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Minneapolis

There's a lot of intra-group dynamics at play where protesters don't trust the motivations of each other or trust that the destruction to property was done by faithful representatives of the protest. Others feel, rightly or wrongly who the hell knows, that some of the more well-known fires were started by undercover white police officers.

Some folks I follow report that a small cluster of people have, say, a couple of black women who are leading a peaceful protest in one area, but a white man is trying to rile up that same peaceful crowd to become more violent.

Others are going to say that the destruction is the city reaping what it sowed for having its institutions so blatantly disregard the sanctity of minority lives.

Yeah, it's a mess. I'm not on the side of property destruction, but I also take to hear the observations of Martin Luther King Jr. and I don't think we should weigh the property destruction against the blatant murder of a citizen by police.

At the end of the day, the MPD needs to be reformed from top to bottom and the government has to earn the respect of its community again.

The worst tends to be that people come into these cities that are on the cusp of violence, and stir **** up. Amazingly, people do not like their neighborhoods getting trashed, and they will still be blamed for it...
 
You don't seem to understand the concept of social justice. Under a social justice system judgement is assessed based on the immediately available evidence and punishment is to be meted out based on public sentiment. Could that lead to poor decisions being made? Sure, but that isn't important because what IS important is that feelings of the people (the people who have a legitimate right to feelings, not Trump supporters) are appropriately addressed.

You seem to be quite fond of distorting what people say in order to justify your botched narratives.
That's a well known debate fail, but what do you care, because what IS important is that the feelings of Lutherf and his intentionally distorted argument be validated so he can feel like he won an argument, an argument nobody is making.

Congratulations on your expert skills at projection. Too bad it's a skill that isn't worth anything.
 
Tell me you want a Freddy Grey outcome. That's exactly what you and this childish foot stomping is going to deliver.
You want a perp walk. We all do. But it will take time because when the system works the way it's supposed to-not the way it worked for the black man who died under the knee of a cop- it takes the time it takes to go by the book and leave no room for error.

They've got ONE chance to do this.


The police department thought there was enough evidence to terminate four officers. This is not half these things have progressed in the past. Administrative leave with pay is the norm. I don’t have all the fact, but the transparency is opaque, at best. There is too much history involving these incidents.......
 
There's a lot of intra-group dynamics at play where protesters don't trust the motivations of each other or trust that the destruction to property was done by faithful representatives of the protest. Others feel, rightly or wrongly who the hell knows, that some of the more well-known fires were started by undercover white police officers.

Some folks I follow report that a small cluster of people have, say, a couple of black women who are leading a peaceful protest in one area, but a white man is trying to rile up that same peaceful crowd to become more violent.

Others are going to say that the destruction is the city reaping what it sowed for having its institutions so blatantly disregard the sanctity of minority lives.

Yeah, it's a mess. I'm not on the side of property destruction, but I also take to hear the observations of Martin Luther King Jr. and I don't think we should weigh the property destruction against the blatant murder of a citizen by police.

At the end of the day, the MPD needs to be reformed from top to bottom and the government has to earn the respect of its community again.

That’s a tall order.......imo.
 
They better be observing social distancing while looting.
 
You must be a good deal older than I am because I don't remember Rondo being exactly "seedy", just tore up, and trying to deal with the aftermath of the highway project. I had some good friends in Rondo Land!

Weird thing is, when I first moved in with Diane (an old flame!) we rented a "house in the city/in the country".
We called it that because the VERY FIRST LEG of the proposed I-55 AND light rail line that eventually got built on Hiawatha in Mpls tore down every single house on that street except the one we were renting.
So we were smack dab in the middle of Minneapolis but if you stepped outside, there was a vast stretch of NOTHING, as if we were out in the countryside!

That house is also gone now too of course, but for seven or eight months we had the entire seven block area to ourselves.
We could **** as loud as we wanted, we could ride minibikes all over the place, we could have huge block parties without bothering anyone, it was our little patch of rural bliss, with the entire city just a few blocks away. :lamo

I remember going to some of the old bars in Rondo.
I wonder if the city ever did finally build the "land bridges" they proposed to rejoin the old community together again.

Land bridges won't bring back the past but it might help heal the area somewhat.

I dont know if I am older, but I lived on those streets for many tears; all the strip clubs, bars, pool halls....I cant recall too many nights when the cops were not called nearby.
The old porn move palace called the "Faust" eventually burned, the Belmont strip club was finally raided for the last time and it became a police sub station...Crazy Louies is still in business, and yes, they did build the pedestrian bridges to link the neighborhoods....but not much more and, it may not register in your memory, but Tiger Jacks little shop was eventually moved off Dale street for a while and placed into the Minnesota Museum of history as being culturally significant.

Many changes....some good, some not so much.
 
I will never get it, I understand Protesting, carrying Signs, chanting ones indignation. What I don't get is how does looting stores and attacking people make a point, heck some if those business are locally oen and these days struggling to survive, do they want to lose businesses in their neighborhood? Any have an explanation. Oh, before anyone goes there, I saw black, white, and brown people doing it so leave that excuse at the door.
 
There's a lot of intra-group dynamics at play where protesters don't trust the motivations of each other or trust that the destruction to property was done by faithful representatives of the protest. Others feel, rightly or wrongly who the hell knows, that some of the more well-known fires were started by undercover white police officers.

Some folks I follow report that a small cluster of people have, say, a couple of black women who are leading a peaceful protest in one area, but a white man is trying to rile up that same peaceful crowd to become more violent.

Others are going to say that the destruction is the city reaping what it sowed for having its institutions so blatantly disregard the sanctity of minority lives.

Yeah, it's a mess. I'm not on the side of property destruction, but I also take to hear the observations of Martin Luther King Jr. and I don't think we should weigh the property destruction against the blatant murder of a citizen by police.

At the end of the day, the MPD needs to be reformed from top to bottom and the government has to earn the respect of its community again.

Policing in Minneapolis was a lot different back in the Seventies.
The Twin Cities had endured a reputation as a major gangster hideout just thirty or forty years prior.

WabashaStreetCaves.jpg

I even had a temp gig playing the piano at The Castle Royal (aka Wabasha Street Caves) nightclub for a little while, my very own Billy Joel fantasy.

If you mouthed off or fought with the cops back then, you were going to catch a beating, maybe even a helluva beating, but if you weren't armed, you knew you would survive. They just wanted to send you a little message that they weren't about to put up with your crap, that's all.
Both me and a good friend had both caught a couple of those Third Precinct cop beatings back then, he's black and I am white, although in the heart of Scandanavian blue eyed blondes I was quite the swarthy looking "import" compared to my peers up there.

But yeah, both of us got knocked around but since neither of us were in the habit of pulling a weapon on a cop, we knew we might get a black eye, or a busted nose, or a knot on the head, but we knew we would heal up and see another day. We both knew that once cuffed, most of the Hell was over and you just had to take your lumps, go to the pokey, see the judge, deal with what you got charged with, and then you moved on.

But we knew we would not be killed.
Looks like policing is a lot more deadly these days up there, and elsewhere.
I can understand the fact that armed criminals deserve whatever they get, but once the 5-0 puts the cuffs on you, isn't that the sign that the suspect is IN CUSTODY and is now rendered subdued?

We saw guys get cuffed and even HOG tied back in the old days, and even shoved into the back of the car hard enough they had a headache the next day. But that's the point...back then it was safe to assume there would BE a next day if you were put in the cuffs.
An unarmed suspect in cuffs can only do so much and a competently trained cop is supposed to know how to handle an unarmed guy in cuffs.
Yes, there ARE exceptions to the rule, I realize that.

But the common expectation back then was if you made a scene while you were in cuffs it just meant you were going to be sitting there in cuffs making a scene until you wore yourself out or until backup was called to take you in. If you DIDN'T make a scene, and the cops felt sorry for you, it was going to be three hots and a cot till you saw the judge.
 
I will never get it, I understand Protesting, carrying Signs, chanting ones indignation. What I don't get is how does looting stores and attacking people make a point, heck some if those business are locally oen and these days struggling to survive, do they want to lose businesses in their neighborhood? Any have an explanation. Oh, before anyone goes there, I saw black, white, and brown people doing it so leave that excuse at the door.

It is kinda an American tradition. The Boston massacre, the Boston Tea Party, and a bunch of others where riots. They continued right on through our history.
 
It is kinda an American tradition. The Boston massacre, the Boston Tea Party, and a bunch of others where riots. They continued right on through our history.

The Sons of Liberty were rioters who behaved far more violently than these folks. I'm saying this as a descendant of a fairly high-ranking member of that unfortunate group.
 
It is kinda an American tradition. The Boston massacre, the Boston Tea Party, and a bunch of others where riots. They continued right on through our history.

You may be on to something there. Tradition!
 
You seem to be quite fond of distorting what people say in order to justify your botched narratives.
That's a well known debate fail, but what do you care, because what IS important is that the feelings of Lutherf and his intentionally distorted argument be validated so he can feel like he won an argument, an argument nobody is making.

Congratulations on your expert skills at projection. Too bad it's a skill that isn't worth anything.

What we're seeing in St Paul right now is "social justice". Demands that people be arrested based on a video posted to Youtube or Facebook is "social justice". Three year investigations into a duly elected president merely because he's a political outsider is "social justice". Rights to privacy, personal security and personal property are all ignored in the interest of "social justice" and, yes, "social justice" is based on emotions rather than reason.
 
The police department thought there was enough evidence to terminate four officers. This is not half these things have progressed in the past. Administrative leave with pay is the norm. I don’t have all the fact, but the transparency is opaque, at best. There is too much history involving these incidents.......
We’re not there yet with the Riot Era of 1965 on, as you and I witnessed. We’re getting there though, with each new day of dysfunction.

There’s no way that ‘cop’ should have been on the streets with his prior record of being disciplined. Good thing we didn’t have the internet for MLK.

It’s not even summer. Novel viruses don’t just go away because some want to open. Perilous years continue to lie ahead. More people will be snapping than ever.
 
I dont know if I am older, but I lived on those streets for many tears; all the strip clubs, bars, pool halls....I cant recall too many nights when the cops were not called nearby.

I lived across the street from The Poodle Club in Minneapolis on East Lake Street for a while and the cops were there every single night but that's because The Poodle was the rowdiest place in town...and home to a bouncer named Rick who was either 6'10 or a full seven feet tall, and famous for wearing a soccer referee outfit, and even more famous for his brand of bouncer justice delivered to recalcitrant clientele.

Since I've never been an especially hard drinker - - maybe two or three beers a night at the most, I never had a problem with big Rick.
And despite the seedy rep of The Poodle, it was still a pretty decent neighborhood, just a little rowdy sometimes.

Hey, I'll never forget the one winter I went up to Duluth the first time and watched two old drunks trying to fight each other while slipping and falling on the ice on the sidewalks. Neither of them could get in a good punch but not for lack of trying, funny as Hell.
 
It is, which is why that press conference is getting trashed.

There was absolutely no new information in the presser, lot of delaying and promises that justice will be served, all been heard before.....
 
There was absolutely no new information in the presser, lot of delaying and promises that justice will be served, all been heard before.....

Putting in information about how there is evidence that does not support charges was beyond the pale. When it's there for everyone to see--that's the greatest of insults.
 
Putting in information about how there is evidence that does not support charges was beyond the pale. When it's there for everyone to see--that's the greatest of insults.

I was really surprised when they said that. I cant imagine what that evidence might be.
 
The police department thought there was enough evidence to terminate four officers. This is not half these things have progressed in the past. Administrative leave with pay is the norm. I don’t have all the fact, but the transparency is opaque, at best. There is too much history involving these incidents.......

I'd like to know if the Republicans here on DP thought there was justice done in the Philando Castile shooting.
I am surprised Minneapolis didn't burn in the aftermath of that, because Mr. Castile followed EVERY SINGLE RECOMMENDATION given BY cops TO legally armed persons during his traffic stop.

He kept his hands visible, he produced his ID, insurance, registration AND his CCW permit, and then calmly informed the cop as to the location of his legal firearm.

  1. "Philando Castile was not resisting or fleeing."
  2. "There was absolutely no criminal intent exhibited by him throughout this encounter."
  3. "He was respectful and compliant based upon the instructions and orders he was given."
  4. "He volunteered in good faith that he had a firearm – beyond what the law requires."
  5. "He emphatically stated that he wasn't pulling it out."
  6. "His movement was restricted by his own seat belt."
  7. "He was accompanied, in his vehicle, by a woman and a young child."
  8. "Philando Castile did not exhibit any intent, nor did he have any reason, to shoot Officer Yanez."
  9. "In fact, his dying words were in protest that he wasn't reaching for his gun."
 
The worst tends to be that people come into these cities that are on the cusp of violence, and stir **** up. Amazingly, people do not like their neighborhoods getting trashed, and they will still be blamed for it...

I watched (AND FILMED) white kids in BMW's (among others) looting stores during the 1992 L.A. Riots.
Diversity in Hell, just as in other times and places.
I also watched and filmed hispanic kids, too.
I also watched and filmed Korean business owners atop the roofs of their establishments, smoking cigarettes and holding shotguns and making it clear in no uncertain terms that they would shoot anybody who came near their stores unless that person had a badge or a firefighter uniform on.
 
Agreed, but I am feeling tears and rage for George Floyd AND also for the very neighborhood where I spent the very best and most formative years of my young life, South Minneapolis.
Watching idiot opportunists and anarchists, and just plain JERKS destroy their own neighborhood is devastating.
It is all too easy to dump Minneapolis into some pretend dumpster and call it a ghetto but I lived there, and Minneapolis is a rather well heeled, diverse and vital hub of the Upper Midwest.

If one thinks diversity is a cure for this kind of civil unrest, think again as you watch video clips of people of all races and ethnicities joining in on the fire, the looting and the vandalism.

And the anarchists are having a field day with this, too by the way...

View attachment 67281850

View attachment 67281851

That burnt apartment building is the very building I first lived in when I arrived there in 1978.
It's the very apartment I keep harping on about it costing me 110 bucks a month back then.


I mean nobody really thinks that. Diversity as defined by the left creates violence it doesn’t cure it
 
Great news for Trump, the Democrats haven taken the race baiting so far that cities will burn in the weeks leading up to the election. It will be just like 1968.

Meaning a traditional republican law and order platform will be very appealing to people living under the riots that will only grow more common since the left has spent so long fomenting unrest
 
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