When could Zimmerman's history come in?

• State's motion to perpetuate testimony of a witness who will be absent during the time of trial - GRANTED (This witness may be one who also attended GZ's educational institution)

• State' motion to block all self-serving second hand statements regarding the defendant - GRANTED

• Defense Motion for Sanctions - DENIED

• Defense motion to relax the Florida Rules of Evidence on authentication so that he could submit information from Trayvon's phone - DENIED (duh)

• Defense Motion to prohibit the use of certain terms in opening statements - DENIED

• Defense Asks for 2 exceptions to the restriction on second hand self-serving statements - QUASHED

• Def asks to submit external evidence not presented at the Frye hearing - DENIED

Paperview said:

Thank you for the thread, and with hopes the posters will respect your guidelines to keeping it on topic.

I am adding this, of which some of it is not so relevant, in the hopes of just giving a recap of today for those who did not see it.

It does however contain a very relevant part that goes to the heart of what you have brought up.

Note the second line item here:

• State's motion to perpetuate testimony of a witness who will be absent during the time of trial - GRANTED (This witness may be one who also attended GZ's educational institution)

• State' motion to block all self-serving second hand statements regarding the defendant - GRANTED

(This one is a biggie because it means if the defense wants to put on anything positive about GZ, GZ will have to choose to take the stand and testify himself and that opens the door to cross-examination and character evidence.)

• Defense Motion for Sanctions - DENIED

• Defense motion to relax the Florida Rules of Evidence on authentication so that he could submit information from Trayvon's phone - DENIED (duh)

• Defense Motion to prohibit the use of certain terms in opening statements - DENIED

• Defense Asks for 2 exceptions to the restriction on second hand self-serving statements - QUASHED

(West failed to submit a written motion and exhibits)

• Def asks to submit external evidence not presented at the Frye hearing - DENIED

(West failed to submit this evidence at the Frye hearing)
(-Credit to Dasien for compiling)

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ABC10 said:

5th Appeals Court Judges, heads up - more hot potatoes are coming your way.
I have no doubt that the hoodie clad Martin walking around in at night in the rain is going to scare the daylight out of those women, particularly the one from Chicago where daily citizens are being killed including children sitting and playing outside or hiding in their bathtubs as shots are being fired. How bout the two that Bernie tried to strike but failed and they are now on the jury.

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AlfredENeuman said:

Are you incapable of staying on topic? There's already a thread on the makeup of the jury. This thread is about scenarios in which prior history can come into a trial and specifically this trial.

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Excon said:

Strange.
Apparently you are being selective in who you chastise.

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AlfredENeuman said:

My point is that while you're most likely correct, I'd like to understand the "UNLESS" scenarios.

Let me clarify the question. We know that the default position is that neither of these things will come in, for both sides.

The state cannot tell the jury that Zimmerman assaulted a police officer and got a restraining order for domestic violence. They cannot tell the jury that he needed a nine month program on anger management. Those things would likely prejudice a jury against him, so the rules say it can't come in...UNLESS...

Unless what? Unless he takes the stand and says something untruthful about himself that is contradicted by the record.

Likewise, the defense cannot mention that Martin was suspended from school for writing on a locker, or being found with a pot baggie. Why? It's not relevant to that night and would only prejudice the jury against him. This would not be admissible...UNLESS...

This hurdle is a lot harder to climb. The state will introduce witnesses that knew Martin, but only to ask them about that night. They will ask Witness 8 about what she heard over the phone and that's all. The defense can only cross examine her about the scope of what she testified about, not start a fishing expedition into Martin's school records. Same with his mother, if she even testifies. They will ask her one question: whose voice do you hear? The defense can't then come back and ask "your son was a pothead, was he not?"

So what kind of things could REALISTICALLY happen that would change this? What kind of blunder could a prosecutor make that would bring this into a trial? I'm not seeing it but I'm open to hearing theories.

Zimmerman's case is much easier to see, since fully half of all defendants who take the stand end up with their prior bad acts in front of the jury. And for a guy like Zimmerman, whose bad acts consist of a) following "suspects" in what normal people would consider a reckless way, and b) actual violence, and who really likes to talk and EXPLAIN HIMSELF, I can easily see him slipping up and getting the prior assault in front of a jury.

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AlfredENeuman said:

Are you incapable of staying on topic? There's already a thread on the makeup of the jury. This thread is about scenarios in which prior history can come into a trial and specifically this trial.

TIA

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Paperview said:

Found out the name of the new witness the State wants to have provide perpetuate testimony.

I'm guessing it's in regard to the classes he taught GZ in, re: Criminal Justice, perhaps his knowledge of SYG, etc...

The name is "Gordon Pleasants"

Seminole State College of Florida Professor

CJE 2566 Teaches Introduction to Domestic Violence, Stalking.../ Intro to Law.

https://www.myedu.com/Seminole-Stat...f-Florida/Pleasants-Gordon/professor/4397126/

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ABC10 said:

Well, that's a hot one. We already know that George was not a stellar student as neither was Martin. George, however, did not get himself suspended 3X in 6 months. And yes, the school asked him to leave. They will be included in the next round of lawsuits after George finishes with NBC.

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Paperview said:

He did OK in some areas:

By cross referencing Zimmerman's transcript and a number of links to student evaluations of Professor Gordon Pleasants, it may be that this witness was the professor for the following course:

CJE 2600 course Criminal Investigation
The fundamental principles, concepts and theory of investigation, interviews, interrogations, surveillance and sources of information, case preparations, problems in criminal investigation and investigative techniques of specific crimes are explored in this course.

George received a B in this course.

Other possibilities are:

PLA 2303 Criminal Litigation
This course is designed to prepare the legal assistant to assist the trial attorney in preparing for criminal litigation in the Florida and federal courts. Special emphasis is placed on substantive criminal law, federal constitutional law and application of the state and federal Rules of Criminal Procedures.

George received an A in this course.

CCJ 2618 - Evil Minds - Violent Predators
This course will provide a basic understanding of those individuals who engage in predator violence: serial killers, mass murderers, serial rapists and stalkers. This course will discuss the ways law enforcement is dealing with these types of persons to detect, arrest and prosecute them. The course will also discuss ways in which male and female predators are similar and different. The course will also discuss which victims are selected and why a particular person becomes a victim.

George received a C in this course.

CCJ 1020 - Introduction to Criminal Justice
This course consists of the history, examination and evaluation of the courts, the police and the correctional organizations of the criminal justice system in the United States today. Contemporary problems and possible solutions are also considered.

George received a D in this course.


Course Catalog: Catalog 2013-14 - Seminole State College of Florida

Credit to MorganMars for the above.

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Excon said:

WTF is this?
You post what his grades supposedly are, and then provide a supporting link to the course catalog?

:naughty

Provided a link to his actual grades so they can be verified.

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sharon said:

This may help.

He got D’s in Introduction to Criminal Justice and Juvenile Delinquency, and a C in a course called Evil Minds -Violent Predators. He failed algebra and astronomy and had been placed on academic probation in 2011.

At one point, his grade-point average dropped to a .5. His A’s in English, criminal litigation and a Marriage and Family class boosted his overall G.P.A. to 2.3.

In late 2011, he was declined an associate’s degree because he had failed a class and did not have the credits to graduate. He was expelled from the school about three weeks after the killing, when the struggling student suddenly became the focus of a national media firestorm for having killed an unarmed teenager.

Read more here: Records show George Zimmerman got D’s in criminal justice classes - Trayvon Martin - MiamiHerald.com

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