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Why I believe that George Zimmerman is going to walk

danarhea

danarhea

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IMHO, George Zimmerman's actions were reckless, and a case can be made for manslaughter, but it is a huge leap in logic to conclude that he committed murder. He provoked Martin, was getting his ass kicked, and in the heat of getting his ass kicked, shot Martin to death. This is not murder, folks. However, this is what Zimmerman has been charged with, and it looks like there will be no option for a jury consider manslaughter. To be honest, if I were on that jury, and the only options available were either acquittal or guilty of murder, I would be leaning strongly towards acquittal, because the prosecution is going way too far in it's attempts to send Zimmerman to prison. Is this out of political expediency because of all the publicity this case has garnered? Who knows, but that is not germane to my logic. Manslaughter? OK, I can consider that. Murder? No way.

My prediction, based on the above analysis? Zimmerman walks.
 
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he will be convicted of Manslaughter, as he stalked a juvenile and ended up killing him.

Even if he acted in self-defense against Martin's attacks, the fact that he stalked him first, means a crime was still committed.

when you stalk a juvenile and end up killing them, EVEN in self-defense, you have committed Manslaughter, under Florida law.
 
Thunder said:
he will be convicted of Manslaughter, as he stalked a juvenile and ended up killing him.

Even if he acted in self-defense against Martin's attacks, the fact that he stalked him first, means a crime was still committed.

when you stalk a juvenile and end up killing them, EVEN in self-defense, you have committed Manslaughter, under Florida law.
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According to the prosecution, manslaughter will not be a choice the jury will be allowed to make. The charge is second degree murder, and the prosecution is going all in on that charge. There is a chance that the judge may tell the jury that they can consider manslaughter, but don't count on it.
 
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danarhea said:
According to the prosecution, manslaughter will not be a choice the jury will be allowed to make. The charge is second degree murder, and the prosecution is going all in on that charge.
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Sure they will.. Under Florida Law Manslaughter, aggravated manslaughter all fall under Murder 2.

If the the jury thinks the evidence doesn't rise to the level of Murder 2, they can find on the lesser charge of manslaughter etc.
 
yep, stalkers always alert the police to come to the scene of their stalking [/s]
 
sharon said:
Sure they will.. Under Florida Law Manslaughter, aggravated manslaughter all fall under Murder 2.

If the the jury thinks the evidence doesn't rise to the level of Murder 2, they can find on the lesser charge of manslaughter etc.
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That depends on the prosecutor, and the judge's instructions to the jury. I don't see it happening here.
 
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danarhea said:
That depends on the prosecutor. I don't see it happening here.
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No.. That the law in Florida.. Aggravated manslaughter is when you kill a minor with a firearm.
 
sharon said:
http://www.talkleft.com/zimm/capias1.pdf

Request for Capias March 13

Homicide, negligent manslaughter.
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Wrong capias document. This was issued to the Sanford Police department on March the 13th. After that, the Sanford Police department determined that Zimmerman had invoked stand your ground, and so that document no longer applied. The capias document in force is the one that was later issued, which charged Zimmerman with second degree murder, issued April 11.

However, if what sharon says is correct, then I am wrong in my analysis, and Zimmerman could be convicted of manslaughter. I would like to see some documentation on that claim first, before I give up my argument. Not being a hardhead or anything. Would just like to see the evidence that backs up sharon's statement. I am willing to listen.
 
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danarhea said:
OK, I was unaware of that.
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I think that murder 2 was a stretch...

But, under Florida Law if you create a circumstance that makes another person fearful for their life or safety .. and they are doing nothing unlawful... you have "assaulted" them.

It goes to a universal legal theory that is reflected in every state's laws even if the statutes are worded differently.

The legal theory goes to negligent homicide.. or in layman's terms did your actions cause the death of another person and would a reasonable man have made the choices you made under the circumstances.

George had NO justification for following Trayvon except in his imagination.

Frank Taaffe said it .. He said Geroge was FED up and had anger issues.
 
danarhea said:
Wrong capias document. This was issued to the Sanford Police department on March the 13th. After that, the Sanford Police department determined that Zimmerman had invoked stand your ground, and so that document no longer applied. The capias document in force is the one that was later issued, which charged Zimmerman with second degree murder.

However, if what sharon says is correct, then I am wrong in my analysis, and Zimmerman could be convicted of manslaughter. I would like to see some documentation on that claim first, before I give up my argument. Not being a hardhead or anything. Would just like to see the evidence that backs up sharon's statement. I am willing to listen.
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I wouldn't hold my breath.
 
sharon said:
I think that murder 2 was a stretch...

But, under Florida Law if you create a circumstance that makes another person fearful for their life or safety .. and they are doing nothing unlawful... you have "assaulted" them.

It goes to a universal legal theory that is reflected in every state's laws even if the statutes are worded differently.

The legal theory goes to negligent homicide.. or in layman's terms did your actions cause the death of another person and would a reasonable man have made the choices you made under the circumstances.

George had NO justification for following Trayvon except in his imagination.

Frank Taaffe said it .. He said Geroge was FED up and had anger issues.
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Please do me a favor and document this for me. It's not that I don't believe you. I just want to see the supporting evidence before I shut the **** up. LOL.
 
danarhea said:
IMHO, George Zimmerman's actions were reckless, and a case can be made for manslaughter, but it is a huge leap in logic to conclude that he committed murder. He provoked Martin, was getting his ass kicked, and in the heat of getting his ass kicked, shot Martin to death. This is not murder, folks. However, this is what Zimmerman has been charged with, and it looks like there will be no option for a jury consider manslaughter. To be honest, if I were on that jury, and the only options available were either acquittal or guilty of murder, I would be leaning strongly towards acquittal, because the prosecution is going way too far in it's attempts to send Zimmerman to prison. Is this out of political expediency because of all the publicity this case has garnered? Who knows, but that is not germane to my logic. Manslaughter? OK, I can consider that. Murder? No way.

My prediction, based on the above analysis? Zimmerman walks.
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I'm not sure how it works. If the only thing they can find him guilty of is 2nd degree murder, then I agree: he'll walk. If they can find him guilty of manslaughter? Then I think he'll do some time. Depending on how the charges are filed (and I don't know what that depends upon), they may be able to find him guilty of a lesser charge.
 
danarhea said:
Wrong capias document. This was issued to the Sanford Police department on March the 13th. After that, the Sanford Police department determined that Zimmerman had invoked stand your ground, and so that document no longer applied. The capias document in force is the one that was later issued, which charged Zimmerman with second degree murder, issued April 11.

However, if what sharon says is correct, then I am wrong in my analysis, and Zimmerman could be convicted of manslaughter. I would like to see some documentation on that claim first, before I give up my argument. Not being a hardhead or anything. Would just like to see the evidence that backs up sharon's statement. I am willing to listen.
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The pdf document I linked is the March 13th request for Capias.

I posted on what I told you several months ago at length... but i am getting tired tonight.. Let me see what I can dig up for you tomorrow.
 
sharon said:
The pdf document I linked is the March 13th request for Capias.

I posted on what I told you several months ago at length... but i am getting tired tonight.. Let me see what I can dig up for you tomorrow.
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Again, wrong document. The capias document that applies is the one that was issued on April 11, charging Zimmerman with murder. This is the one I posted. The one you posted is worthless as evidence, since it was before the first determination had been made that Zimmerman had invoked stand your ground.
 
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Thunder said:
he will be convicted of Manslaughter, as he stalked a juvenile and ended up killing him.

Even if he acted in self-defense against Martin's attacks, the fact that he stalked him first, means a crime was still committed.

when you stalk a juvenile and end up killing them, EVEN in self-defense, you have committed Manslaughter, under Florida law.
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There was no stalking.


sharon said:
But, under Florida Law if you create a circumstance that makes another person fearful for their life or safety .. and they are doing nothing unlawful... you have "assaulted" them.
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Which is what Trayvon did, and partially why Zimmerman will walk.
 
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danarhea said:
OK, I was unaware of that.
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Well.. there are some other potential like ORs in that aggravated manslaughter statute.. the elderly or a police, fireman, rescue person on duty..

Go to Hornsby in FL.. he does plain English for lawyers and he's really sharp.
 
danarhea said:
Again, wrong document. The capias document that applies is the one that was issued on April 11, charging Zimmerman with murder. This is the one I posted. The one you posted is worthless as evidence, since it was before the first determination had been made that Zimmerman had invoked stand your ground.
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The police in most states HATE stand your ground because its's squishy and nobody understands it.. The SYG was brought up on 2/26..


Here.. and this guy is NO liberal.

Florida’s Disastrous Self-Defense Law

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/24/opinion/floridas-disastrous-self-defense-law.html

The big problem with SYG in Florida is because rival drug gangs are using it to whack each other and get off. See Volusia County.
 
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sharon said:
Well.. there are some other potential like ORs in that aggravated manslaughter statute.. the elderly or a police, fireman, rescue person on duty..

Go to Hornsby in FL.. he does plain English for lawyers and he's really sharp.
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You are asking me to provide proof of your claim? All I am asking you is to document your claim that manslaughter can automatically apply in this case. I don't see it in the capias warrant (the proper one, issued on April 11), and I do not know whether a judge would be forced by law to give a manslaughter instruction to a jury. You made the claim of manslaughter, not me. Therefore, it is on YOU to provide the proof. Again, I am not trying to be a hardass here, but when you make a claim, you must be prepared to back that up with a credible link. This is YOUR job, not mine.
 
danarhea said:
You are asking me to provide proof of your claim? All I am asking you is to document your claim that manslaughter can automatically apply in this case. I don't see it in the capias warrant (the proper one, issued on April 11), and I do not know whether a judge would be forced by law to give a manslaughter instruction to a jury. You made the claim of manslaughter, not me. Therefore, it is on YOU to provide the proof. Again, I am not trying to be a hardass here, but when you make a claim, you must be prepared to back that up with a credible link. This is YOUR job, not mine.
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Do whtever you like.. but if you want to know what the law is in Florida.. read Hornsby.

I am not of a mind to repost his whole website here.
 
sharon said:
Do whtever you like.. but if you want to know what the law is in Florida.. read Hornsby.

I am not of a mind to repost his whole website here.
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Again, YOU made the claim. Prove it and I will shut my mouth.
 
Zimmerman is innocent of the charges press against him. The forensic evidence supports His story. Most people believe he is guilty because of the irresponsible reporting by the media when this case for emerge.
 
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