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Is anyone poised to leave the US if Trump wins?

Only if Trump agrees that when he loses, and he will bigly, that he will leave the US and never return.
 
I and my family have spent my working life living in many different countries and are fortunate to have citizenship in some of them, meaning we have options other than the US. Most recently, and currently, I have been working a contract in New Zealand. One of several periods we have spent working there over many years. We we also have some relatives there. I have decided that this will probably be my last contract before retirement, so our family have been discussing our future plans. Wife and kids all have jobs here as well, but nothing that they couldn't leave behind if they wanted to. As a group we are about 75% stay in NZ, or possibly Australia where we can also live and work, but that is a little more complicated. We can also move back to Europe, but that is not the preferred choice. There are some minor calls among the family to go back to the US, but having lived in different countries we all have a pretty decent external perspective on US life, and not so much the rose tinted glasses.

We haven't made a final decision yet, and don't need to until next year, but if Trump was to get elected again, we would 100% not be coming to the US other than to visit friends etc. Not so much due to Trump himself, awful as he is, but because it would be for us a sign of how much moral erosion has taken place in the US. You can't know as much as we know now about Trump, then make him president, and pretend that the countries morals aren't in the gutter. I personally am also disgusted by the seeming increase in far right Christian influence on US politics. No country does well once the religious zealots get enough control regardless of which religion. Religion is a personal thing. Keep your beliefs among yourself and others who share them. Once we let religious groups start controlling the lives of others we are on a very slippery path.

So for us, Trump would be a final nail in a what could be still a partially open coffin if Biden was reelected. Not that we love Joe B, but he is just a much more morally acceptable option than Trump. On top of that, Trumps influence has created absolutely awful political divisions in the US. Ones that can mess with your relationships and life. Once you live in a country with sane politics for a while you really realize how messed up the US has become with it's politics. It's not all Trumps fault, but he has certainly let the dogs out of the kennel. It is also depressing for me to observe the politics and corruption that has intruded into the judicial system. It's something that I seriously dislike and of course distrust. Given the corrupt nature of US politics (too much money), it feels like the last bastion of hope has been breached when you see the judicial system is corrupt as well.

I also have real concerns about the stability of the US economy. The Dems are doing some good things, but also some bad, as well as not enough good. My belief though is that another Trump term may push the country into real difficulties. Trump is a poor economist, and more scarily, won't listen to people who disagree with him. I am not sure that the economy will survive another Trump poorly designed tax cut along with what appears to be a possible all out assault on the welfare system. It might work just long enough for Trump to get through this next term, but it may well put the country on an unrecoverable path. Trump doesn't think long term or even medium term. For him it's all about the instant gratification, and he probably won't live much past the next term anyway given how he manages his health.

Talking to the locals here they say that there were reports of a massive influx of US applications for NZ citizenship after the 2016 election. Trouble for many though is that NZ is a damn hard country to immigrate to unless you have the particular skills and/or funding they are looking for at the time. Immigration here is viewed more as an economic tool to support economic growth than a political football like in the US. Unless they think you will add economic value by coming here the door is mostly shut other than for their annual quota of refugees etc. I guess it will be interesting to see if the same bump in immigration applications/enquiries occurs in 2025 should Trump win in Nov this year. Having said all that, I don't bump into lot of Americans here, so I don't think 2016 could have triggered a flood of US immigrants.
 
dseag2 said:
I retired early. We love Dallas but aren't married to it. I've researched Mexico, Costa Rica and Portugal. I have friends that live or have lived in each of those countries. Dealing with the bureaucracy and the lack of infrastructure isn't easy but it might be preferable to dealing with the tyrannical bullshit that a second Trump term would bring.

There is no "huff and puff" on my part, as another poster put it. Houses in our neighborhood are selling within a week. It is simply a matter of packing up and moving.
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Spent some time in Costa Rica. Hard to go wrong. Mexico however, has so much variety to offer. Baja California at one end, is fascinating in its own way, especially if you like fishing. But there are the wonders of Guanajuato and other colonial cities, the pyramids from the center of the country near the capitol to the Yucatán at the other end of the country, the often ignored Pátzcuaro, and on and on. Mexico City is worth a visit if only for its museum of anthropology. And the people. I visited Guatemala in the mid 1970s after its devastating earthquake. A teen boy we talked to was so proud of the teams from all over the world who came to help out, even from the communist bloc. “Pero los más locos fueron los mexicanos.” Trans: the craziest were the Mexicans. He was amazed how they could work hard all day and party all night. James Taylor’s song “Mexico” said it all.
 
Nickyjo said:
Spent some time in Costa Rica. Hard to go wrong. Mexico however, has so much variety to offer. Baja California at one end, is fascinating in its own way, especially if you like fishing. But there are the wonders of Guanajuato and other colonial cities, the pyramids from the center of the country near the capitol to the Yucatán at the other end of the country, the often ignored Pátzcuaro, and on and on. Mexico City is worth a visit if only for its museum of anthropology. And the people. I visited Guatemala in the mid 1970s after its devastating earthquake. A teen boy we talked to was so proud of the teams from all over the world who came to help out, even from the communist bloc. “Pero los más locos fueron los mexicanos.” Trans: the craziest were the Mexicans. He was amazed how they could work hard all day and party all night. James Taylor’s song “Mexico” said it all.
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Mexico is nice, just 4 hour drive from my house to some great beaches. We go often. I feel safer in Costa Rica, we also are planning time in Columbia.
 
EnchantedMuggle said:
I haven't noticed that on here but I can definitely hear it in my head coming from a Pub and it tracks. 😂 Appreciate it. Sometimes we need levity.
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I think most adults take the meme that way, however there are a few libruls that get triggered to the point of committing felonies over it:

 
hooligan said:
Some examples?
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Yeah, I've actually only heard this sentiment online, and then it's usually with the caveat that it probably won't happen anyway.

I heard this from George W. onward with each president.

I've never wanted to leave the U.S. permanently. Make changes, sure. Things change all the time; that's just life. Sometimes for the worse, sometimes for the better. We'll never have the perfect situation. I don't see that as a reason to take my ball and go home (or to a new home).
 
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Jack2aTee said:
Lots of people are talking about leaving the US if Trump wins the election. It remains to be seen how serious they are, it's probably just a lot of steam-letting, but there were quite a number who did leave when he won in 2016 and have been gravitating to other countries simply because they hate what American has become. I think the debate about whether to leave will intensify this second time around because of how candid Trump has been about what he plans to do with his dictatorship from 2025 to whenever he decides he's had enough. Anyone around here contemplating packing up and fleeing?

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there should also be a thread for Biden
 
Jack2aTee said:
Lots of people are talking about leaving the US if Trump wins the election. It remains to be seen how serious they are, it's probably just a lot of steam-letting, but there were quite a number who did leave when he won in 2016 and have been gravitating to other countries simply because they hate what American has become. I think the debate about whether to leave will intensify this second time around because of how candid Trump has been about what he plans to do with his dictatorship from 2025 to whenever he decides he's had enough. Anyone around here contemplating packing up and fleeing?

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i have now made a parallel thread ….for Biden.
for fairness.s sake

but i am not againstvBiden
 
Ginger Ale said:
I have a daughter in Sweden, so I'd seriously consider it. I have a business here, so it would mean losing everything I've worked for. Trumps last presidency already had the highest amount of expats, I'm sure it will be higher if he wins this time. You have to have the money, family or skill to switch countries. It's not easy.
I truly think it will be the fall of Rome if he wins, eh, it was bound to happen at some point.

My dream is Canada feels sorry for us and we get refugee status. lol
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Sadly, it's not much better in Canada but I agree Trudeau is no Donald Trump.
 
hooligan said:
Paywall - who are these "many Americans", did they say?
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Well, I mean are you asking me for names like John Jones and Mary Crosby? They don't give specifics but the article is by Business Insider so you know it is reputable. Here is a paragraph:

"Gallup asks Americans ages 15 and up: "Ideally, if you had the opportunity, would you like to move PERMANENTLY to another country?" At the end of George W. Bush's presidency, the number responding "yes" was 11%. During Barack Obama's tenure, it was 10%. During Trump's presidency, it hit 16%. That's some 40 million Americans who wanted to leave their country behind, for good.

Young people are even more likely to be hopeful expats. Among those under 30, 24% wanted to leave America at the close of Bush's tenure, 18% during Obama's, and 30% during Trump's. As with all things Trump, there was a sharp gender divide: Only 20% of young men wanted to flee America, compared to a whopping 40% of young women."

You can ask, "Will they really leave" and of course the answer is No. But just the fact they want out of America is indication they are disgusted with America and would leave in a heartbeat if given the chance.
 
Jack2aTee said:
"Gallup asks Americans ages 15 and up: "Ideally, if you had the opportunity, would you like to move PERMANENTLY to another country?" At the end of George W. Bush's presidency, the number responding "yes" was 11%. During Barack Obama's tenure, it was 10%. During Trump's presidency, it hit 16%. That's some 40 million Americans who wanted to leave their country behind, for good.
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Superb. Let them go.

 
Mungo Jerry said:
Superb. Let them go.
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It's interesting that the 40 million Americans who wanted to leave represented only 16% of Americans and that was 8 years ago. Today according to statistics that is up to 30% if you're talking young people so say double. The number of women are double the number of men. While we know that 99% would never make good on their dreams, as I mentioned before just the fact they feel so disillusioned with America would translate into negative impacts on the economy and social fabric. My own belief is that people who dislike America so much don't try to be good citizens. And if everybody who didn't like Trump left that would cut the population in half. This can't be good for the country's well-being.
 
Jack2aTee said:
Lots of people are talking about leaving the US if Trump wins the election. It remains to be seen how serious they are, it's probably just a lot of steam-letting, but there were quite a number who did leave when he won in 2016 and have been gravitating to other countries simply because they hate what American has become. I think the debate about whether to leave will intensify this second time around because of how candid Trump has been about what he plans to do with his dictatorship from 2025 to whenever he decides he's had enough. Anyone around here contemplating packing up and fleeing?

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No.

I'm gonna shit all over everyone's MAGA.
 
Jack2aTee said:
Well, I mean are you asking me for names like John Jones and Mary Crosby? They don't give specifics but the article is by Business Insider so you know it is reputable. Here is a paragraph:

"Gallup asks Americans ages 15 and up: "Ideally, if you had the opportunity, would you like to move PERMANENTLY to another country?" At the end of George W. Bush's presidency, the number responding "yes" was 11%. During Barack Obama's tenure, it was 10%. During Trump's presidency, it hit 16%. That's some 40 million Americans who wanted to leave their country behind, for good.

Young people are even more likely to be hopeful expats. Among those under 30, 24% wanted to leave America at the close of Bush's tenure, 18% during Obama's, and 30% during Trump's. As with all things Trump, there was a sharp gender divide: Only 20% of young men wanted to flee America, compared to a whopping 40% of young women."

You can ask, "Will they really leave" and of course the answer is No. But just the fact they want out of America is indication they are disgusted with America and would leave in a heartbeat if given the chance.
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Laugh if you want, but we watch Househunters International and most of those moving to foreign countries seem to be Millennials and GenZers who want to leave behind the rat race in the US and work in a country that offers more of a "zen" atmosphere. Many work from home so they can work anywhere. I would have never done that as a young person, so I admire them for their sense of adventure.

That leads me to believe that there are young people who will also leave the country if Trump is elected. There are very inexpensive places for young people to move to and they are not tied to living in 3,000 square foot houses like previous generations. It is more about quality of life for them.
 
dseag2 said:
Laugh if you want, but we watch Househunters International and most of those moving to foreign countries seem to be Millennials and GenZers who want to leave behind the rat race in the US and work in a country that offers more of a "zen" atmosphere. Many work from home so they can work anywhere. I would have never done that as a young person, so I admire them for their sense of adventure.

That leads me to believe that there are young people who will also leave the country if Trump is elected. There are very inexpensive places for young people to move to and they are not tied to living in 3,000 square foot houses like previous generations. It is more about quality of life for them.
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I believe more young people want to escape the US than ever before. Work from home has made it possible for many. Trump may just be a catalyst for more doing it as young people tend to be more liberal and thus want to escape the MAGA madness. Good for them.
 
Jack2aTee said:
It's interesting that the 40 million Americans who wanted to leave represented only 16% of Americans and that was 8 years ago. Today according to statistics that is up to 30% if you're talking young people so say double. The number of women are double the number of men. While we know that 99% would never make good on their dreams, as I mentioned before just the fact they feel so disillusioned with America would translate into negative impacts on the economy and social fabric. My own belief is that people who dislike America so much don't try to be good citizens. And if everybody who didn't like Trump left that would cut the population in half. This can't be good for the country's well-being.
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I;d much rather they leave than stay here and not try to be god citizens.
 
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