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Holder wants a nation of Cowards

MaggieD said:
I hope I didn't put you off -- that wasn't my intention. Anyhow, thanks for the information.
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and I enjoyed my conversation with you Maggie ... gotta make dinner for my son ... later ...
 
windowdressing said:
based on what we know, no, but let's see what they turn up ... and remember, it's a different burden of proof ... we probably agree that unless they have a strong case, leave it alone!
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The FBI has already investigated when this went national and came up with nothing. It only serves political purposes at this point for it to continue...
 
TurtleDude said:
If you are able to terminate a pattern of aggression, you might save the life or virginity of someone who cannot
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And if you don't rile someone up in the first place, it's not necessary.
trfjr said:
does running away from a preditor keep that preidtor at bay you end up with a bullet in your back all your doong is encourging and embolden preditors to continuee
what keeps prodarors at bay is the possible threat that they could meet their match
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That's not what Holder was saying. Holder was saying we need to have laws which state one should try to prevent a situation from getting to the point where it becomes violent. Walking away from the situation does that. Holder did not say you should run when someone is coming at you trying to kill you.
Fishstyx said:
Nothing to do with pride but survivability.
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Escalating a situation to a violent level has nothing to do with survivability. However, many times it does have a lot to do with pride. The point is to not escalate the situation to the point where violence is necessary and then use self-defense laws to justify your actions.

If you have the means to defend yourself, turning your back on your assailant not only puts you at a disadvantage, its puts you at risk.
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Then don't turn your back on them, but you can still walk away. Furthermore, why is the situation so heated where one needs to worry about putting yourself at risk?

All SYG laws do is remove the vague definition of "retreating as much as possible." These laws exist because people were being sent to jail for defending themselves by overzealous prosecutors.
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And they instead let George Zimmerman chase after a teenager, kill him and suffer no legal consequences.

Don't get me wrong, I do not have a problem with Zimmerman being found not guilty. But I do have a problem with escalating a situation to the point where someone dies, and that goes for Zimmerman, Martin and anyone else.
 
I say Trayvon Martin was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Anyone else could have just as easily fallen victim to this amateur vigilante white wannabee freak George Zimmermann...............
 
Bonzai said:
I say Trayvon Nartin was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Anyone else could have just as easily fallen victim to this amateur vigilante white wannabee freak George Zimmermann...............
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And both made some stupid decisions...

Damn, I don't like you as much when you're making some sense. You may want to drop the vigilante bit though...
 
AlabamaPaul said:
The FBI has already investigated when this went national and came up with nothing. It only serves political purposes at this point for it to continue...
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the FBI did not find anyone willing to say he was a racist ... but the DOJ has more info now that the trial is over and may have new leads ... we'll see, but, again, unless they have a strong case, they shouldn't pursue it ... I feel the same way about the protests surrounding this trial ... if you're going to use an incident or case to highlight the racism in our country, make it one where the racism is pretty clear, otherwise the next time you raise the issue, it'll be that much harder to convince people ...

Do I think race played a part, yes, but would I use this case as a good example of racism in this country? No, not from what I've read or seen ...

gotta go. GO TIDE! (BTW, the new couple is moved into a nice house with a fenced in yard for their dog and are pretty happy in NC.)
 
Bonzai said:
Even more real are Hispanic Supermen who are so super they think they're white.......................
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Or have the media declare them to be such, in any case. I've got no problem with Zimmerman or Trayvon regardless of their racial backgrounds.

I simply take offense to the notion that I should feel any kind of "racial guilt" over an act that wasn't even committed by a member of my race in the first place.

Retrospective self-loathing has to be earned, damnit! No freebies. :lol:
 
trfjr said:
what evidence do you have that Zimmerman intention was to confront Martin only evidence there is that Zimmerman wanted to keep an eye on Martin to either discourage Martin from committing a crime or to be able to tell the police where he was. And if it was Zimmerman intention was to confront Martin why didn't he have his gun pulled already does a cop enter a building when he feels there is danger in the building with out his gun pulled?
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All I am saying is, is Zimmerman wouldn't be as brave as he was if he didn't have his gun. His gun gave him security.
 
Slyfox696 said:
That's not what Holder was saying. Holder was saying we need to have laws which state one should try to prevent a situation from getting to the point where it becomes violent. Walking away from the situation does that. Holder did not say you should run when someone is coming at you trying to kill you.
Escalating a situation to a violent level has nothing to do with survivability. However, many times it does have a lot to do with pride. The point is to not escalate the situation to the point where violence is necessary and then use self-defense laws to justify your actions.
.
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then according to yours and Holders philosophy it was Martin in the wrong not Zimmerman if he would have continued to run instead of turning back and confronting Zimmerman none of this would have happened it was Martin who escalated the situation not Zimmerman
 
AlabamaPaul said:
And both made some stupid decisions...

Damn, I don't like you as much when you're making some sense. You may want to drop the vigilante bit though...
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Thanks (I think), Yoda................
 
joko104 said:
Nothing wrong with wanting to be a cop. Nothing at all. Nothing wrong with wanting to be the eyes and ears of cops. Nothing at all.

In fact, as good citizenship, we all should be the eyes and ears for law enforcement - and people are told to do so by local police and even by the DofH.
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nonsense. He had a cellphone. He called 911. It should have ended there. We don't need a nation of armed idiots running around thinking they are Wyatt ****ing Earp.
 
pbrauer said:
All I am saying is, is Zimmerman wouldn't be as brave as he was if he didn't have his gun. His gun gave him security.
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so when have you become a mind reader to be able to tell what somebody will or will not do
 
windowdressing said:
I'm giving up Maggie ... I don't know how many times I have to say the jury probably rendered the right verdict ... but none of us knows what really happened that night ... the verdict is in, the DOJ may file civil rights charges, a juror or two will write a book, GZ may write his own book and otherwise make some serious cash on this, and I won't be surprised if GZ gets arrested in the future for something, as he had in the past (including assaulting a police officer) ... we'll see ... (and hopefully FL will consider it's SYG law) ...
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Posting GZ "assaulted a police officer" had been a lie all 10,000 times anti-GZ people have posted it on the forum.
 
windowdressing said:
the FBI did not find anyone willing to say he was a racist ... but the DOJ has more info now that the trial is over and may have new leads ... we'll see, but, again, unless they have a strong case, they shouldn't pursue it ... I feel the same way about the protests surrounding this trial ... if you're going to use an incident or case to highlight the racism in our country, make it one where the racism is pretty clear, otherwise the next time you raise the issue, it'll be that much harder to convince people ...

Do I think race played a part, yes, but would I use this case as a good example of racism in this country? No, not from what I've read or seen ...

gotta go. GO TIDE! (BTW, the new couple is moved into a nice house with a fenced in yard for their dog and are pretty happy in NC.)
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Have a good evening. SEC media days began today so football season is not too far off...
 
I don't see how any community could be deemed safe for anyone with this guy living in it.....................
 
calamity said:
nonsense. He had a cellphone. He called 911. It should have ended there. We don't need a nation of armed idiots running around thinking they are Wyatt ****ing Earp.
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What a stupid message. I don't think Wyatt Earp would have conducted himself like GZ did. I think when TM came into GZ's face like he did, Wyatt Earp would have likely pistol whipped TM into the ground and then dragged him off to jail, unless the town's folk took over and hung TM because the people in Wyatt Earp's world didn't care much for mouthy black guys.

What is revealing is that GZ did NOT have his hand on his gun when TM slammed him in the face.
 
calamity said:
nonsense. He had a cellphone. He called 911. It should have ended there. We don't need a nation of armed idiots running around thinking they are Wyatt ****ing Earp.
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i hope one day your in a situation that your hurt and your life is in danger and required help and all some one does is call 911 and leaves you their to die and says its not my job im not a doctor
 
trfjr said:
i hope one day your in a situation that your hurt and your life is in danger and required help and all some one does is call 911 and leaves you their to die and says its not my job im not a doctor
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Huh? How is that related to Zimmerman clearly stepping beyond what was even remotely necessary, harassing an innocent unarmed teenager?
 
trfjr said:
i hope one day your in a situation that your hurt and your life is in danger and required help and all some one does is call 911 and leaves you their to die and says its not my job im not a doctor
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The point could have been made a bit more delicately without wishing harm on anyone else...
 
joko104 said:
What a stupid message. I don't think Wyatt Earp would have conducted himself like GZ did. I think when TM came into GZ's face like he did, Wyatt Earp would have likely pistol whipped TM into the ground and then dragged him off to jail, unless the town's folk took over and hung TM because the people in Wyatt Earp's world didn't care much for mouthy black guys.

What is revealing is that GZ did NOT have his hand on his gun when TM slammed him in the face.
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There is no proof that "TM slammed him in the face." Proof is that Zimermann left his truck when he did not need to, was in fact instructed not to, and that there was a fight, one which Z clearly lost.
 
calamity said:
Huh? How is that related to Zimmerman clearly stepping beyond what was even remotely necessary, harassing an innocent unarmed teenager?
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No harassment or provocation was proven during the trial...
 
I would say the authors of these various SYG laws know absolutely zero about human nature............................
 
trfjr said:
so when have did you become a mind reader to be able to tell what somebody will or will not do
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I don't read minds, but I do have an opinion.:cool:
 
AlabamaPaul said:
The point could have been made a bit more delicately without wishing harm on anyone else...
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It would have been relevant to if the Martin kid was raping someone and Zimmerman came to the rescue. But, clearly, the only thing Trayvon was molesting was a bag of skittles.
 
joko104 said:
Posting GZ "assaulted a police officer" had been a lie all 10,000 times anti-GZ people have posted it on the forum.
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he was charged with it, but the charges were dropped ... What did Zimmerman's father do for a living? Do you know by any chance?
 
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