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Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)[W:70:96]

Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

That is kinda funny :lol: but some Latinos can be just as prejudiced as some white people...and that is a fact....

I'm not surprised. All races are prejudiced against each other as are members of the same race who come from different countries. The Jews were white yet the white German Nazis and other white ethnic groups hated and killed them and the Gyspies. Members of the same race such as the Japanese and Chinese dislike each other and other Asians. Back in the 20's the Turks killed 1/2 a million Armenians and more recently the white Serbs and Bosnians were killing each other. My God, even the Indians and Pakistanis hate each other as do different Black Tribes in Africa. Remembering the black Hutus killed 1/2 million black Tutsis in Rwanda. Blacks in America are not afraid of white people but the black guy living down the street. I'm don't think the native Amerindians descended from the Asians who crossed the Bering Straits land bridge 12,000 year ago like different tribes very much either including but not limited to those in South and Central Latin America are fond of each other either.
 
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Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

Don't you just love those rose colored glasses....Prejudice can be very subtle.... Some people put other people in more than one category....Maybe GW looked at it as "good" black people vs "bad" black people--you know, those assholes who always get away..... Just like some people can "accept" an African American of light complexion, but shy away at darker skin, will be fine with straight or curly hair, but run like hell from an afro...
I get the "a^^holes who always get away..." bit and George was referring to the people burglarizing his neighborhood.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

Do I see U.N.C.L.E. coming down the wrong road? Again? no names of course...

Well let me know when you post it. Looking forward to it.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

I doubt there are many people would could positively prove they are NOT racist as can George Zimmerman. Black relatives. Took an African-American girl to the prom. Black business partner. Black friends. Raised funds for an African-American church. Started a petition for a black fella who had been assaulted.

Whatja you (not pointing at any particular member) got to prove you aren't a racist? Who is wearing the racist glasses is who looked at what happened and evaluated it based upon the race of both. Lots of people are racists against Latinos. A lot of African-Americans are. A lot of white people are. The racism is against GZ in terms of those who looked at the incident in racial terms. Then try to transpose their own racism to an assertion that GZ is also racist.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

I doubt there are many people would could positively prove they are NOT racist as can George Zimmerman. Black relatives. Took an African-American girl to the prom. Black business partner. Black friends. Raised funds for an African-American church. Started a petition for a black fella who had been assaulted.

Whatja you (not pointing at any particular member) got to prove you aren't a racist? Who is wearing the racist glasses is who looked at what happened and evaluated it based upon the race of both. Lots of people are racists against Latinos. A lot of African-Americans are. A lot of white people are. The racism is against GZ in terms of those who looked at the incident in racial terms. Then try to transpose their own racism to an assertion that GZ is also racist.

I adopted two black boys. I think that tops Zimmerman ;) :lamo
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)[W:70

WARNING: Only for the open minded:

Throughout all of the discussions surrounding the Trayvon Martin case I found it disturbing how people, who often question our political and legal processes otherwise, shamed anyone who did the same about this case. If you dared to suggest that we consider the injustices in the processes or perhaps the laws supporting the not guilty verdict or Zimmerman's actions, you were labeled a race-baiter or being burdened with white guilt. There seemed to be no effort to understand the opposing point of view; how race could have been seen by many as having been a factor. This judgement and lack of objectivity permeated several other threads that sprang up around this trial and the issue of race and racism in our legal system and our culture. A civil discussion was never really accomplished here. I found this opinion piece and thought it did a much better job of articulating my point then I ever did; explaining why this discussion is important and why we should have it despite the difficulties. Here are some highlights.

Though recognizing that the rule of law was upheld in this case, we can and should be able to question whether justice was in fact served and, more important, what the jury's decision reflects about deeper societal issues implicated in this case. There's much for us to question and debate about stand-your-ground laws, guns, concealed weapons and particularly race.

We must confront race, admit racism still exists and discuss how it plays out in our society -- without being accused of playing the race card or engaging in racial demagoguery...


Facing Reality: Race Matters | Hector Villagra

This is not an invitation to go round and round about this case again. Instead this is an invitation to try again to discuss the larger issues surrounding this case and perhaps to better understand a point of view that you may disagree with.

And YES,....I know there is a typo in the title....don't know how to fix it. Deal with it.

OD, I believe you when you say you want to have an honest discussion, and I can respect that. That said, I agree with others that your premise is flawed. We can't have an honest discussion when we have alternate realities. If you want to have a discussion, pick a case that was actually about race. Just so you know exactly where I'm coming from: If GZ had been black and a member of the black KKK and ended up getting assaulted by a white kid who was sitting on top of him slamming his head into the concrete, I would still say that the self defense law properly allows GZ to use deadly force. Point being, the Zimmerman/Martin case still wouldn't be about race, even if he were a racist. Self-defense laws don't have anything to do with race.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

This thread remains here for what reason? When will the brilliant moderators remove it? Why have they not removed it? What is the reason for it's perpetual run? The case is closed moderators or do you get your jollies by stirring up s##t?
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

I think a few reasons the thread is still here is because folk are still interested and it is part of that "honest discussion of race" the Libs keep touting they want, although, I question their sincerity. Turns out the Libs don't like the "honest discussion" when opposing views and opinions are posted. What they want is a blast whitey discussion. Libs don't like facing the reality of the true crime situation with the Nation. 61 blacks shot by other blacks over the 3 weeks of the Zimmerman Trial. Many shot and killed. Where do the whites come into this deal let alone the Hispanics?
 
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Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

I think a few reasons the thread is still here is because folk are still interested and it is part of that "honest discussion of race" the Libs keep touting they want, although, I question their sincerity. Turns out the Libs don't like the "honest discussion" when opposing views and opinions are posted. What they want is a blast whitey discussion without facing the reality of the true crime situation with blacks.

Yep. There is always some "root cause" that makes the actions of a protected class of individuals not be seen as voluntary but "forced" upon them by some perceived wrong committed by "others". When asked to identify precisely which "others" are doing this wrong (or even what exactly that wrong is), we are told that it is widespread and systemic, thus no single person, policy or law need be cited as directly responsible, but that "we", as a society, must change things; spend more tax money on something or other. Again, identifying which specific "solution" is never seen really important (or identifying what current program should be replaced with "it"), in fact, we are then told that we should try (adding?) "many things" to see what may work.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

I think a few reasons the thread is still here is because folk are still interested and it is part of that "honest discussion of race" the Libs keep touting they want, although, I question their sincerity. Turns out the Libs don't like the "honest discussion" when opposing views and opinions are posted. What they want is a blast whitey discussion. Libs don't like facing the reality of the true crime situation with the Nation. 61 blacks shot by other blacks over the 3 weeks of the Zimmerman Trial. Many shot and killed. Where do the whites come into this deal let alone the Hispanics?

There is no money or power in the status quo. The media knows race baiting draws in viewers. Government officials know white on black gun crime supports an anti-gun agenda. It almost seems as if black on black crime is OK as long as it can be used to push an agenda. I mean if you really look at it, nothing is being done to address it, nothing. Then if someone does, it becomes an anti-gun rallying cry.

The dishonesty and misinformation combined with race baiting black so called leadership is nothing but a money/agenda based lie.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

There is no money or power in the status quo. The media knows race baiting draws in viewers. Government officials know white on black gun crime supports an anti-gun agenda. It almost seems as if black on black crime is OK as long as it can be used to push an agenda. I mean if you really look at it, nothing is being done to address it, nothing. Then if someone does, it becomes an anti-gun rallying cry.

The dishonesty and misinformation combined with race baiting black so called leadership is nothing but a money/agenda based lie.

That's an interesting angle it would explain why the media so clearly misrepresented the facts in the case especially when NBC completely butchered the 911 call made by Zimmerman editing it in a way that made it look like there were undertones of racial motivations/profiling of TM. In that way I can see how some people would jump to the conclusions they did but it doesn't excuse them in my opinion.

Time magazine had a large spread over the outcome of the Zimmerman trial, there were a few different articles on it all of which were factually misleading in one way or another or just down right wrong and none of which brought up the fact that Zimmerman was found not guilty because TM was slamming his head into the pavement...there was no discussion on that. It's a shame because then they went into discussing how to keep their children safe, it's simple tell them if someone is following them to go straight home, call a parent or someone close by who can help if they do not trust the police, lock the doors and do not approach the stranger and do not start attacking them.
 
Re: Facing Reality: Race Matters (questioning justice in the Travon Martin case)

Should I take that as a NO?

That depends on you.

If you want to discuss racism in conjunction with George Zimmerman then you are going to have to first start off by proving that race played a role. So no more underhanded attacks by "joking" around about everyone's IQ level or stating that only you and people like you have a "magical" ability to see the subconscious role that racism played in GZ's psyche. Your are claiming that his actions were in part influenced by race or racial discrimination, supposition on your part isn't evidence. Theorizing what subvert role basic discrimination plays in the minds of all of humanity isn't evidence.

So in order to have a discussion on this then you are first and foremost going to have to back up your position.

If you can't supply the evidence then there's no discussion to be had.
 
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