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Political scientists rank Trump last, Lincoln first in presidential greatness survey

jonny5 said:
Lincoln was pretty bad. He invaded a sovereign country resulting in the death of over 600k of his own and their citizens, just so he could force them to live in his union. LBJ and Nixon were pretty bad too. They forced hundreds of thousands of citizens to fight and die in a unnecessary war. Nixon covered up criminal activity and apparently was a traitor, interfering in foreign policy as a candidate. Bill Clinton probably raped women, and certainly sexually harassed an intern.

Early Presidents enslaved people and enabled slavery. Other early presidents nearly wiped out native americans.

Trump, given his short time, barely deviates from average. He certainly has one of the worst public images, but on policy he hasnt really accomplished or harmed anything yet.
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The South was no "sovereign country"; not a single foreign power recognized their independence, even before you get into the whole "mass treason", "brutal abuse of the many, many people in the south who had no interest in leaving the US" and "invasion of West Virginia" issues.
 
Tigerace117 said:
The South was no "sovereign country"; not a single foreign power recognized their independence, even before you get into the whole "mass treason", "brutal abuse of the many, many people in the south who had no interest in leaving the US" and "invasion of West Virginia" issues.
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People are naturally free and soverign, they dont require foreign powers to recognize it. It even says so in our founding documents which Lincoln ignored.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
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The south did nothing more than the colonies did before them.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Political scientists rank Trump last, Lincoln first in presidential greatness survey



Trump is definitely (by a yuuge margin) the worst US president during my lifetime.

Related: Official Results of the 2018 Presidents & Executive Politics Presidential Greatness Survey
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"Roughly 57% of the respondents were democrats, 13% were republicans..."

Well, for the life of me, I can't understand why Trump would rate so poorly. :roll: These wouldn't be the same political scientists who predicted a Clinton landslide, would they?
 
humbolt said:
"Roughly 57% of the respondents were democrats, 13% were republicans..."

Well, for the life of me, I can't understand why Trump would rate so poorly. :roll: These wouldn't be the same political scientists who predicted a Clinton landslide, would they?
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Ah well, you [conveniently] neglected this snippet from the OP article....

He ranked 40th out of 44 among Republicans and conservatives.
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Trump ranked terrible with ALL political scientists taking the poll regardless of political affiliation. Thus, his rightful and well-earned last-place ranking among US presidents.
 
jonny5 said:
People are naturally free and soverign, they dont require foreign powers to recognize it. It even says so in our founding documents which Lincoln ignored.



The south did nothing more than the colonies did before them.
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Which is funny, given the South's entire reason for going to war revolved around keeping people enslaved---the exact opposite of what you claim.

If you want to create a nation, you need at least a few countries to recognize you; otherwise it's a not a valid entity, and indeed, the South wasn't one.

Except "government wasn't destructive of these ends"; the "Confederacy" was not derived from the consent of the governed, given how many of its people it kept in slavery; oh, and the colonies didn't make a big deal about how secession was totally in their right, and then invade an area for trying to stay loyal to the United States.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Ah well, you [conveniently] neglected this snippet from the OP article....



Trump ranked terrible with ALL political scientists taking the poll regardless of political affiliation. Thus, his rightful and well-earned last-place ranking among US presidents.
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...Out of the apparently few rupublicans and conservatives surveyed. The poll means nothing, of course. In fact, Trump has barely finished his first year, so the ranking by any measure is meaningless. But do carry on with this nonsense.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Which is funny, given the South's entire reason for going to war revolved around keeping people enslaved---the exact opposite of what you claim.

If you want to create a nation, you need at least a few countries to recognize you; otherwise it's a not a valid entity, and indeed, the South wasn't one.

Except "government wasn't destructive of these ends"; the "Confederacy" was not derived from the consent of the governed, given how many of its people it kept in slavery; oh, and the colonies didn't make a big deal about how secession was totally in their right, and then invade an area for trying to stay loyal to the United States.
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Lincoln famously said he would keep slavery if it would preserve the union. Thus the issue of slavery is irrelevant when talking about his greatness. He was a hypocrite like every politician and he used force to kill and imprison millions.
 
Rogue Valley said:
Ah well, you [conveniently] neglected this snippet from the OP article....



Trump ranked terrible with ALL political scientists taking the poll regardless of political affiliation. Thus, his rightful and well-earned last-place ranking among US presidents.
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So Trump has been in office for a year and already his record is being ignored by the left and those radical leftists who want to return to the Obama malaise and foreign policy disasters. Interesting how you people are attacking a sitting President right out of the Communist Manifesto claiming you truly care about this country whereas you don't, you only care about leftwing power and social engineering and judicial activism.

I and most Americans will take the America First economic and foreign policy agenda of Trump over the leftwing radical agenda anytime. And most true American see right though the leftwing attempts to remove a sitting President through 24/7 negative beatings that divert from the actual record being generated and yes, a record that thanks to Obama gave us Trump and what we are seeing today
 
faithful_servant said:
He was only ranked so low because there are a lot of people like yourself who would give him a 0 no matter what he does. Thought doesn't come into the issue, just "TRRRUUMMMPPP!!!!"

Also, this wasn't a scientific study, it was just a poll that any 5th grader could have done.
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I think it is more likely that he was ranked so low due to his short presidency and during his short presidency he has not really achieved that much i way of legislation and foreign or huge domestic successes. Maybe he will rise in the ranking later in his presidency.
 
jonny5 said:
Lincoln famously said he would keep slavery if it would preserve the union. Thus the issue of slavery is irrelevant when talking about his greatness. He was a hypocrite like every politician and he used force to kill and imprison millions.
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Lincoln famously stated lots of things. Nobody believed him when he said that, and thus the only people who think slavery is "irrelevant" are Neo Confederates and "libertarians" like you who know that they lose the faux moral high ground when it is brought up.

Funny, your heroes in the South used force to kill and enslave---which is far worse than prison--- millions of people, yet you don't care about that. Gee, I wonder why......:roll:
 
Tigerace117 said:
Lincoln famously stated lots of things. Nobody believed him when he said that, and thus the only people who think slavery is "irrelevant" are Neo Confederates and "libertarians" like you who know that they lose the faux moral high ground when it is brought up.

Funny, your heroes in the South used force to kill and enslave---which is far worse than prison--- millions of people, yet you don't care about that. Gee, I wonder why......:roll:
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Im not the topic. Be civil or we're done.
 
jonny5 said:
Im not the topic. Be civil or we're done.
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The fact that you are spewing misinformation and laughably complaining about people "being imprisoned" when the South went to war literally to preserve slavery, however, is the topic.
 
Conservative said:
Let's see, forth qtr 2016 GDP, 1.5%, first qtr 2017 GDP 1.2%, 2nd Qtr GDP 3.1%, third qtr GDP 3.2%, and 4th qtr GDP 2.6% Thank you Obama for giving us Trump and thank you leftists for showing us just how poorly informed and partisan you are as it doesn't look like an upward trend to me under Obama but maybe math may be a better skill for you than me
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The Trump Presidential Library is already the one at Ft. Leavenworth. All it needs is his nameplate. Many of us expect he'll be there to inaugurate the room and bang on the plate. It's all he'll have left.

And to think Andrew Jackson could have prevented all these divisions. Were he alive of course.
 
Tangmo said:
The Trump Presidential Library is already the one at Ft. Leavenworth. All it needs is his nameplate. Many of us expect he'll be there to inaugurate the room and bang on the plate. It's all he'll have left.

And to think Andrew Jackson could have prevented all these divisions. Were he alive of course.
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If you had said that cheese was yellow, it would have just as much to do with the quote you replied to.
 
Tangmo said:
The Trump Presidential Library is already the one at Ft. Leavenworth. All it needs is his nameplate. Many of us expect he'll be there to inaugurate the room and bang on the plate. It's all he'll have left.

And to think Andrew Jackson could have prevented all these divisions. Were he alive of course.
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Right along side the Bill Clinton cell? Oh, wait, Clinton's illegal activities while in office didn't matter but Trump's before taking office do? Got it! Still waiting for exactly what Trump has DONE that you don't like or have a problem with? Really the issue is YOU DON'T LIKE TRUMP well I am going to let you in on a little secret, liking someone isn't nearly as important as that person getting the job done. You progressives always ignore results to focus on personalities. You want social engineering? Not going to happen under Trump so you are going to have to find another way to get someone else's money for your pet little projects
 
OpportunityCost said:
If you had said that cheese was yellow, it would have just as much to do with the quote you replied to.
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Profound thx.



Conservative said:
Right along side the Bill Clinton cell? Oh, wait, Clinton's illegal activities while in office didn't matter but Trump's before taking office do? Got it! Still waiting for exactly what Trump has DONE that you don't like or have a problem with? Really the issue is YOU DON'T LIKE TRUMP well I am going to let you in on a little secret, liking someone isn't nearly as important as that person getting the job done. You progressives always ignore results to focus on personalities. You want social engineering? Not going to happen under Trump so you are going to have to find another way to get someone else's money for your pet little projects
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Nope.

Not even close.
 
Tigerace117 said:
The fact that you are spewing misinformation and laughably complaining about people "being imprisoned" when the South went to war literally to preserve slavery, however, is the topic.
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I guess we're done.
 
jonny5 said:
I guess we're done.
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The fact of the matter is that you are crying about Lincoln "imprisoning" people when your beloved Confederates went to war to preserve actual slavery.
 
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