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Partisan Politics

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fatuous1

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Moderate
This is what partisan politicians and the mainstream media has done to U.S.

https://www.facebook.com/NRATV/videos/10154827762392898/

This is what happens when partisan politicians and mainstream media personalities scandalize, demonize and dehumanize one another, as well as, the rest of U.S.!

In 2017, we are a nation that is warring against ourselves, and warring against our own best interests, not because when hate one another, but rather because that is what we have been misled to do! We need to stop listening to all the Wing-Nuts, on both sides of the isle, and start working together on Making U.S. Great Again!

"Americans come in all shapes, sizes and colors, and that's what makes U.S. great" (TRAINAISM)

fatuous1
 
fatuous1 said:
This is what partisan politicians and the mainstream media has done to U.S.

https://www.facebook.com/NRATV/videos/10154827762392898/

This is what happens when partisan politicians and mainstream media personalities scandalize, demonize and dehumanize one another, as well as, the rest of U.S.!

In 2017, we are a nation that is warring against ourselves, and warring against our own best interests, not because when hate one another, but rather because that is what we have been misled to do! We need to stop listening to all the Wing-Nuts, on both sides of the isle, and start working together on Making U.S. Great Again!

"Americans come in all shapes, sizes and colors, and that's what makes U.S. great" (TRAINAISM)

fatuous1
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Partisan politics makes people think sharing facebook videos is somehow worthwhile?
 
Redress said:
Partisan politics makes people think sharing facebook videos is somehow worthwhile?
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In 2017, over 90% of the Americans under the age of 25, use the Social Media Sites on their Smart Phones, and Laptops, as their primary news source: FACEBOOK, TWITTER, MYSPACE, LINKEDIN, etc ...

fatuous1
 
fatuous1 said:
In 2017, over 90% of the Americans under the age of 25, use the Social Media Sites on their Smart Phones, and Laptops, as their primary news source: FACEBOOK, TWITTER, MYSPACE, LINKEDIN, etc ...

fatuous1
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You say that like it is a good thing...
 
Redress said:
You say that like it is a good thing...
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Americans seem to get bored really quick and that is exactly why FACEBOOK and TWITTER has become so addictive!

Americans want their news to "ROLL ON", and quickly move from topic to topic!

Americans no longer want to sit around a flat screen listening to a bunch of, "TALKING HEADS", whose analysis and opinions, don't amount to $HY^!

"GIVE U.S. DA NEWS and GIVE IT TO U.S. FAST and FURIOUS"

fatuous1
 
fatuous1 said:
In 2017, over 90% of the Americans under the age of 25, use the Social Media Sites on their Smart Phones, and Laptops, as their primary news source: FACEBOOK, TWITTER, MYSPACE, LINKEDIN, etc ...

fatuous1
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Myspace? I didn't realize this was 2006.
 
fatuous1 said:
"MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN"

https://www.facebook.com/DonaldTrump/videos/10159456594890725/
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Not to be too confrontational, but you sure don't sound like a moderate, you seem very focused on things moderates are not that focused on and this love song to "the Donald making America great again" surely is non-moderate in nature.

And meeting Putin and coming back with a "let's join together with the ones who hacked our election and make it better" is anything but making America great again, it is making America vulnerable by allowing Russians government officials (and their hackers) access to US systems they before had to hack for and now "The Donnie" wants to make them get there legally? No way, that is just plain stupid.
 
Peter King said:
And meeting Putin and coming back with a "let's join together with the ones who hacked our election and make it better" is anything but making America great again, it is making America vulnerable by allowing Russians government officials (and their hackers) access to US systems they before had to hack for and now "The Donnie" wants to make them get there legally? No way, that is just plain stupid.
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Trump is right. Better security is the answer. We cannot even begin stop all the hacking going on world wide.
The exact apposite of what you claim is what Trump wants. He clearly tweeted that better security is the answer. That is what I read.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
Trump is right. Better security is the answer. We cannot even begin stop all the hacking going on world wide.
The exact apposite of what you claim is what Trump wants. He clearly tweeted that better security is the answer. That is what I read.
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I disagree, what Trump should do is work with his allies, not the enemies of the US.
 
Peter King said:
I disagree, what Trump should do is work with his allies, not the enemies of the US.
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Our increasing our security against being hacked is not working with the enemy but protecting us from our enemies. What are you talking about?
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
Our increasing our security against being hacked is not working with the enemy but protecting us from our enemies. What are you talking about?
Click to expand...

The enemy in the scenario presented by PK is Russia. You have to admit it's curious that the victim of the cyber attack (U.S, Trump) wants to work with the attacker to improve security (Russia, Vlad).
 
fatuous1 said:
In 2017, over 90% of the Americans under the age of 25, use the Social Media Sites on their Smart Phones, and Laptops, as their primary news source: FACEBOOK, TWITTER, MYSPACE, LINKEDIN, etc ...

fatuous1
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Social networks are not, where citizens should get their political information from.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
Our increasing our security against being hacked is not working with the enemy but protecting us from our enemies. What are you talking about?
Click to expand...

Working with the Russians is working with the enemy. And that will not lead to increased security but more insecurity.
 
Peter King said:
I disagree, what Trump should do is work with his allies, not the enemies of the US.
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The problem has been that, while the USA has taken exactly that approach over 7 decades and so enabling their allies and others ti grow rich, practically none of those "allies" reciprocated. They never paid for the international public goods the Americans were supplying and paying for. This gave them an increasing competitive advantage. As complicated as the mechanics might be the facts are quite simple. Presidents have been pointing to this imbalance for quite some time and asked for redress, as the situation became increasingly untenable. But nobody really wanted to correct their ways. As little as I like trump, he is quite right in some of these points.
 
joG said:
The problem has been that, while the USA has taken exactly that approach over 7 decades and so enabling their allies and others ti grow rich, practically none of those "allies" reciprocated. They never paid for the international public goods the Americans were supplying and paying for. This gave them an increasing competitive advantage. As complicated as the mechanics might be the facts are quite simple. Presidents have been pointing to this imbalance for quite some time and asked for redress, as the situation became increasingly untenable. But nobody really wanted to correct their ways. As little as I like trump, he is quite right in some of these points.
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And what was that aid given? The 2nd world war?

And the facts are never as simple as people suggest. Because the US hugely profited from the aid (just like most aid the US gives, it often has to be paid to US companies and US products). Not only financially but it also halted the spread of communism and gave the US an unrivaled access to the European markets (because the US wanted free trade).

And it is not like we do not invest in the US. The Netherlands has been a big investor in the US for years, as have several other EU countries.
 
Peter King said:
Working with the Russians is working with the enemy. And that will not lead to increased security but more insecurity.
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You are quite right that Russia is the enemy. In the other hand the eu and a number of members have been increasing the cost of US Internet security and have used certain aspects for domestic politicing, which disquieted or angered populations and solidified emnity in largish parts of the electorates. This is helping to shift the EU from a free rider and partially loose cannon to a much less helpful area. It just isn't enough to continuously profess to be friends. You have to walk the walk and the wealthy countries of Europe just haven't acted like allies.
 
Peter King said:
And what was that aid given? The 2nd world war?

And the facts are never as simple as people suggest. Because the US hugely profited from the aid (just like most aid the US gives, it often has to be paid to US companies and US products). Not only financially but it also halted the spread of communism and gave the US an unrivaled access to the European markets (because the US wanted free trade).

And it is not like we do not invest in the US. The Netherlands has been a big investor in the US for years, as have several other EU countries.
Click to expand...

One of the things I learned, when I studied economic development and did research on certain aspects of it, was that with very few exceptions it does not help development. The old homily that teaching a fisherman how to fish is good is false and usually only really helps the donor by lending him an alibi and a means of corrupting local elites. To really help the econonomies, you have to buy the fish.

That is exactly, what the US did and what brought ca two billions of starving poor or war destroyed societies into Wirrschaftswunder. That has been the mist successful development program and leap forward for the human species we have seen in absolute numbers. In relative numbers it rivals humanity's shift to agriculture and the industrial revolution.

This is exactly the opposite if European trade surpluses.
 
joG said:
You are quite right that Russia is the enemy. In the other hand the eu and a number of members have been increasing the cost of US Internet security and have used certain aspects for domestic politicing, which disquieted or angered populations and solidified emnity in largish parts of the electorates. This is helping to shift the EU from a free rider and partially loose cannon to a much less helpful area. It just isn't enough to continuously profess to be friends. You have to walk the walk and the wealthy countries of Europe just haven't acted like allies.
Click to expand...

It should come as no surprise that I do not fully agree with that, or should I say mostly disagree with that.

But it is true that we do not put the same level of money as the US does for the military, but that comes mostly because we think the US is the one out of the normal spending pattern and not us. Sure it would not hurt that we invest a bit more, but under no circumstance will we be going into the US levels of military spending.

And how have we been "increasing the cost of US internet security"?
 
Cisero said:
What would you recommend ?
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Balanced consumption of media from different countries and of differing political leaning.
 
joG said:
One of the things I learned, when I studied economic development and did research on certain aspects of it, was that with very few exceptions it does not help development. The old homily that teaching a fisherman how to fish is good is false and usually only really helps the donor by lending him an alibi and a means of corrupting local elites. To really help the econonomies, you have to buy the fish.

That is exactly, what the US did and what brought ca two billions of starving poor or war destroyed societies into Wirrschaftswunder. That has been the mist successful development program and leap forward for the human species we have seen in absolute numbers. In relative numbers it rivals humanity's shift to agriculture and the industrial revolution.

This is exactly the opposite if European trade surpluses.
Click to expand...

But the EU cannot help that the US has gone from a producing country to a consuming country first and foremost? Because that is what happened. US companies outsourced work to mostly cheap labor countries and the overly heated consuming pattern of the US public has lead to a trade deficit. It is not something EU countries have done but what is there to be bought by the EU countries except services from the US?

It is not like the car industry will export masses of cars to Europe? In the past Chrysler exported cars to Europe from the US. But when the PT cruiser came out we received those cars from Mexico and that only was one or two shipments. After that Chrysler had relocated the European production to Austria which lead to better cars (because the quality of the Mexican cars was not up to par to the Austrian produced cars). They also produced Jeeps there. The only thing we still got from the US where the Jeep Wrangler, the Neon and the 300M, all not that popular in the Netherlands.

The US does great in the SUV and truck market, but in Europe there is not that much of a market for those cars.

And I saw how the US aid was spent in Haiti after the earthquake, that mostly did not help the people it was supposed to help. Money from that was spent building sport stadiums, police stations, cultural centers and for one reason it was used to built a commercial project in a region where there was no real damage from the earthquake and there was hardly any activity. In fact 260 million of USaid went to that project in Caracol even though it had been planned prior to the earthquake even happening.

One of those wastes was the US embassy authorizing 70 million dollar to build townhouses with pools for US embassy staff. With functional electric power and clean drinking water while most of Haiti still has no clean water or power. This lack of clean water or sewage systems caused a huge cholera oubreak.

And don't get me wrong, a lot of money went to the right places, but loads of money got wasted. Like millions went to a US for profit company hired to create an education program for the locals but none of their staff know French, wasting 12 million dollars, etc. etc. etc. etc.

Buying the fish is not always helpful.
 
Peter King said:
But the EU cannot help that the US has gone from a producing country to a consuming country first and foremost? Because that is what happened. US companies outsourced work to mostly cheap labor countries and the overly heated consuming pattern of the US public has lead to a trade deficit. It is not something EU countries have done but what is there to be bought by the EU countries except services from the US?

It is not like the car industry will export masses of cars to Europe? In the past Chrysler exported cars to Europe from the US. But when the PT cruiser came out we received those cars from Mexico and that only was one or two shipments. After that Chrysler had relocated the European production to Austria which lead to better cars (because the quality of the Mexican cars was not up to par to the Austrian produced cars). They also produced Jeeps there. The only thing we still got from the US where the Jeep Wrangler, the Neon and the 300M, all not that popular in the Netherlands.

The US does great in the SUV and truck market, but in Europe there is not that much of a market for those cars.

And I saw how the US aid was spent in Haiti after the earthquake, that mostly did not help the people it was supposed to help. Money from that was spent building sport stadiums, police stations, cultural centers and for one reason it was used to built a commercial project in a region where there was no real damage from the earthquake and there was hardly any activity. In fact 260 million of USaid went to that project in Caracol even though it had been planned prior to the earthquake even happening.

One of those wastes was the US embassy authorizing 70 million dollar to build townhouses with pools for US embassy staff. With functional electric power and clean drinking water while most of Haiti still has no clean water or power. This lack of clean water or sewage systems caused a huge cholera oubreak.

And don't get me wrong, a lot of money went to the right places, but loads of money got wasted. Like millions went to a US for profit company hired to create an education program for the locals but none of their staff know French, wasting 12 million dollars, etc. etc. etc. etc.

Buying the fish is not always helpful.
Click to expand...

As I believe I pointed out, the details are multiple, complex and not easily argued outside of formal models. But the facts are simple. If you allow your people to buy, what others produce, then the others develop. The US stepped up to the plate, when it was unspeakably wealthy and the Europeans thrived. In the 1970s the Europeans should have started doing the same, but instead could not develop into developed economies and preferred to continue the leeching on the American "development program" that had bootstrapped them out of poverty. This was extremely expensive for the US, but much worse for the developed countries as it siphoned off buying power.
 
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