Obama's Team Responds to "2016 Obama's America"

[MaggieD]

You clearly didn't answer the question. What do you consider a typical American upbringing.

Also, a mentor doesn't mean that you agree with everything they say or do. My mentor growing up was an active practicing Roman Catholic. I disagree with much of the Roman Catholic doctrine and am an agnostic.

Going to foreign schools, having a stepfather who's Islamic, a mom who left him in the care of his grandparents, a father (a politically active anti-colonialist) he pined for, although he only met him once as an adult, a Communist as a mentor . . . this isn't the "typical American upbringing."

 

[Hairytic]

What Obama's Mentor Thought About General Motors - Forbes

That was actually a somewhat common childhood for many American children in that day and time. There were communist parents who raised their children on a communist community. SOme called them hippies. Of course, being a communist isn't against the law, nor does it mean you agree with Carl Marx or Stalin. It is very possible to agree with many communist ideas but not apply them the way Marx or Stalin did. Back in the 60s, the youth protested against a government that didn't represent their best interests. It was not uncommon for people like Obama's mother to introduce Barak to many different ideologies. It fosters critical thinking. I also did a serch on Frank Marshell Davis. He wasn't a member of the communist party that represented the views of the Soviet Union at the time. He reaslly wasn't all that radical for the times.

 

[iliveonramen]

It is the left that continually harps on Romney's success via that lil' thing called capitalism. It's the left that continually harps that the rich aren't paying their fair share (whatever in the hell that means)...who somehow ridiculously believes rich people ought to pay more even though their very own Congress sets the rules. It's the left that denigrates Romney for his wealth. It's not the right. The right doesn't believe everybody has to be equal. That would be the leftists among us.

There are a lot on the right that are uncomfortable with how Romney gained his wealth. Not everybody drinks the kool aid on the right. There are a lot of Reagan Democrats that are socially conservative but don't worship at the alter of Romney's style of Capitalism.

I mean...anti-Bain ads were running in the primary and were considered effective. The fact they stopped running had more to do with the Republican "elite" than the fact they weren't working.

 

[MaggieD]

There are a lot on the right that are uncomfortable with how Romney gained his wealth. Not everybody drinks the kool aid on the right. There are a lot of Reagan Democrats that are socially conservative but don't worship at the alter of Romney's style of Capitalism.

I mean...anti-Bain ads were running in the primary and were considered effective. The fact they stopped running had more to do with the Republican "elite" than the fact they weren't working.

I don't know why they stopped, but Bain and others like them are very valuable commodities. Bain certain did/does more good than bad. Much more. I think it's more likely the ads stopped because, as people began to realize what Bain Capital actually did, the ads became ineffective.

 

[Hairytic]

Going to foreign schools, having a stepfather who's Islamic, a mom who left him in the care of his grandparents, a father (a politically active anti-colonialist) he pined for, although he only met him once as an adult, a Communist as a mentor . . . this isn't the "typical American upbringing."

Well then, I had a very untypical up-brining. My father was athiest and a socialist. My mother was a Luthern and conservative when I was young. I lived in and attended schools in other countries. My parents divorced. My mom became more of a socialist when I became a teenager, my dad became more conservative. I wasn't raised by the Brady Bunch or Ozzy and Harriet. ANd I sure wasn't Beaver Cleaver.

 

[iliveonramen]

I don't know why they stopped,

They stopped because a blitz by Republican establishment and Republican figures condemned them. They were working in every place they were ran. Gingrich is a lot of things but he's also a skilled politician that knows working class individuals.

others like them are very valuable commodities

Sure...to him and his investors. Financial firms have virtually taken over the economy....by almost any measure. Why aren't most Americans doing better for the past 3 decades? Why exactly have these valuable commodities doing insanely well not translated to Americans doing insanely well?

Bain certain did/does more good than bad. Much more.

So some sources say. Predictably those sources are generally funded by said entities and entities like them.

 

[TheNextEra]

Going to foreign schools, having a stepfather who's Islamic, a mom who left him in the care of his grandparents, a father (a politically active anti-colonialist) he pined for, although he only met him once as an adult, a Communist as a mentor . . . this isn't the "typical American upbringing."

Even if I took you as an authority for "what's typical American upbringing" (which I don't), it still begs the question SO WHAT?

As I said before, just because you have a mentor does not mean you agree with EVERYTHING they say or do. Romneybots just can't seem to grasp this simple concept that just because you look up to someone does not mean you follow them.

As for the typical American upbringing, I'm pretty sure Timothy McVeigh, along with many serial killers would follow under your "typical" American upbringing and look what happened?

 

[Dwight]

Have you ever thought that the reason he didn't show his actual return is because he's taken the time to amend it? That he originally took the full deduction he was entitled to and that's why he didn't want to show his actual return?

1) I am giving him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't.
2) It doesn't fit the timeline, this is about when the first pass would be done.
3) How does that fit with what we were talking about, again?

In my opinion, the whole discussion about Romney's tax rate is absurd.

As a qualification for the job of President, sure.

As an a example of one of the problems with the tax code system, no. Sadly some people need concrete examples for these to click, the idea in abstract just doesn't take root in their mind. *shrug*

 

[Travis007]

And yet, there's no historical basis for any of your beliefs.

have you read Obama's books?...

 

[Travis007]

That was actually a somewhat common childhood for many American children in that day and time. There were communist parents who raised their children on a communist community. SOme called them hippies. Of course, being a communist isn't against the law, nor does it mean you agree with Carl Marx or Stalin. It is very possible to agree with many communist ideas but not apply them the way Marx or Stalin did. Back in the 60s, the youth protested against a government that didn't represent their best interests. It was not uncommon for people like Obama's mother to introduce Barak to many different ideologies. It fosters critical thinking. I also did a serch on Frank Marshell Davis. He wasn't a member of the communist party that represented the views of the Soviet Union at the time. He reaslly wasn't all that radical for the times.

not really "common" period....

 

[Dwight]

What Obama's Mentor Thought About General Motors - Forbes

Interesting then if this person was, and remains, so influential on President Obama that the President would take a very different tack towards it 40 years later. Davis must be spinning in his grave.

 

[MaggieD]

1) I am giving him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't.
2) It doesn't fit the timeline, this is about when the first pass would be done.


As a person as a qualification for the job, sure.

As an a example of one of the problems with the tax code system, no. Sadly some people need concrete examples for these to click, the idea in abstract just doesn't take root in their mind. *shrug*

Well!! I completely agree with you. It is most definitely a concrete example of the need for tax reform. We say/claim we have a progressive tax system in this country. We do not. Because Congress Clowns have bastardized the tax code so completely, the 1% not only don't pay more of a percentage of income, they actually pay less.

*This* should be the message. Not hounding Romney for following the law. And what has our government done about it? Absolutely positively nothing. Romney talks about it . . . even if he were elected, does he have the political will? Would Congress cooperate? He says he intends to lower the tax rate on the rich . . . but BUT!! get rid of the loopholes they use to lower their taxes beyond low right now. I hope he can do that. But frankly, I don't see him being elected. Obama? All he wants to do is raise them -- and we already know what effect that will have -- not much -- with all the game playing that's part of our tax code, the rich will always find a way to work the system.

 

[Dwight]

*This* should be the message.

It is. You seem to have reading comprehension issues. :2razz:

And what has our government done about it? Absolutely positively nothing.

This particular one has been attempted to get fixed recently. The President called for it, Congress started moving it through, and then the lobbyist ****storm hit town and it died in Congress. Again.

Romney talks about it . . . even if he were elected, does he have the political will? Would Congress cooperate? He says he intends to lower the tax rate on the rich . . . but BUT!! get rid of the loopholes they use to lower their taxes beyond low right now. I hope he can do that.

If he is so eager to close this one but won't even stand up and say "this part of my tax return, I don't like how this works, this is a problem"?

 

[Mason66]

So, the fantasy film which makes up lies and documents nothing but to fill the racist feelings of right wingers is NOT partisan?

I would have to agree...it's fiction strictly used for entertainment...like FOX "news" or Limbaugh.

If what the OP says is correct and much of the film is Obamas own words, you are calling him a liar. You claim the whole movie is made up fantasy, so Obamas own words must be lies.

Is that what you want us to beleive?

 

[Mason66]

It's not clear in the movie...it's not documented. It's a fable that has been going on ever since the right wingers changed from Obama being a Christian with a racist pastor to these lies.

His helping the poor makes him far more Christian than the born again evangelicals in this nation.

Did you just claim something in a movie you have not seen is unclear? How would you know this?

 

[Mason66]

No it's not...it's twisted to fit the birther lies...and to satisfy the racist heart of those who see it.

Hedges vs. D



A film was created filled with the racist fantasies and fiction of a group of people who would spend money and make this reight wing pundit rich...NO facts were given...just feeding the pundits zeal and desire for racism.

Now a film you did not see is racist?

 

[Mason66]

Is that what you say about Catholics who donated to their church? He donated $4 million. Yes, money is fungible. But I just don't understand the hatred people have for Romney. He's done wonderful things in his life -- with his money. More than you've done. More than I've done. More than, probably, all of the people on this board put together.

I don't think liberals can understand a man like Romney.

Family comes first above all else and he helps other people as well.

They have tried as hard as they can to demonize him with no ammunition to work with other than he makes a lot of money.

We will see on election day if they have succeded.

 

[Mason66]

Funny, I thought the same about your post!

Too bad it's true. Or do you disagree that Romney inherited a large amount of wealth that enabled him to attend whichever university he wanted, and allowed him to meet well-connected people? Just wondering how far in the bubble you live.

....or do you think that Paris Hilton is not successful...and therefore her wealth can be taxed because it's not wealth accumulated through "success".

I guess if money = success to you, even certain porn stars are successful.

What do you mean by inherited?

It has been widely reported that when his father died he donated all of his inheritence to charity.

 

[Muddy Creek]

If what the OP says is correct and much of the film is Obamas own words, you are calling him a liar. You claim the whole movie is made up fantasy, so Obamas own words must be lies.

Is that what you want us to beleive?

Not at all. Why are you believing what he says in the first place? And why would anyone believe a republican pundit would publish the truth with youtube video?

Shirley Sherrod's lawsuit against Andrew Breitbart likely to continue - POLITICO.com

A defamation lawsuit a former Agriculture Department employee filed against conservative journalist Andrew Breitbart is likely to continue despite Breitbart's unexpected death on Wednesday night at age 43.

USDA rural development staffer Shirley Sherrod filed the lawsuit against Breitbart and Breitbart aide Larry O'Connor last February over the pair's role in publicizing a video of a Sherrod speech which appeared to suggest the African-American Agriculture Department official was biased against white people. The publicity led to Sherrod's forced resignation, apparently with the White House's approval.

While the clips and analysis posted at Breitbart's BigGovernment.com seemed to indicate that Sherrod was racist, the full video of of Sherrod's speech included her indicating she had learned a lesson from her earlier predispositions and had come to reject racial stereotyping.

. . .

Anyone can misrepresent a video clip,do you not agree?

 

[Mason66]

Not at all. Why are you believing what he says in the first place? And why would anyone believe a republican pundit would publish the truth with youtube video?

Shirley Sherrod's lawsuit against Andrew Breitbart likely to continue - POLITICO.com



Anyone can misrepresent a video clip,do you not agree?

OK since your default response is to disbleieve the OP, then how about the people on this board that have seen the movie. Will you beleive them that the movie is made up of Obamas own words and if you do beleive that, then again you are calling Obama a liar.

 

[Muddy Creek]

What do you mean by inherited?

It has been widely reported that when his father died he donated all of his inheritence to charity.

Well, being born of wealth had its privileges

PolitiFact | Mitt Romney says he didn't inherit money from his parents

Mitt Romney, making the case that he made his own wealth, said, "I didn't inherit money from my parents."

Indeed, he was already a wealthy man by the time his father, George, died in 1995. He did receive an inheritance but says he gave it away. We don't have independent confirmation of that. But a family-funded endowment at BYU started in 1998 to support the George W. Romney Institute of Public Management, bolstering Romney's claim.

Did Romney's career benefit from having well-to-do parents? It certainly eased his way, with their financial help allowing him to focus on his studies. But there's good evidence he also worked hard to make his own success, graduating with honors at BYU and Harvard, and building a reputation at Boston Consulting Group and Bain that ultimately catapulted him to wealth.

Romney wasn't entirely clear about the inheritance he gave away when he said he "didn't inherit money" from his parents. But he's right that such a gift wasn't key to his success. We rate his claim Half True.

Being the son of a wealthy politician and CEO had its advantages as far as allowing Romney to NOT work at school

 

[Mason66]

Well, being born of wealth had its privileges

PolitiFact | Mitt Romney says he didn't inherit money from his parents



Being the son of a wealthy politician and CEO had its advantages as far as allowing Romney to NOT work at school

So? What is your point? Is his education more or less valuable because the bills were paid?

I really don't understand the envy demonstrated in posts like this.

 

[Muddy Creek]

OK since your default response is to disbleieve the OP, then how about the people on this board that have seen the movie. Will you beleive them that the movie is made up of Obamas own words and if you do beleive that, then again you are calling Obama a liar.

How do you figure? I have proven republican pundits lie. And those on the board who saw it are anti-Obama voters. I think I've pretty much shown that the movie is nothing more than a right wing propaganda speech during an election time.

And the film is NOT based on Obama's Book, but on D'Souza's book

Jackie K. Cooper: 2016: Obama's America Is Propaganda as Entertainment

There is a documentary playing in theaters now titled 2016: Obama's America. This is a purely anti-Obama film and makes no pretensions of being otherwise. It is based on the book The Roots of Obama's Rage by Dinesh D'Souza, and the film features the author as the narrator of the story. He is also shown as an investigator/interviewer.

The movie traces Obama's background from his birth to the present, with emphasis on the people and places that formed his views. His father's life in Kenya is explored and one of Obama's half brothers is interviewed. There are no interviews with Obama in the film but there are quotes and references to his words in Dreams From My Father

There are no questions raised as to Obama's birthplace. It is stated as being Hawaii and is said to have been announced in local newspapers. There is however the issue of whether or not Obama's father was divorced from his first wife when he married Obama's mother. The makers of this movie assert he was not divorced.

A lot is made of Obama's adoption of anti-colonialism feelings. He saw evidence of what colonialism had done in Kenya and even in his native state of Hawaii. The movie asserts these feelings are evidenced in the policies he has promoted during his first term as president.

The film is well made and is crafted to hold the audience's attention. Those who are already anti-Obama will cling to every frame of film and every reference that supports their feelings about the man. Those who are pro-Obama will be enraged by what they will see as a slanted view of the man and his policies.

The main flaw in the film is its lack of balance. There is no attempt to show "the other side" of any issue. This is a movie with a message and a purpose, neither of which are intended to show a different interpretation of the facts submitted. For those who are not committed either way it does provide some food for thought.

2016: Obama's America is a propaganda piece. It is perfectly timed to reach audiences during the frenzy of the Republican Convention. For those who are looking for further proof that Obama has to be defeated, the facts in this film will be like manna from Heaven. For those who are pleased with the job the president is doing and still find him the only one who can deliver "Hope and Change" this movie will be considered a worthless piece of trash.

Republicans anticipate this movie will feed the faithful and raise questions with the undecided. Movies and other forms of entertainment have done this in the past. Whether or not 2016" Obama's America will is the big question.

Propaganda and nothing more

 

[Mason66]

How do you figure? I have proven republican pundits lie. And those on the board who saw it are anti-Obama voters. I think I've pretty much shown that the movie is nothing more than a right wing propaganda speech during an election time.

And the film is NOT based on Obama's Book, but on D'Souza's book

Jackie K. Cooper: 2016: Obama's America Is Propaganda as Entertainment



Propaganda and nothing more

You have "shown" nothing. You have an opinion that it is and it is nothing more than your opinion. Everybody has them.

You can keep defending Obama all you want. I hope it makes you happy.

 

[Muddy Creek]

So? What is your point? Is his education more or less valuable because the bills were paid?

I really don't understand the envy demonstrated in posts like this.

What envy? Oh, the old propaganda lines of the right wingers that democrats are envious of the wealth on the right. That's as trite as Obama 2016 being a documentary.

What is explains is that his father's wealth allowed Romney to go to elite schools. His father's political and CEO background put interest in him. Romney did not have work harder than anyone to pay the bills. Did Romney take advantage of the fact his dad was rich and study hard? He claims so. But he got where he was by his daddy's wealth, and background, opening doors for him.