempt to allocate what share of the recovery was due to non-stimulus factors. It only suggested that about 1 percentage point from 2009 was due to fiscal stimulus. My guess is that the figure was provided to counter political claims that suggest that the stimulus was "worthless." Those claims have little basis in economic literature when it comes to aggregate demand shocks and the IMF likely wanted to quantify the value of the stimulus package, especially as the IMF was out in front advising the advanced economies to undertake fiscal stimulus remedies well ahead of their actually having done so. Needless to say, a large part of the stimulus 2009 package was carried out to accommodate political desires (tax provisions, Medicaid increases, etc.) not economic ones.

Thanks, I agree it is silly to say that we got nothing from the stimulus. A different question ( and I think fairer) is was the benefit worth the cost.
 
Thanks, I agree it is silly to say that we got nothing from the stimulus. A different question ( and I think fairer) is was the benefit worth the cost.

A lot will depend on whether the stimulus is mopped up afterward. Failure to do so will erase the net benefit over time.

Unfortunately, there has been a historic bias toward accommodation whereby policy makers provide stimulus and then fail to remove it afterward. One cannot rule out some programs becoming permanent (or regularly renewed).

Finally, to put things into perspective with respect to the nation's fiscal imbalances, the IMF noted that the debt buildup associated with the stimulus was about 1.5% of GDP. The fiscal consolidation necessary to address the nation's long-term imbalances could be on the order of 8% of GDP.
 
Unfortunately, there has been a historic bias toward accommodation whereby policy makers provide stimulus and then fail to remove it afterward. One cannot rule out some programs becoming permanent (or regularly renewed).

Well, that's really not an issue, because the stimulus didn't really create new programs, it just pumped additional money into them. This budget authority was limited and will expire. It won't just keep going until someone cuts it off.

But you do have a great point in general. Many government programs just keep going, because they develop a constituency. And many are just glorified stimulus and jobs programs. Defense contracts, farm assistance, etc. are two quick examples I can think of.

And economically, the policymakers always seem to go with the stimulus side of Keynes, but never get around to raising taxes and cutting spending when times are good, keeping the economy on an even keel and paying off the debt incurred in bad times. The last time we were responsible enough to do that was 1993 with Clinton's tax increase, which led to surpluses.
 
Well, that's really not an issue, because the stimulus didn't really create new programs, it just pumped additional money into them. This budget authority was limited and will expire. It won't just keep going until someone cuts it off.

In theory, yes. But that has not always been the norm. For one recent example, can one envision the likelihood of the 2001 and 2003 "temporary" tax cuts being permitted to expire when their are slated to do so under law. Such an outcome is highly unlikely. Although I believe that maintaining some of the tax relief makes sense, I also believe that the provisions that will be retained should be fully financed via offsetting fiscal measures.

Henry Kaufman, a leading private-sector economist, among others have documented a bias toward accommodation whereby temporary programs have been renewed repeatedly or even made permanent in cases, while even modest measures that require fiscal discipline are put off e.g., the so-called "doctors fix" is an example of an effort to put off a modest measure of required fiscal discipline.

I do not want to suggest that the recent fiscal stimulus will take the same path as earlier efforts toward accommodation. But one should be aware of past precedent.

Clearly, certain provisions may need to be extended on their own merit e.g., unemployment compensation due to an unemployment rate that will likely remain persistently high on account of a larger than usual structural component. Others, including the tax provisions aimed at personal tax relief and spending aimed at boosting aggregate demand can't really be justified now that the economy has moved into recovery, albeit a moderate one.

And economically, the policymakers always seem to go with the stimulus side of Keynes, but never get around to raising taxes and cutting spending when times are good, keeping the economy on an even keel and paying off the debt incurred in bad times.

Absolutely. Politically, it is easier to "sell" accommodation than "sacrifice." Unfortunately, over time, what would ordinarily have been cyclical budget deficits are transformed into structural ones when the accommodation is made permanent de jure or de facto.
 
In theory, yes. But that has not always been the norm. For one recent example, can one envision the likelihood of the 2001 and 2003 "temporary" tax cuts being permitted to expire when their are slated to do so under law. Such an outcome is highly unlikely. Although I believe that maintaining some of the tax relief makes sense, I also believe that the provisions that will be retained should be fully financed via offsetting fiscal measures.

I don't disagree. I'm just noting that this would require Congressional action. The stimulus, like the taxes, expire.

With the stimulus, there is alot of political angst against extending it. There will be less with extending tax cuts, since everybody loves to get those and every Congressman loves doling them out.

Absolutely. Politically, it is easier to "sell" accommodation than "sacrifice." Unfortunately, over time, what would ordinarily have been cyclical budget deficits are transformed into structural ones when the accommodation is made permanent de jure or de facto.

Yep. As soon as the economy is up and running again, most people will forget all about it and go back to the same old way of doing things.
 
Key points from the IMF's report:

1. The U.S. economy is recovering.
2. Fiscal stimulus has contributed to the recovery (1 percentage point in 2009).
3. Moderate growth is forecast for 2010 and 2011.
4. The withdrawal of stimulus in 2011 will have a damping effect on growth, as private final demand remains sluggish.
5. Uncertainty remains "elevated."

your #5 rather undermines the validity of "forecasting"

if one is to judge by the narrow definition of "successive quarters of negative growth," there is no debate about the numbers, it's true...

but an economy is a whole lot more than just negative gdp figures

if you look at housing, public debt, consumer confidence, foreign investment, unemployment, sacramento and albany and lansing, all the new taxes in health care and cap and trade and VAT...

and, as noted above, all that elevated uncertainty...

well...

the exclusives, the elites, the egghead economists are gonna forever mumble their mumbo jumbo's, they're eternally gonna expatiate outta both sides of their effluence, qualifying every claim with butt covering caveats, obscuring every observation with necromancical formulae...

it is what it is

if one looks at our landscape and sees reason for optimism, good

america, however, is very, very worried

you might even call her depressed, y'know, deep down inside
 
your #5 rather undermines the validity of "forecasting"

Forecasting is not anything close to 100% accurate, no matter the field. Forecasting is a probabilistic exercise. There is always the risk of error.

With respect to the IMF's latest outlook, although the IMF expects the U.S. economy, among most others, to grow in 2010 and 2011, its confidence in the projection is lower than normal ("elevated" uncertainty). However, if one looks back at the preceding WEO (October 2009), both the IMF's growth expectations and its confidence in the projections have increased.

but an economy is a whole lot more than just negative gdp figures

GDP is just the broadest overall measure. If one is trying to gain a strong insight into the economy, one needs to look at multiple indicators and get into the details.

if you look at housing, public debt, consumer confidence, foreign investment, unemployment, sacramento and albany and lansing, all the new taxes in health care and cap and trade and VAT...

There is no dispute that various sectors of the economy are in a differing state. Housing is stabilizing but remains weak (some markets have experienced growth in recent months). The commercial sector may decline further. Rising public debt, still excessive mortgage debt relative to the previous historic peak, and continued high household debt remain problematic. The unemployment rate is likely to remain high for some time to come, especially as there is a larger structural component this time around. U.S. competitiveness remains an issue in certain industries/economic sectors. The policy front contains some significant uncertainties e.g., whether the U.S. will, in fact, embark on a credible fiscal consolidation program.

the exclusives, the elites, the egghead economists are gonna forever mumble their mumbo jumbo's, they're eternally gonna expatiate outta both sides of their effluence, qualifying every claim with butt covering caveats, obscuring every observation with necromancical formulae...

Caveats are a part of any credible forecasting exercise. Noting the existence of risks and delineating the major ones, is a part of any credible effort and should be fully disclosed.

if one looks at our landscape and sees reason for optimism, good

The general consensus among economists that moderate economic growth is likely in 2010 and 2011 is not an expression of unreasonable optimism. In addition, it does not, in any way, preclude recognition of some substantial medium- and long-term risks.

Four such risks (among others) include:

1) Implications of continuing U.S. dependence on oil in the context that little has been done to address the issue despite twin oil shocks in the 1970s, the oil price spike of 2008, shifting geopolitical trends e.g., China is now a larger buyer of Saudi oil than the U.S. giving Saudi Arabia greater leverage vis-a-vis the U.S. than in the past, etc. The balance of power continues to evolve, too.

2) U.S. fiscal imbalances driven largely by its mandatory spending programs, increasing share of budget deficits that is structural in nature, etc. Juxtaposed against that backdrop is the rising number of alternative investment options e.g., those associated with rapidly growing economies that could lead to increased global competition for capital flows and disadvantage the states that are unwilling or unable to tackle their debt issues, among other challenges.

3) Continued "excess cost problem" associated with U.S. health care. The problem is related largely to industry structure/practices/productivity challenges, etc. Against the backdrop of demographic change, the system's deep-seated flaws will exacerbate an already bad problem and, in the absence of reform, will dramatically increase the nation's fiscal burdens and undermine its economic competitiveness.

4) Strategic issues related to a multi-polar world in which the relative economic and military power of the U.S. will be less than it was during the 20the century. Growing possibility that disparities in educational attainment could lead to some other state's gaining a qualitative edge in at least some key technologies be it space-related, alternative energy (a huge focus for China in graduate programs and scientific research), military technologies, etc.

Citing such risks, among others, does not mean that one cannot expect moderate economic growth for 2010 and 2011. Some even have rosier ideas. At the same time, it also does not require one to expect the worst.

Present and future policy decisions, the overall state of the U.S. economy, geopolitical developments, etc., will shape that course. Right now, even as fundamental health/mandatory spending reform is politically difficult for the U.S., addressing those challenges is not insurmountable. At the same time, even as, let's say, a U.S. sovereign debt crisis is not a certainty, neither is the idea that such an outcome is unthinkable. Such crises have impacted developed and developing nations. There is no special reason that the U.S. would be immune from such a crisis or default.
 
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1) Implications of continuing U.S. dependence on oil in the context that little has been done to address the issue despite twin oil shocks in the 1970s, the oil price spike of 2008, shifting geopolitical trends e.g., China is now a larger buyer of Saudi oil than the U.S. giving Saudi Arabia greater leverage vis-a-vis the U.S. than in the past, etc. The balance of power continues to evolve, too.

2) U.S. fiscal imbalances driven largely by its mandatory spending programs, increasing share of budget deficits that is structural in nature, etc. Juxtaposed against that backdrop is the rising number of alternative investment options e.g., those associated with rapidly growing economies that could lead to increased global competition for capital flows and disadvantage the states that are unwilling or unable to tackle their debt issues, among other challenges.

3) Continued "excess cost problem" associated with U.S. health care. The problem is related largely to industry structure/practices/productivity challenges, etc. Against the backdrop of demographic change, the system's deep-seated flaws will exacerbate an already bad problem and, in the absence of reform, will dramatically increase the nation's fiscal burdens and undermine its economic competitiveness.

4) Strategic issues related to a multi-polar world in which the relative economic and military power of the U.S. will be less than it was during the 20the century. Growing possibility that disparities in educational attainment could lead to some other state's gaining a qualitative edge in at least some key technologies be it space-related, alternative energy (a huge focus for China in graduate programs and scientific research), military technologies, etc.

ooh, those sound pretty serious

At the same time, it also does require one to expect the worst.

i know what you mean
 
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