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Thread: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by RetiredUSN View Post
    Come onto my job site smelling of booze or pot and you won't have to look at my ugly mug ever again, because you will never step foot on my job again. Pot heads and boozers who can't wait for knock off to get high are dangerous to themselves and everyone else around them.

    Sitting a home watching TV, sitting out back, or smoking at some party........... is a entirely different scenario altogether.
    I'm glad that you recognize the difference. As an employer you can make any arbitrary policy decision you want. Legally speaking, if someone hurts or endangers someone else they should be prosecuted regardless if they're on a substance or not. Having the government lump both peaceful and non-peaceful users of tobacco, alcohol, big macs, cannabis, or any other 1,000 substances is irrational and totally incompatible with basic personal liberty.

    It's time we stand up to hypocritical fascists that think like Crovax and put personal responsibility and freedom in the forefront. These people hate freedom and can't stand the thought of not having the government manage their daily lives.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by RabidAlpaca View Post
    I'm glad that you recognize the difference. As an employer you can make any arbitrary policy decision you want. Legally speaking, if someone hurts or endangers someone else they should be prosecuted regardless if they're on a substance or not. Having the government lump both peaceful and non-peaceful users of tobacco, alcohol, big macs, cannabis, or any other 1,000 substances is irrational and totally incompatible with basic personal liberty. It's time we stand up to hypocritical fascists that think like Crovax and put personal responsibility and freedom in the forefront.
    I smoked right up until my 4th year in the Navy, and I stopped the day my daughter was born in 1981.

    Quick story......
    My son smokes and always thinks he can hide it from me....(like I care) He let me borrow his fishing Kayak a couple weeks ago for a few hours and dropped it off at my house on his way home after he was on the water all morning with his buddies. He forgot that he left his tupperware in the bait pod. I texted him while I was on the water and said that I cleared out all those nasty weeds in his bait holder and he should take better care of his boat. No texts returned.......

    I have always supported recreational and medical use for pot.
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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by ProgRockFan1978 View Post
    I debated this until I was blue in the face for 35 years. I got sick of saying it was a much safer drug than booze, cigarettes and almost all illegal drugs or the hypocrisy of the whole anti marijuana crusade and the fanaticism that drove them. Now the Mass house is trying to defy voters and screw with the law big time. They are trying to raise the tax to 28% from the voter approved bill. Will the crusaders never quit even after the fight is lost.

    People need to stop trying to make it hard on pot smokers. It is stupid to raise taxes to the point the legal market can't compete with the black market. It is stupid for employers to deny jobs to pot smokers where there is no proof they make more mistakes or get hurt more. Give me a break anti pot moral crusaders. The fight is over and you will learn what we pot smokers have known for years. Marijuana is fun and popular. People will not put up with steps backward on this new right we have fought for.
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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    They would have never legalized it if it wasn't for the chance to tax it at high rates.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    The problem isn't the tax rate, it's the fact that producers think they can sell it at prohibition prices. Pot is one of the easiest things to grow (so I'm told...ahem), there is absolutely no justification in a legal market for the prices to be anything even approaching what the black market charged. It's harder to grow celery, which you get for under a buck a POUND... $10-$20 a GRAM for pot is absolutely insane in a legal market.

    One of the most frequently given reasons for governments to legalize pot is to eliminate the black markets. Prohibition is an undisputable failure, so the goal is to regulate and control, to ensure kids don't get their hands on it, and that criminals don't profit from the black market, and introduce all the things that go along with a black market into society. If government doesn't provide price guidelines to business to ensure that it is no longer profitable for the black market to exist, it's defeated before it's begun. As we move towards national legalization next year here in Canada, this is one of my constant gripes.

    It will be just like cigarettes - 25 cigarettes is nearly $15 at the local convenience store, so the Native reservations sell them at $15 a carton, and what do you think you find outside of schools? Almost all the cigarette butts come from the reservations (not sure if it's the same in the states, but they have their own brands up here). (Can cite, if anyone cares to dispute, just too lazy to find the link right now)

    Governments need to look at this not just from the tax revenue side, but also the savings side - primarily in law enforcement and prisons. Combined with the tax they would make even at more reasonable prices they would be much much MUCH further ahead than current state.
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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by OlNate View Post
    The problem isn't the tax rate, it's the fact that producers think they can sell it at prohibition prices. Pot is one of the easiest things to grow (so I'm told...ahem), there is absolutely no justification in a legal market for the prices to be anything even approaching what the black market charged. It's harder to grow celery, which you get for under a buck a POUND... $10-$20 a GRAM for pot is absolutely insane in a legal market.
    You're absolutely right about this, there's nothing technical that makes growing and harvesting cannabis expensive, it can be every bit as cheap as coffee or tobacco and most people that do smoke it would smoke the equivalent mass of a few cigarettes a month. I can't wait for the day we're able to buy shrink-wrapped bricks of cannabis like we can coffee.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    First lets start with your assertion the marijuana is less harmful alcohol, this is debatable but irrelevant. Alcohol is a harmful substance that is a major factor in 45% of crimes and you want to unleash marijuana on the population because it slightly less harmful?
    "Slightly less" is the biggest lie I've heard in a while.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    Not sure if you know absolutely nothing about marijuana or you thought you could lie and not get caught
    You're one to talk.

    Marijuana is by far the safest recreational drug known to man. Alcohol is far far worse.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    As for Mass "defying" the voters, the country and the state of Mass are Representative democracy and not a direct democracy for a reason. The will of the voters only extends as far as the representatives the choose. So if the representatives see the need to alter a bill thats exactly how the system is supposed to work.
    According to the state Constitution:

    Legislative power shall continue to be vested in the general court; but the people reserve to themselves the popular initiative, which is the power of a specified number of voters to submit constitutional amendments and laws to the people for approval or rejection; and the popular referendum, which is the power of a specified number of voters to submit laws, enacted by the general court, to the people for their ratification or rejection.
    If the law as passed by the people turns out to be deficient in some ways after implementation I'm all for the legislature stepping in to make changes at that point. But they had their chance to legislate on this issue, they demurred, and so the voters did it for them.

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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Person View Post
    "Slightly less" is the biggest lie I've heard in a while.



    You're one to talk.

    Marijuana is by far the safest recreational drug known to man. Alcohol is far far worse.
    hehe...well, in terms of safest recreational drug known to man, it's actually magic mushrooms - it's the fastest drug to leave your system, it leaves nothing behind, and you can't die from any part of it (even too much pot smoked rather than vaporized has similar risks to cigarettes) - but who the hell has time for that past the good ol' college days... hehe

    Maybe in retirement........
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    Re: Mass. wants to defy voters on legal pot.

    Quote Originally Posted by ProgRockFan1978 View Post
    I debated this until I was blue in the face for 35 years. I got sick of saying it was a much safer drug than booze, cigarettes and almost all illegal drugs or the hypocrisy of the whole anti marijuana crusade and the fanaticism that drove them. Now the Mass house is trying to defy voters and screw with the law big time. They are trying to raise the tax to 28% from the voter approved bill. Will the crusaders never quit even after the fight is lost.

    People need to stop trying to make it hard on pot smokers. It is stupid to raise taxes to the point the legal market can't compete with the black market. It is stupid for employers to deny jobs to pot smokers where there is no proof they make more mistakes or get hurt more. Give me a break anti pot moral crusaders. The fight is over and you will learn what we pot smokers have known for years. Marijuana is fun and popular. People will not put up with steps backward on this new right we have fought for.
    I certainly agree pot is less harmful than alcohol or cigs. But, as a former pot smoker, I would never say it is harmless. At the very least, it has addictive properties---doubt me? Just quit for 90 days, and report back how that went--and, it certainly affects many people in negative ways: clouds judgement, distorts reality, lowers ambition, affects reaction time and, most definitely, induces people to act and sound stupid. There's a reason everyone makes fun of "stoners."

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