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Elizabeth Warren supporter arrested after allegedly assaulting US Senate challenger

holbritter said:
https://timeline.com/antifa-history-violence-nazis-5ccb6231879a

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/09/the-rise-of-the-violent-left/534192/
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A number of notable Americans, like Hemingway, fought in the Spanish Civil War. While that was anti-fascism, it was first and foremost a civil war. Google Guernica.

I'd seen the Atlantic article. Long time ago, I used to subscribe. They changed. That has nothing to do with this article, just reminiscing about a time when the mag was terrific.

"Antifa’s perceived legitimacy is inversely correlated with the government’s."

There's the rub. If you are worried Trump will become a dictator, than all bets are off. Trump is trying to become a dictator, like his pals, Putin, Erdogan and Duterte.

I'm hoping that our institutions will restrain him. But we've seen a lot of good institutions go down in flames over the last couple decades. If that does happen, a lot of people will be shot, not just Antifa.

There is no magic pixie dust that is going to save you. We have good institutions, but they are weakening.


https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2016/11/10/trump-election-autocracy-rules-for-survival/
 
late said:
They have no authority. That's ridiculous.

You said they aren't fighting fascists, which is interesting, you get bonus points for creative ridiculousness.

The problem, from where I sit, is you seem to be getting more removed from reality. I am pretty sure that's my perspective, the more I think about what you are saying, the less it seems rooted in something vaguely like the real world.

We really should agree to disagree.
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The main thing we disagree on is the condemnation of the use of violence. You seem to think it appropriate if performed by left groups like Antifa, I happen to find it inappropriate regardless of which political ideology is committing the violence.

Authority, BTW, is generally rooted in force. And Antifa applies force to those who speak with opinions or ideals they don't like. It's not just imagined fascists, from their riots in Berkley, to their hunts on others practicing their rights to assemble and protest, they go after those speaking in ways the do not like. What actual fascists have they tackled? They attack individuals on the street, they aren't out hunting groups or fighting fascist elements within government. It's essentially Don Quixote, they're tilting at windmills. And in their religious fervor and righteous anger, they aim their violence at anyone on the right, not just "fascists".

To you, seemingly, this violence is acceptable and you do not denounce it. Instead you make excuses for their delusions of grandure. But political violence, regardless to which side of the isle it comes from or is directed at, is dangerous and threatens the very rights and liberties of the People we must protect if we are to keep the Republic. And thus the violent antics of Antifa are just as bad as violence from any other group.

You either can see this or not, but it's a simple fact.
 
late said:
It's a necessary evil, and this isn't a tea party.
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What's a necessary evil? Antifa's violence? No, it isn't. They aren't doing anything beneficial with it, they are not driving us to a better place. They are merely acting violently against individuals on the street, infringing upon the free exercise of rights by others.

And the tea party didn't really show up armored and armed and start fights, so while I didn't quite buy into their propaganda, I'd take them over Antifa.
 
Ikari said:
What's a necessary evil? Antifa's violence? No, it isn't. They aren't doing anything beneficial with it, they are not driving us to a better place. They are merely acting violently against individuals on the street, infringing upon the free exercise of rights by others.

And the tea party didn't really show up armored and armed and start fights, so while I didn't quite buy into their propaganda, I'd take them over Antifa.
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You are simply contradicting what I say.

You have not been countering my substantive points with substantive rebuttals.

Btw, I mean tea party, like what the Brits do for High Tea. Not the American looneytunes.
 
late said:
You are simply contradicting what I say.

You have not been countering my substantive points with substantive rebuttals.

Btw, I mean tea party, like what the Brits do for High Tea. Not the American looneytunes.
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You haven't countered anything, your "rebuttals" are deflections, just trying to call my points "creative ridiculousness". That's not a substantive point at all.
 
Ikari said:
Elizabeth Warren supporter arrested after allegedly assaulting US Senate challenger | Fox News



So this guy is running for office as an independent, when one of Warren's supporters punches his megaphone and gives him a bloody lip.

More and more we see this sort of behavior from folk on the left, though typically it has been with the younger generation, not so much the older. But we have seen rise of groups like Antifa and this generalized behavior which is aimed to shut down free expression and speech over political idealism. It's a symptom of the hyperpartisan split in our country that has been brewing for some time and taken to new heights with Trump. And it's beyond ridiculous, it's damaging to the Republic. One of the reasons why we can't have nice things is that people on whole, left and right, seem to have abandoned reason and intelligence for emotionalized, hyperpartisan rhetoric. And violence is the end game of that, which we are seeing now.

Why punch this guy? Just because he has a different political opinion? I think everyone is allowed their opinion and to express it so long as it is done peacefully.

I do not believe that we can control the government and keep the Republic with this sort of behavior. Also, Ayyadurai said this:

Which makes me really like him. lol
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It's coming from both sides but one side does it in much larger levels and is much more mainstream, and that is the left. No Hillary or Bernie rallies had to have riot police protect them from being overrun by giant violent mobs but almost all of Trump's rallies did, and even that wasn't enough to keep the Chicago rally from being shut down. The right's participation in such things is reactionary to the left and is starting to build now, unfortunately.
 
Taylor said:
Meh. No, the 74 year old shouldn't have done that, but I have little sympathy for this Ayyadurai as he was yelling "Racist! Racist!" in the guy's face with a bullhorn.

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Enough volume and its assault in some places.

Hearing damage.
 
Ikari said:
Elizabeth Warren supporter arrested after allegedly assaulting US Senate challenger | Fox News


So this guy is running for office as an independent, when one of Warren's supporters punches his megaphone and gives him a bloody lip.

More and more we see this sort of behavior from folk on the left, though typically it has been with the younger generation, not so much the older. But we have seen rise of groups like Antifa and this generalized behavior which is aimed to shut down free expression and speech over political idealism. It's a symptom of the hyperpartisan split in our country that has been brewing for some time and taken to new heights with Trump. And it's beyond ridiculous, it's damaging to the Republic. One of the reasons why we can't have nice things is that people on whole, left and right, seem to have abandoned reason and intelligence for emotionalized, hyperpartisan rhetoric. And violence is the end game of that, which we are seeing now.

Why punch this guy? Just because he has a different political opinion? I think everyone is allowed their opinion and to express it so long as it is done peacefully.

I do not believe that we can control the government and keep the Republic with this sort of behavior. Also, Ayyadurai said this:



Which makes me really like him. lol
Click to expand...

There’s nothing worse than someone who is over the age of 35 being a socialist.
 
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