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Would Trump have won without the Russians?

Because there's not a shred of evidence that Trump or his campaign had anything to do with any of that.

Have you followed this story for even one day at any time in the last 18 months?
 
Where Hillary lost the election was with the enthusiasm/upset gap among independents.
Independents enthusiastic for Clinton 9%, enthusiastic for Trump 23%
Independents satisfied but not enthusiastic for Clinton 16%, satisfied but not enthusiastic for Trump 15%
Independents dissatisfied but not upset about Clinton's nomination 16%, dissatisfied but not upset about Trump's nomination 15%
Independents upset with Clinton nomination 57%, upset with Trump's nomination 43%

Questions 18 and 19

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/l37rosbwjp/econTabReport_lv.pdf

As you see there was a huge gap in favor of Trump with independents enthusiastic 23-9 over Hillary. Also a huge gap in those upset over Hillary's nomination by the Democrats over those upset by Trump's nomination by the Republicans 57-43%. No wonder Trump won the independent vote.

Throw in those independents who viewed Hillary negative or unfavorable 70% which included 57% who viewed Hillary very unfavorable or negative to how negative independents viewed Trump. 57 total unfavorable with 46% very unfavorable. Questions 10 and 11.

Bottom line, Trump wins the independent/non-affiliated vote and thus the White House.

Truth.
 
Have you followed this story for even one day at any time in the last 18 months?

Yea...by the lying, cheating, socialist media? Sure. Every minute. STILL not a shred of evidence.
 
IMHO, the Polls and the 8 years of attacks on her character, job performance and every and anything else that could be dreamed up by the right, made Progressive voters complacent and discouraged. IF the GOP would have run anyone but djt she would have still have lost.

Paraphrase of a Yogism; If the people don't want to come out to the polls, nobody's gonna stop them.
 
There's not a shred of evidence.

I can understand that sentiment......for anyone who has not followed this story and is ignorant of the many developments along the way.
 
Here's what it took for the Dope to beat Hillary

1. 4 years of fake congressional investigations from Benghazi to emails
2. Voter suppression
3. Russians
4. Cambridge Analytica defrauding Facebook users
5. Comey letter
6. Fox News 24/7 propaganda channel
7. Sean Hannity All Trump all the Time Radio
8. A black man in the White House
9. Lies
10. More lies

Just for fun I thought I'd beat up on you points.

1) They weren't fake, Congress has oversight duties, four people died, of course there'd be an investigation. If HRC had been forthcoming with the relevant docs from her hidden server it have come to light much much sooner, which definitely deserved investigation.

2) Voter ID isn't suppression

3) Report after report finds no evidence of votes changing due to Russian meddling.

4) Cambridge Analytica via academic Aleksandr Kogan did nothing more than the Obama administration did with Facebook.

5) HRC's fault, no hidden email server, no investigation, no Comey.

6) As opposed to 24/7 propaganda from CNN, MSNBC, ABC, NBC, CBS, WaPo, NYT's, et al. Seriously.

7) Same as #6. Seriously.

8) The race card irrelevant.

9-10) I sure Hillary's lies did have an affect.
 
Again with the oxymoron that you have already been schooled and correct on. There is no such thing as BASICALLY IGNORED. Clinton did not IGNORE the swing states and campaigned in them and spent resources in them.

A question for you, if my brain is developed enough to accept that Clinton lost for a variety of reasons including her own campaign decisions, t he Comey actions and the Russian interference and its weaponization by Trump - why is your brain so structured that it cannot accept multiple reasons including Comey and Russia?

Again with the English Professor diversion, you know exactly what I mean.

I listed several reasons, your comment and concern about my brain is irrelevant, your lack of reading comprehension skills or just ignoring my list is on you.
 
Again with the English Professor diversion, you know exactly what I mean.

I listed several reasons, your comment and concern about my brain is irrelevant, your lack of reading comprehension skills or just ignoring my list is on you.

You keep making the same mistake and I am glad to help you correct it.
 
You keep making the same mistake and I am glad to help you correct it.

And you continue to ignore responses by playing your English Professor diversion game.
 
And you continue to ignore responses by playing your English Professor diversion game.

Trying to help you is not a game. Its a kindness.
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.

No one seems more confident of this than Trump. So probably, yeah.
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.

Trump would have won regardless.

Hillary had no clear path to a victory in the Electoral College. A lot of people knew this--including Trump.

The Russians had nothing to do with that.......Hillary was just a bad choice as a candidate and the black vote was not strong enough to save her--as she had hoped.
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.

Most likely he would have still won...

He campaigned in swing states.
 
Yes, he would have won anyway....
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.

No way of knowing for sure. It's obvious that Trump thinks Russia helped and still wants its help which is one of his incentives for ceding the welfare of his country to an evil, foreign power.
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.

No.

1. Clinton made one fundamental strategic error: to focus on Trump's unfitness rather than her own vision. She thereby insulted Trump's supporters (deplorables) and did not give her own voters anything motivational. In this, btw, she copied Obama's 2012 playbook, which was entirely focused on attacking Romney. Obama's personal charisma allowed him to pull that off; Clinton's lack of charisma made it a poor choice.
2. The late tactical decision by the Clinton team to expand the map and go for a landslide was catastrophically wrong. They scattered their shots when they should have been concentrating their efforts.
3. The Trump campaign's insight, finding an electoral path through Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania, was brilliant and completely missed by the Clinton team.
 
No sense beating around the bush. I am not asking if Trump's campaign colluded, I am asking if the leaks that Russia provided and the social media propaganda Russia generated were enough to sway some voters to stay home and others to turn out in a significant enough way to tip the election in Trump's favor.


Given how close the race was, I think it is a fair question and if we assume the leaks were indeed Russia then given the damning content of the emails it seems likely that it played a factor in it. I don't believe it played a significant role but combined with the numerous faults and missteps of Hillary and her campaign it may be that final nail in the coffin so to speak.

Given the overblown response to it though, I can't help but see this as a deflection from the actual contents of the emails. I see the releasing of those emails as a good thing as it showed the inner workings of the DNC and how they rigged the primary against Bernie. I would have imagined Bernie supporters and more Progressive leaning Democrats should be thankful for it as it helped clear out some of the corruption that is allowing them to take a stronger hold over the party and shift it more in their favor.
 
The dems lost because...

1. Hillary is so unlikeable.
2. The DNC basically sanctioned Clinton's candidacy and roadblocked Sanders. Sander supporters were hard core. (Worse than Trumptards as far as loyalty goes.)
3. Enter commie fake news on social media. Trumptards pick up said fake media and, without shame, disseminate the commie propaganda it as if was the God's honest truth.
4. Shunned Berner's, looking for direction, eat said commie-news up as it demonizes the Hildabeast and her cohorts. The same people that **** on Bernie. (In spite, many of the Bernie crowd end up voting Trump- OR - votes 3rd party - OR - doesn't vote at all.
5. Enter Comey. Sabotage Hillary campaign days before the election. Issue seems to go away after the election. Imagine that. (Timing is everything.)
6. Trump loses majority vote by a significant margin but leads EC.
7. Trump is elected President.

AND... if you don't agree with any of the points I mentioned, just refer to item #1. That's the main reason Trump won.

Never should have pissed off the Bernie people.

I am reminded of a saying my ol' mama used to say, "You cut your nose off just to spite your face."

Thanks Bernie people. Enjoy Trump!
 
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