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Why are you shoving this wall down our throats?

James972 said:
The Israeli walls protects the entire country and our wall is merely to protect the southern border; should be very easy given that we are a much richer country. LIberal got killed on that one worse than usual!
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LOL Only 3% of Israels wall is concrete the rest is fence. They are not as into wasting money on huge construction contracts with the kickbacks and cost overruns that Trump has wet dreams about. Trump want to enrich himself with our taxpayer dollars. He can shove it.

Although sections of concrete wall are most often pictured in the media, these account for only 3 percent of the barrier, primarily in residential areas and along highways where Palestinian snipers had targeted Israeli citizens.

The remaining 97 percent consists of a double chain link fence flanking a dirt patrol road. Enhanced with electronic sensors that alert the Israel Defense Forces to movement along the fence, its object is less to stop infiltrators than to deter, detect and track them.
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https://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/op-ed/2017/09/20/build-trump-border-wall-learn-israel-first/678600001/
 
James972 said:
how many people died from bridge collapse in USA due to neglect: ZERO!! Your argument is 100% worthless.
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Tell that to the 70 wounded and 8 dead from the gas leak explosion in Harlem. Bridge collapse in Minneapolis killed what, 13 people and injured 130ish? New Orleans Levees needed fixing. Let's add 1,800 from Katrina to the tally. Or how about the 1/3rd or so of traffic deaths directly related to poorly maintained roads.

Or the 2010 San Bruno Cali explosion that killed 8 people.

In my hometown a house exploded last year, killing 2 people.

Poorly maintained gas lines are a major issue.

People are dying I'd wager on a larger scale than illegal immigrants are killing people.

Pathetic. YOUR argument means nothing.
 
Obscurity said:
Tell that to the 70 wounded and 8 dead from the gas leak explosion in Harlem.
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gas leak explosions are local gas company/home owner responsibility and happen all the time. Not federal responsibility. So you have no examples of crumbling infrastructure after all. How does that feel?
 
iguanaman said:
LOL Only 3% of Israels wall is concrete the rest is fence.
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you lost debate so pretending we are debating about concrete or fence?? Do you know what a strawman is??
 
James972 said:
you lost debate so pretending we are debating about concrete or fence?? Do you know what a strawman is??
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LOL Losing is your middle name. We paid for Israels fence, why wouldn't they build it? Let's ask Israel to pay for ours now.:lol:
 
iguanaman said:
LOL Losing is your middle name. We paid for Israels fence, why wouldn't they build it? Let's ask Israel to pay for ours now.:lol:
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you lost debate so are talking about who paid for Israeli wall, for some reason? changing subject to cover up your loss??
 
James972 said:
Probably not since they are very formidable and not used now by those who are extra cautious about not getting caught
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If people are risking their lives crossing through deserts already, crossing rivers and gorges isn't that much of a stretch. If the demand for cheap labor here isn't addressed, you're just spitting into the wind. Israel built walls and fences but also staffed them properly and changed their immigration policies to make it very difficult for those who do make it across to settle in the country.
 
CriticalThought said:
Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.

You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.

Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
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Truth is, the wall will work very well and save us trillions going forward. We have proof, we know this.
 
ElChupacabra said:
If people are risking their lives crossing through deserts already, crossing rivers and gorges isn't that much of a stretch.
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like you said if they are dying now they are not about to worsen the odds with much much more hazardous routes.
 
ElChupacabra said:
Israel built walls and fences but also staffed them properly
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with Trumps wall thats you couldn't climb over easily or drive through we could cut police budget for wall in half it would pay for itself!
 
James972 said:
like you said if they are dying now they are not about to worsen the odds with much much more hazardous routes.
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Despite the hazards they still come, and mind you some of the areas are through cattle ranches along the Rio Grande.
 
ElChupacabra said:
Just like that! Magic!
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imagine the cost of policing a 5' wall with holes in it versus a 30' wall no holes and designed to prevent climbing and tunneling? You make yourself look very very slow when you disagree to resist rather than to think. Liberals are all emotion and no brains whatsoever.
 
Virgil Jones said:
Truth is, the wall will work very well and save us trillions going forward. We have proof, we know this.
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You have no "proof". You have anecdotal evidence like "Israel has a wall". How much do you think it would cost to maintain and man a wall 24/7 that is nearly 2,000 miles long? Sure, you could do it at Israel levels but it would probably cost "trillions".
 
ElChupacabra said:
Despite the hazards they still come, and mind you some of the areas are through cattle ranches along the Rio Grande.
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wrong very few come through the most difficult areas and if they did we'd just build a wall.
 
CriticalThought said:
You have no "proof". You have anecdotal evidence like "Israel has a wall". How much do you think it would cost to maintain and man a wall 24/7 that is nearly 2,000 miles long? Sure, you could do it at Israel levels but it would probably cost "trillions".
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we do it now but with a good wall it would be 5% of the expense! 1+1=2
 
CriticalThought said:
You have no "proof". You have anecdotal evidence like "Israel has a wall". .
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Israel does have a wall and they say its 99% effective against immigration and terror! this is why you no long hear of bombings within Israel. 1+1=2
. Where is the critical thought!
 
James972 said:
we do it now but with a good wall it would be 5% of the expense! 1+1=2
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If I build it out of cheese it will fly to the moon.

Stating things as facts does not make them true.
 
James972 said:
Israel does have a wall and they say its 99% effective against immigration and terror! this is why you no long hear of bombings within Israel. 1+1=2
. Where is the critical thought!
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It cost $2 million per mile to build Israel's fence and billions more to guard it and maintain it. I am sure we could build one, but it would only be as effective as the manpower to guard it, which is the same case as Israel. Perpetually manning a wall like that would probably require manpower equivalent to the Iraq and Afghanistan wars combined. The cost is simply not worth it. A fence across 440 miles of mostly flat, arid terrain like in Israel is not the same as one across 2,000 miles of mountains, forests, deserts, rivers, and plains likely the U.S. That isn't even getting into the border towns, private land, and other issues that fall on the border.
 
CriticalThought said:
I am sure we could build one, but it would only be as effective as the manpower to guard it,.
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manpower required would be tiny % of what we have now to police current tiny wall filled with holes. Where is the critical thought!!
 
James972 said:
wrong very few come through the most difficult areas and if they did we'd just build a wall.
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They don't if there are easier approaches, but most likely will if there's no other way. People get on all sorts of crappy DIY rafts and take to sea; you think people won't try crossing ravines and rivers? The river makes it more complicated since the Rio Grande in particular has a lot of waterfront private property.
 
CriticalThought said:
It cost $2 million per mile to build Israel's fence and billions more to guard it and maintain it. I am sure we could build one, but it would only be as effective as the manpower to guard it, which is the same case as Israel. Perpetually manning a wall like that would probably require manpower equivalent to the Iraq and Afghanistan wars combined. The cost is simply not worth it. A fence across 440 miles of mostly flat, arid terrain like in Israel is not the same as one across 2,000 miles of mountains, forests, deserts, rivers, and plains likely the U.S. That isn't even getting into the border towns, private land, and other issues that fall on the border.
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Apparently bringing up these valid points gets you labeled as a "liberal".

:lamo
 
James972 said:
imagine the cost of policing a 5' wall with holes in it versus a 30' wall no holes and designed to prevent climbing and tunneling? You make yourself look very very slow when you disagree to resist rather than to think. Liberals are all emotion and no brains whatsoever.
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It's pretty funny to read this when most of your posts are the ideas of others you continually parrot instead of providing any of your own insight. The you resort to ad hominem attacks, so you may want to consider that when responding.
 
ElChupacabra said:
It's pretty funny to read this when most of your posts are the ideas of others
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as if others like Einstein, Jesus, and Jefferson didn't have the greatest ideas in all of human history. Hitler Stalin Mao Pol Pot had new ideas. LIberals always seem perfectly slow.
 
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