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Re: Verdict reached - 07/13/13
OK... Listen up haymarket...
No he did not.
That certainly wasn't the case that night. When Martin ran and then turned south between the buildings headed toward his fathers house, he was out of sight of Zimmerman and it remained that way for 4 minutes. So if that were the case, he could have easily returned to the safety of his fathers house less than a 100 yards away, but he didn't. He instead hid out of sight and waited for Z to finish his call with the police and pass by, then confronted him.
Another reason we know that wasn't the case, is because he didn't call 911, call his father, or have his friend he was on the phone with call 911. Why do you think she thought nothing of it when the fight broke out and the phone went dead?
You can argue that getting out of his truck wasn't a very wise thing to do, but it doesn't justify him being violently attacked.
That is meaningless, because he was not leagally required to obay the dispatcher on the phone. From what is known, he did try and visually spot Martin, but did not advance in the direction that Martin dissapeared in, so he did not "follow" Martin from that point forward.
No, he was a man that offered his time and joined neighborhood watch because he wanted to help make a difference in his community. All the man tried to do that night, was try and keep an eye on Martin so he could direct police to him when they arrived.
Again, irrelevant... Nothing Zimmerman did was illegal or reckless.
Zimmerman's actions were not unreasonable, but Martin's were. Martin had no right to confront and assault Zimmerman, and if he would have just ended the fight instead of ignoring Z's screams and continuing the "ground and pound" beating, Martin would be alive today... Probably in jail for assault, but alive none the less.
Florida statutes 776.012, 776.013, 776.041 and all other applicable laws concerning self defense are HERE
Also, here are the judges instruction to the jury specifically on the issue of self defense, which makes it clear the standards the jury must use:
That right there is why he was found not guilty, and why this case should have never gone to trial in the first place.
You can find the laws that support those instructions in 776.012(1), 776.013(1), 776.013(3), 776.041
You really need to do a little leg work before arguing this case. There are several of us around here including myself, who followed this thing for 15 months and know every aspect of this case because we took the time to learn the law, study all the facts, and read all the witness statements and testimony.
OK... Listen up haymarket...
I am not sure if Zimmerman did anything legally wrong in following Martin that night
No he did not.
but he certainly acted in a manner that could cause a reasonable person to believe they were in imminent danger from that person following them.
That certainly wasn't the case that night. When Martin ran and then turned south between the buildings headed toward his fathers house, he was out of sight of Zimmerman and it remained that way for 4 minutes. So if that were the case, he could have easily returned to the safety of his fathers house less than a 100 yards away, but he didn't. He instead hid out of sight and waited for Z to finish his call with the police and pass by, then confronted him.
Another reason we know that wasn't the case, is because he didn't call 911, call his father, or have his friend he was on the phone with call 911. Why do you think she thought nothing of it when the fight broke out and the phone went dead?
I think that is also reasonable. Zimmerman is not without fault in doing that and he is not as pure as the driven snow regarding his own actions.
You can argue that getting out of his truck wasn't a very wise thing to do, but it doesn't justify him being violently attacked.
In addition, he was told by authorities that they did not need him to continue to follow Zimmerman and he rejected that advice and did it anyway.
That is meaningless, because he was not leagally required to obay the dispatcher on the phone. From what is known, he did try and visually spot Martin, but did not advance in the direction that Martin dissapeared in, so he did not "follow" Martin from that point forward.
Again, probably not illegal but it certainly shows he is not some idealistic virgin with sacred motives and a choir of singing angels on his side vouching for his purity.
No, he was a man that offered his time and joined neighborhood watch because he wanted to help make a difference in his community. All the man tried to do that night, was try and keep an eye on Martin so he could direct police to him when they arrived.
And one way or another, a physical fight started between the guy who was following the other at night and who was told not to do it by the authorities that he called.
Again, irrelevant... Nothing Zimmerman did was illegal or reckless.
.So if we are talking about what actions were reasonable, I certainly do not think his were
Zimmerman's actions were not unreasonable, but Martin's were. Martin had no right to confront and assault Zimmerman, and if he would have just ended the fight instead of ignoring Z's screams and continuing the "ground and pound" beating, Martin would be alive today... Probably in jail for assault, but alive none the less.
But again, I would love to read the law you are citing which states clearly that you must give the person claiming self defense full belief of their word unless they did something illegal. I would love to read that. Because - in the end- that is what this case came down to and Zimmermans own actions tell me he is not to be believed and the benefit of the reasonable doubt should NOT be extended to him.
Florida statutes 776.012, 776.013, 776.041 and all other applicable laws concerning self defense are HERE
Also, here are the judges instruction to the jury specifically on the issue of self defense, which makes it clear the standards the jury must use:
"If GZ was not engaged in unlawful activity and was attacked in any place where he had a right to be, he had no duty to retreat and had the right to stand his ground and meet force with force, including deadly force, if he resonably believed that it was nessisary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or another, or to prevent the commission of a forcable felony. In considering the issue of self defense, you can take into account the reletive physical abilities and capabilities of both GZ and TM. In your consideration of the issue of self defense, you have a reasonable doubt on the question of whether GZ was justified in the use of deadly force, you must find GZ not guilty..."
That right there is why he was found not guilty, and why this case should have never gone to trial in the first place.
You can find the laws that support those instructions in 776.012(1), 776.013(1), 776.013(3), 776.041
You really need to do a little leg work before arguing this case. There are several of us around here including myself, who followed this thing for 15 months and know every aspect of this case because we took the time to learn the law, study all the facts, and read all the witness statements and testimony.