NBA shows true lack of character.

The NBA cowtows to China complaints. NBA stars, coaches and executives bowed down to the almighty dollar being provided to them by the Chinese. A communist, oppressive govenment who practices civil rights and racial oppression every day. Then the NBA comes home and complains about America. $$$$ We now know for sure the only real issue with the NBA.

Integrityrespec said:

The NBA cowtows to China complaints. NBA stars, coaches and executives bowed down to the almighty dollar being provided to them by the Chinese. A communist, oppressive govenment who practices civil rights and racial oppression every day. Then the NBA comes home and complains about America. $$$$ We now know for sure the only real issue with the NBA.

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Nobody complained when the NFL bowed down to the almighty dollar when it was Black people protesting police brutality in America.

If the HK protesters were Black nobody would care. They would blame the protesters for rioting and throwing Molotovs.

Integrityrespec said:

The NBA cowtows to China complaints. NBA stars, coaches and executives bowed down to the almighty dollar being provided to them by the Chinese. A communist, oppressive govenment who practices civil rights and racial oppression every day. Then the NBA comes home and complains about America. $$$$ We now know for sure the only real issue with the NBA.

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The US has been about the almighty dollar for longer than there was an NBA........

Integrityrespec said:

The NBA cowtows to China complaints. NBA stars, coaches and executives bowed down to the almighty dollar being provided to them by the Chinese. A communist, oppressive govenment who practices civil rights and racial oppression every day. Then the NBA comes home and complains about America. $$$$ We now know for sure the only real issue with the NBA.

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Yep, the golden rule of business remains "the customer is always right" even when common sense dictates otherwise.

Rexedgar said:

The US has been about the almighty dollar for longer than there was an NBA........

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So its ok for the NBA to support the communist policies of China because they get paid. Sorry, I didn't realize a minimum salary in the NBA of half a million a year wasn't adequate to live on with out accepting money and supporting China.

Integrityrespec said:

So its ok for the NBA to support the communist policies of China because they get paid. Sorry, I didn't realize a minimum salary in the NBA of half a million a year wasn't adequate to live on with out accepting money and supporting China.

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I don’t think support is the word you want. The NBA stance is not to bite the hands (over one billion pairs) that feed them. American greed is legendary......

Integrityrespec said:

So its ok for the NBA to support the communist policies of China because they get paid. Sorry, I didn't realize a minimum salary in the NBA of half a million a year wasn't adequate to live on with out accepting money and supporting China.

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US corporations have had no issue doing business in all sorts of questionable nations. The NBA is one of many which does business in China because it is a massive market; so I'm not sure what you think should happen in the interest of profits.

Integrityrespec said:

The NBA cowtows to China complaints. NBA stars, coaches and executives bowed down to the almighty dollar being provided to them by the Chinese. A communist, oppressive govenment who practices civil rights and racial oppression every day. Then the NBA comes home and complains about America. $$$$ We now know for sure the only real issue with the NBA.

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You can tell those who have principles versus those who pay lipservice to principles by how they behave when they are tested. The person with principles will stick with them, even when they end up costing him or her dearly. The NBA has no principles as an organization in my opinion.

Felis Leo said:

You can tell those who have principles versus those who pay lipservice to principles by how they behave when they are tested. The person with principles will stick with them, even when they end up costing him or her dearly. The NBA has no principles as an organization in my opinion.

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Same with the NFL, right?

Felis Leo said:

You can tell those who have principles versus those who pay lipservice to principles by how they behave when they are tested. The person with principles will stick with them, even when they end up costing him or her dearly. The NBA has no principles as an organization in my opinion.

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Perhaps the NBA realizes Asian politics is not something they should be involved in. The NBA is a sport. Their focus during games, should be the games.

SonOfDaedalus said:

Nobody complained when the NFL bowed down to the almighty dollar when it was Black people protesting police brutality in America.

If the HK protesters were Black nobody would care. They would blame the protesters for rioting and throwing Molotovs.

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Seriously?? You want to compare the NBA and many ultra wealthy basketball players DENYING the right to protest against the Chinese Communist Chinese party's oppression, imprisonment, forced organ harvesting and murder of religious minorities, with the NFL temporarily criticizing a few ultra- privileged, multi-millionaire football players taking a knee to protest some nationally covered police brutality cases(many of which proved NOT to be true.. ie. Ferguson)? But the NFL actually waffled on those protests, with some franchises supporting them!

Ironically, almost all of the legit and illegit police brutality incidents occur in cities and states controlled by democrats, but NO ONE among the "news" media OR
the progressive left(redundant) ever bother to protest or criticize the democrats who control those cities AND police departments! If these politically/ideologically motivated NFL "player/protestors" and progressives truly wanted to solve this issue, they'd be aiming their protest anger at the leadership of those cities, ie the democrats! But instead, they whine, bitch and moan at the NFL, who literally have NOTHING TO DO WITH POLICE BRUTALITY! Whether or not the NFL allows you to take a knee against police brutality will have NO effect on weeding out corruption, and forcing those political leaders to implement better policies!

This is one of the reasons that I despise many aspects of the "progressive" movement. These protests against police brutality aren't really about solving that problem in the first place! In fact, they are more motivated by the desire to give democrats even more control in even more cities! But as long as the progressive base can see and 'feel' the superficial, shallow 'virtue' of giving lip service to a this problem, then it literally doesn't matter that NOTHING USEFUL IS ACTUALLY DONE TO STOP IT!! As long as the 'optics' are right, and the feeling is there, it's good enough! Just don't dare put ANY blame on the feet of democrats who run these cities, because then the 'good feelings' would be temporarily lost...

Kreton said:

Perhaps the NBA realizes Asian politics is not something they should be involved in. The NBA is a sport. Their focus during games, should be the games.

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Yeah, they should profit off of evil oppressive govts, while making sure to do everything in their power to HELP those govts maintain their power and control, by aiding them in their propaganda, and by being part of the propaganda!

Yep, nothing makes me want to support a company more than knowing that they don't give a flying **** about taking money from the most evil people on the planet, despite the fact that they are already enormously wealthy WITHOUT needing the extra income!

Go NBA!

Rexedgar said:

I don’t think support is the word you want. The NBA stance is not to bite the hands (over one billion pairs) that feed them. American greed is legendary......

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Yeah, thank God that greed only occurs in America, and that all other countries sacrifice SO much more blood and money for the common good of their fellow man! Oh wait, something about that just doesn't ring true, does it???

ModerationNow! said:

Yeah, thank God that greed only occurs in America, and that all other countries sacrifice SO much more blood and money for the common good of their fellow man! Oh wait, something about that just doesn't ring true, does it???

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We do it bigger and better than anyone and have for some time......

“As one digs deeper into the national character of the Americans, one sees that they have sought the value of everything in this world only in the answer to this single question: how much money will it bring in?”

Alexis de Tocqueville

Kreton said:

Perhaps the NBA realizes Asian politics is not something they should be involved in. The NBA is a sport. Their focus during games, should be the games.

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If they were consistent in this position I would have no problem, but they have tried to portray themselves as very socially conscious and willing to take courageous political stances domestically.

For example, moving the all-star game out of Charlotte over transgender bathroom rights.

I don't have a problem with businesses that a) like to make money and b) prefer to avoid politics - but you can't hold yourself out as a beacon of human rights rectitude in one place and tell people to shut up when a government demands it.

And moreover, normally outspoken progressive types like Steve Kerr aren't helping by using this as an opportunity to talk down about the USA.

This is a really bad look for the NBA.

ModerationNow! said:

Yeah, they should profit off of evil oppressive govts, while making sure to do everything in their power to HELP those govts maintain their power and control, by aiding them in their propaganda, and by being part of the propaganda!

Yep, nothing makes me want to support a company more than knowing that they don't give a flying **** about taking money from the most evil people on the planet, despite the fact that they are already enormously wealthy WITHOUT needing the extra income!

Go NBA!

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Perhaps you could learn to differentiate between sports and politics.

Also since you support plenty of businesses who do business with China in someway but sitting here crying about the NBA because they do business in China, you are a hypocrite.

Kreton said:

Perhaps you could learn to differentiate between sports and politics.

Also since you support plenty of businesses who do business with China in someway but sitting here crying about the NBA because they do business in China, you are a hypocrite.

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I don't think it's the "doing business in China" people are complaining about, it's the "knuckling under to the totalitarian government censorship while actively taking progressive political stances at home".

diz said:

I don't think it's the "doing business in China" people are complaining about, it's the "knuckling under to the totalitarian government censorship while actively taking progressive political stances at home".

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They are more active in their own country than other countries.

Imagine that. I suppose it is up to the NBA to solve the political issues across the globe. :roll:

Kreton said:

They are more active in their own country than other countries.

Imagine that. I suppose it is up to the NBA to solve the political issues across the globe. :roll:

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I think the way most people are looking at it is they strongly believe in their principles when it doesn't cost them anything. And this makes them look like hypocritical assholes. Because that's exactly what they are.

I'm sure they're glad to have your support though.

diz said:

I think the way most people are looking at it is they strongly believe in their principles when it doesn't cost them anything. And this makes them look like hypocritical assholes. Because that's exactly what they are.

I'm sure they're glad to have your support though.

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I'm certain yours doesn't matter to them.

Also are you able to explain what they did that bothered you so very much to upset you to this level?

Or it is just because your dear leaders told you to be mad?

Kreton said:

I'm certain yours doesn't matter to them.

Also are you able to explain what they did that bothered you so very much to upset you to this level?

Or it is just because your dear leaders told you to be mad?

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Oh, well, that's a really mature adult debating point.

But if you get off the playground during recess you may notice I'm not the only one being critical of them.

The NBA may be the first organization that managed to get both AOC and Ted Cruz to unite against them.

diz said:

Oh, well, that's a really mature adult debating point.

But if you get off the playground during recess you may notice I'm not the only one being critical of them.

The NBA may be the first organization that managed to get both AOC and Ted Cruz to unite against them.

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Funny thing is I asked you a question you choose not answer. Almost certainly because you are incapable, however I will concede that it might be because you aren't able to understand the question.

However that is some really good mature debating.

Lets see if you can do a little better, I'll ask again.

Also are you able to explain what they did that bothered you so very much to upset you to this level?

Kreton said:

Funny thing is I asked you a question you choose not answer. Almost certainly because you are incapable, however I will concede that it might be because you aren't able to understand the question.

However that is some really good mature debating.

Lets see if you can do a little better, I'll ask again.

Also are you able to explain what they did that bothered you so very much to upset you to this level?

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It seems like a waste of time to attempt rational discussion with you.

But, I'll say it one more time: The NBA and certain related people are getting criticism because they act like they are political idealists at home but then crater to an actual tyrannical government that infringes on basic human rights. They have been exposed as hypocrites.

Since you seem to be suffering from the delusion that I am the only one saying this, or are incapable of having a discussion without making personal attacks, let me provide you a link to some editorials in a major newspaper making exactly this same point.


So, perhaps at least you can drop the arguments directed at me personally and engage with substance of the points people are actually making:

The problem, LeBron, is that you’ve helped construct a world in which NBA players have been incentivized to criticize our leaders and our government here at home. And there’s nothing wrong with that, by the way. It’s part of who we are, and there’s a large segment of people who agree with you when you call President Donald Trump “u bum” on Twitter and say that going to the White House as an NBA champion used to be a great honor “until you showed up” as you did on Sept. 23, 2017.

...

But when you go that hard at our own elected officials, LeBron, it is difficult to reconcile that with the idea that China of all countries should be above reproach for anyone who works in the NBA.

...

Surely you are aware of this, LeBron, but in the United States it’s considered a good thing to exercise your freedom of expression in support of a just cause because you’ve done that yourself on numerous occasions.

Not supporting other Americans who exercise that same freedom because it might personally inconvenience you for a few days overseas, LeBron, is without question the most disgraceful moment of your career.

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LeBron James undermines values with comments on Daryl Morey and China

But in other nuanced ways, everything has changed for him. We thought James was a different kind of athlete, more Ali than Jordan, more Billie Jean than Tiger. We thought he did in fact care about Hong Kong, that he did care about Houston Rockets general manager Daryl Morey’s right to speak out, that he did care about how the NBA might even begin to force change on China’s repressive regime.

Why did we think that? Because of the way James has spent a career constructing an authentic and authoritative presence not just in sports, but in our culture. He was smart about his role in our lives and the wider world of American politics. In these fraught times, he was consistently positioned right where we thought he would be. His tweet calling Donald Trump “u bum” was an instant classic. He wasn’t ever going to shut up and dribble no matter who told him to, and that made sense.

So we knew this guy. Knew him well. We could count on LeBron to be a voice for sanity and honesty and fairness.

But then, in an instant, we couldn’t.

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LeBron James' stance on China flap weakens his voice on other issues

diz said:

It seems like a waste of time to attempt rational discussion with you.

But, I'll say it one more time: The NBA and certain related people are getting criticism because they act like they are political idealists at home but then crater to an actual tyrannical government that infringes on basic human rights. They have been exposed as hypocrites.

Since you seem to be suffering from the delusion that I am the only one saying this, or are incapable of having a discussion without making personal attacks, let me provide you a link to some editorials in a major newspaper making exactly this same point.


So, perhaps at least you can drop the arguments directed at me personally and engage with substance of the points people are actually making:



LeBron James undermines values with comments on Daryl Morey and China



LeBron James' stance on China flap weakens his voice on other issues

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So you cannot point to anything the NBA did that has you outraged? I am not discussing with USA Today. I am asking you, specifically YOU, why you are outraged and upset with the NBA. I don't think you know. You are sidestepping the question in every way possible. You do not know why you are mad.


I see here where you are pretending to try.

But, I'll say it one more time: The NBA and certain related people are getting criticism because they act like they are political idealists at home

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Nothing wrong with advocating for the things you believe in in your own country. No issue here. They are choosing not to be involved in Chinese politics just as every other business. And just as you do. I assume you are doing nothing to stop China. So that doesn't line of whining doesn't really hold up. And I've checked your history a bit and I don't see you in an up roar about literally every other business that does business there. So that isn't it.

But then crater to an actual tyrannical government that infringes on basic human rights.

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Cater (assume you dont mean crater) how? What exactly is the NBA doing that every other US business that does business in China isn't doing? Please be specific.

They have been exposed as hypocrites.

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If they are, so are you. So is every other American business. So is our entire government. Because you and every other person like you supports businesses that support China every single day. So as long as you continue to support China, and you do, while pretending that it is wrong for everyone else, you are a hypocrite. If you are sooooo concerned about HK (and I know you aren't) get on over there. Get on the front lines. Help them fight. Sacrifice your lifestyle for this cause you are just so passionate about. Because, believe me this is true, you crying on a forum while pumping money into China isn't quite helping HK the way you think it is.

Truth can suck sometimes.

Not going to waste any more of my time with you.