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All drugs should be legalized for recreational use

Binary_Digit

Binary_Digit

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What would happen if we legalized all drugs? To answer that, why not look at what happens when we prohibit drugs?

Alcohol prohibition was such a monumental disaster that they passed a Constitutional Amendment to repeal a Constitutional Amendment. It only took 10 years to see the contrast. Most of us would've never heard of Al Capone if it weren't for prohibition. An average back-alley cutthroat was able to become one of the richest and most powerful criminals in American history, all thanks to the black market created by prohibition. And that's just one example. The lesson was clear: No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.

But for some reason we forgot that lesson and decided to prohibit all other drugs, as if somehow the results would be different. They haven't been. We just went from Al Capone to El Chapo (and Pablo Escobar).

So at the very least, legalization would remove all the negative effects caused by prohibition. That alone is a net positive.

Drug abuse and addiction are inherently medical problems, not criminal. Prohibition mischaracterizes the problem into something it's not. A properly-waged war on drugs would embrace treatment and prevention programs that are effective at combating the terrible nature of addiction and drug abuse. Instead, what we're waging today is more like a war on people. And we wonder why we aren't winning.

No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.
 
Binary_Digit said:
What would happen if we legalized all drugs? To answer that, why not look at what happens when we prohibit drugs?

Alcohol prohibition was such a monumental disaster that they passed a Constitutional Amendment to repeal a Constitutional Amendment. It only took 10 years to see the contrast. Most of us would've never heard of Al Capone if it weren't for prohibition. An average back-alley cutthroat was able to become one of the richest and most powerful criminals in American history, all thanks to the black market created by prohibition. And that's just one example. The lesson was clear: No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.

But for some reason we forgot that lesson and decided to prohibit all other drugs, as if somehow the results would be different. They haven't been. We just went from Al Capone to El Chapo (and Pablo Escobar).

So at the very least, legalization would remove all the negative effects caused by prohibition. That alone is a net positive.

Drug abuse and addiction are inherently medical problems, not criminal. Prohibition mischaracterizes the problem into something it's not. A properly-waged war on drugs would embrace treatment and prevention programs that are effective at combating the terrible nature of addiction and drug abuse. Instead, what we're waging today is more like a war on people. And we wonder why we aren't winning.

No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.
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First off you are starting from a strawman

Actually, Prohibition Was a Success - The New York Times

alcohol consumption declined dramatically during Prohibition. Cirrhosis death rates for men were 29.5 per 100,000 in 1911 and 10.7 in 1929. Admissions to state mental hospitals for alcoholic psychosis declined from 10.1 per 100,000 in 1919 to 4.7 in 1928.

Arrests for public drunkennness and disorderly conduct declined 50 percent between 1916 and 1922. For the population as a whole, the best estimates are that consumption of alcohol declined by 30 percent to 50 percent.

Third, violent crime did not increase dramatically during Prohibition. Homicide rates rose dramatically from 1900 to 1910 but remained roughly constant during Prohibition's 14 year rule. Organized crime may have become more visible and lurid during Prohibition, but it existed before and after.
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The (Not So) Roaring ?20s - The New York Times
 
Binary_Digit said:
What would happen if we legalized all drugs? To answer that, why not look at what happens when we prohibit drugs?

Alcohol prohibition was such a monumental disaster that they passed a Constitutional Amendment to repeal a Constitutional Amendment. It only took 10 years to see the contrast. Most of us would've never heard of Al Capone if it weren't for prohibition. An average back-alley cutthroat was able to become one of the richest and most powerful criminals in American history, all thanks to the black market created by prohibition. And that's just one example. The lesson was clear: No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.

But for some reason we forgot that lesson and decided to prohibit all other drugs, as if somehow the results would be different. They haven't been. We just went from Al Capone to El Chapo (and Pablo Escobar).

So at the very least, legalization would remove all the negative effects caused by prohibition. That alone is a net positive.

Drug abuse and addiction are inherently medical problems, not criminal. Prohibition mischaracterizes the problem into something it's not. A properly-waged war on drugs would embrace treatment and prevention programs that are effective at combating the terrible nature of addiction and drug abuse. Instead, what we're waging today is more like a war on people. And we wonder why we aren't winning.

No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.
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I used to sing this tune, but the problem is that just a little bit of cocaine can be used as a murder weapon.

What you want to call for is non-toxic mark-able tracers.

I don't see whatever would be non-toxic as you are snorting it up into your brain.

I'd be pretty pissed to see a lot of kids get mushrooms on Halloween and not know what was happening to them, but you could mark them with tracers too.

So when I test the punch and see the cocaine was last sold to you and you say it was stolen from your hotel room and you're not here with the Party of fifty people dead I would have something to investigate, how did the thief know there was cocaine for his murder plot, did the suspect fake the breached hotel room?
 
Democrats in Congress want to make drug laws harsher even with a doctor's prescription proposing that no doctor can write a prescription for pain killers lasting more than 7 days.
 
Exquisitor said:
I used to sing this tune, but the problem is that just a little bit of cocaine can be used as a murder weapon.

What you want to call for is non-toxic mark-able tracers.

I don't see whatever would be non-toxic as you are snorting it up into your brain.

I'd be pretty pissed to see a lot of kids get mushrooms on Halloween and not know what was happening to them, but you could mark them with tracers too.

So when I test the punch and see the cocaine was last sold to you and you say it was stolen from your hotel room and you're not here with the Party of fifty people dead I would have something to investigate, how did the thief know there was cocaine for his murder plot, did the suspect fake the breached hotel room?
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So rat poison and any other substance that takes a small amount to kill should be outlawed? Seems a rather harsh change in the rules.
 
Keridan said:
So rat poison and any other substance that takes a small amount to kill should be outlawed? Seems a rather harsh change in the rules.
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At a party or if I'm drinking and the first sip makes me feel too good,...

Someone would think about it, where as we wouldn't think about it with rat poison.

A person high on cocaine would think about it, but a person high on rat poison wouldn't because they would be dead.
 
Legalization of drugs is only sensible.

Under current laws, we spend twice as much punishing as we do treating addiction, which is an illness that is defined by less-controlled parts of the brain.

We have no control over whether or not drugs are made available to children. If it's all illegal and can't even be properly discussed, why not hit up the high school kids with parental money?

We spend billions letting more drugs into the country every year instead of making billions off taxes to help those who keep buying them and ruining their lives.

Pot is listed as schedule 1 while alcohol is totally legal. The "gateway" drug was made that way because people realized the government was lying about this harmless plant that made things entertaining. Were they lying about all those other illegal drugs?

There is no control over quality of product or mixers that might kill someone because it is better to make it without any body overseeing quality. Easier to kill folks with a crap product because it's all illegal and cheaper is better.

Most drug related crime comes from it being hard to get the drugs legally. There would be a dramatic reduction in robberies, murders, etc related to drugs if the drug store on the corner sold the healthiest version managable of the same product an addict is going to get either way at a reasonable cost.

The list actually gets longer, but I'm giving some of the highlights. Banning something completely that you can't keep people from doing is so much worse than regulating it.
 
Exquisitor said:
At a party or if I'm drinking and the first sip makes me feel too good,...

Someone would think about it, where as we wouldn't think about it with rat poison.

A person high on cocaine would think about it, but a person high on rat poison wouldn't because they would be dead.
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So .. I'm not sure I understand. Sorry if I'm missing something. You are saying that rat poison is far more fatal?
 
Binary_Digit said:
What would happen if we legalized all drugs? To answer that, why not look at what happens when we prohibit drugs?

Alcohol prohibition was such a monumental disaster that they passed a Constitutional Amendment to repeal a Constitutional Amendment. It only took 10 years to see the contrast. Most of us would've never heard of Al Capone if it weren't for prohibition. An average back-alley cutthroat was able to become one of the richest and most powerful criminals in American history, all thanks to the black market created by prohibition. And that's just one example. The lesson was clear: No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.

But for some reason we forgot that lesson and decided to prohibit all other drugs, as if somehow the results would be different. They haven't been. We just went from Al Capone to El Chapo (and Pablo Escobar).

So at the very least, legalization would remove all the negative effects caused by prohibition. That alone is a net positive.

Drug abuse and addiction are inherently medical problems, not criminal. Prohibition mischaracterizes the problem into something it's not. A properly-waged war on drugs would embrace treatment and prevention programs that are effective at combating the terrible nature of addiction and drug abuse. Instead, what we're waging today is more like a war on people. And we wonder why we aren't winning.

No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.
Click to expand...

The problem is the judgement of the person using them.

When I was a young man, my roommate got "experimental" with his girlfriend. The next thing I knew, he was screaming for my help. I did CPR until the ambulance got there to take over. It turned out he put cocaine either on his penis or in her vagina, I never got that answer. OD's such as this are a quick spike, much like an injection and you can turn the corner pretty quick.

He was arrested later, and not charged AFAIK. I kicked him out to keep from being evicted myself. She dropped out of college and move back with her parents in another city. I suspect she had some mental deficits due to oxygen starvation. I never saw either one of them again.
 
Keridan said:
Legalization of drugs is only sensible.

Under current laws, we spend twice as much punishing as we do treating addiction, which is an illness that is defined by less-controlled parts of the brain.

We have no control over whether or not drugs are made available to children. If it's all illegal and can't even be properly discussed, why not hit up the high school kids with parental money?

We spend billions letting more drugs into the country every year instead of making billions off taxes to help those who keep buying them and ruining their lives.

Pot is listed as schedule 1 while alcohol is totally legal. The "gateway" drug was made that way because people realized the government was lying about this harmless plant that made things entertaining. Were they lying about all those other illegal drugs?

There is no control over quality of product or mixers that might kill someone because it is better to make it without any body overseeing quality. Easier to kill folks with a crap product because it's all illegal and cheaper is better.

Most drug related crime comes from it being hard to get the drugs legally. There would be a dramatic reduction in robberies, murders, etc related to drugs if the drug store on the corner sold the healthiest version managable of the same product an addict is going to get either way at a reasonable cost.

The list actually gets longer, but I'm giving some of the highlights. Banning something completely that you can't keep people from doing is so much worse than regulating it.
Click to expand...

Sure dude, if you know me, if I leave my drink in attended, I'm going to find cocaine in it, this is why I always leave my drink unattended, don't get so hammered...
 
Exquisitor said:
Sure dude, if you know me, if I leave my drink in attended, I'm going to find cocaine in it, this is why I always leave my drink unattended, don't get so hammered...
Click to expand...

Enlighten me, how does this address the quoted response?
 
Keridan said:
So .. I'm not sure I understand. Sorry if I'm missing something. You are saying that rat poison is far more fatal?
Click to expand...

No, rat poison makes me say, hey, there's rat poison in this, not, oh, this is yummy, yummy, yummy.

Especially if I was drunk, how could I feel secure?
 
Exquisitor said:
No, rat poison makes me say, hey, there's rat poison in this, not, oh, this is yummy, yummy, yummy.

Especially if I was drunk, how could I feel secure?
Click to expand...

I think you have really the wrong idea about how coke addicts want to use their supply. I also am beginning to question what type of people you surround yourself with. Further, I'm not sure why you think folks are just holding back the opportunity to kill you with the incredibly bad coke that is terribly rare in a bar where you don't watch your drink only because we currently don't regulate drugs.

Don't feel bad. Misconceptions and fear mongering like this are why drugs are illegal instead of regulated already.
 
Keridan said:
I think you have really the wrong idea about how coke addicts want to use their supply. I also am beginning to question what type of people you surround yourself with. Further, I'm not sure why you think folks are just holding back the opportunity to kill you with the incredibly bad coke that is terribly rare in a bar where you don't watch your drink only because we currently don't regulate drugs.

Don't feel bad. Misconceptions and fear mongering like this are why drugs are illegal instead of regulated already.
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It wouldn't be incredibly bad coke, it'd be the best from some dude's shirt pocket.

Hey, I'm all for coke houses and dropout cities, they can go right next to the pyramids.

We put a premium on production and anyone can cultivate these substances on their sidewalk.

There'll be a central collection agency in Kansas and your substance will be graded, paid and ground into tar for building material and pyramids.
 
Keridan said:
Your way of telling me you are drunk? It's about as clear as the other responses, which means no reader can tell.
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Do I have to run for President?

I doubt no reader can tell, but I certainly write to appear straight.

Ever since Medical Marijuana, I've entered the promise land and I'm hammering it all day every day with my free oz; $15 renewal per month.

How ****ing many times I had to be out on the street to find Jesus Christ just so I could have the medicine I needed!
 
Exquisitor said:
Do I have to run for President?

I doubt no reader can tell, but I certainly write to appear straight.

Ever since Medical Marijuana, I've entered the promise land and I'm hammering it all day every day with my free oz; $15 renewal per month.

How ****ing many times I had to be out on the street to find Jesus Christ just so I could have the medicine I needed!
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, I require intelligent and considered posts to debate. Let me know when you have those to present.
 
Keridan said:
Unfortunately, I require intelligent and considered posts to debate. Let me know when you have those to present.
Click to expand...

When one takes to drugs and becomes unproductive and a burden on society, then the law becomes angry and retaliates.
 
Exquisitor said:
When one takes to drugs and becomes unproductive and a burden on society, then the law becomes angry and retaliates.
Click to expand...

I don't know that it gets as far as the law for just being unproductive. Set aside the many high-functioning drug addicts. The ones who don't produce don't get the benefits of society, just as with any group.

There is also a lot more room to help people become a benefit when you treat them vs. paying to try them, jail them, then take care of all their everyday needs.
 
Keridan said:
I don't know that it gets as far as the law for just being unproductive. Set aside the many high-functioning drug addicts. The ones who don't produce don't get the benefits of society, just as with any group.

There is also a lot more room to help people become a benefit when you treat them vs. paying to try them, jail them, then take care of all their everyday needs.
Click to expand...

Coke houses, any time I want to go I can go there and get my disability?

Dropout cities? Right next to the pyramids. Just supply food and water, can't deal with it, can't hack, just start doing coke and see how far you get and end up there.

I don't know about just being unproductive, but you're right, jailing isn't smart, but if anybody poisons me, you're dead.
 
Binary_Digit said:
What would happen if we legalized all drugs? To answer that, why not look at what happens when we prohibit drugs?

Alcohol prohibition was such a monumental disaster that they passed a Constitutional Amendment to repeal a Constitutional Amendment. It only took 10 years to see the contrast. Most of us would've never heard of Al Capone if it weren't for prohibition. An average back-alley cutthroat was able to become one of the richest and most powerful criminals in American history, all thanks to the black market created by prohibition. And that's just one example. The lesson was clear: No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.

But for some reason we forgot that lesson and decided to prohibit all other drugs, as if somehow the results would be different. They haven't been. We just went from Al Capone to El Chapo (and Pablo Escobar).

So at the very least, legalization would remove all the negative effects caused by prohibition. That alone is a net positive.

Drug abuse and addiction are inherently medical problems, not criminal. Prohibition mischaracterizes the problem into something it's not. A properly-waged war on drugs would embrace treatment and prevention programs that are effective at combating the terrible nature of addiction and drug abuse. Instead, what we're waging today is more like a war on people. And we wonder why we aren't winning.

No matter how dangerous a drug is, when you make it illegal you make it more dangerous, not less.
Click to expand...

Good post.

Actually, the Harrison Narcotic Act which created the first drug prohibition preceded the Volstead Act. The difference was that few people used the opiates and cocaine prohibited by the Harrison Act, but alcohol is a social lubricant, for better or for worse, and many people use that drug.

So when the country realized the error of the Volstead Act, many were onboard to correct the mistake. Not so with the other drugs.
 
Exquisitor said:
Coke houses, any time I want to go I can go there and get my disability?

Dropout cities? Right next to the pyramids. Just supply food and water, can't deal with it, can't hack, just start doing coke and see how far you get and end up there.

I don't know about just being unproductive, but you're right, jailing isn't smart, but if anybody poisons me, you're dead.
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I swear this is not meant to be a rude question. I'm honestly wondering. Is English a first language for you?
 
Keridan said:
I swear this is not meant to be a rude question. I'm honestly wondering. Is English a first language for you?
Click to expand...

Yes, but it obviously is not for you.
 
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