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Trump's Obamacare EO to cost almost 200 billion

Vern

Vern

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So conservatives rail about Obama's EO's and literally foamed at the mouth about deficits the last 8 years. Forget how this is another example of republicans screwing over average Americans, where's the conservative outrage at EOs and increasing the deficit? Is there any issue conservatives cant obediently flip flop on. I would have said "Putin and russia" a year ago but the answer is "no, there is no issue conservatives wont obediently flip flop on". anyhoo

It will raise Obamacare premiums by an estimated 20 percent in 2018, as health plans have to charge more to make up the lost funds. By 2020, premiums would increase 25 percent due to this change.

The Congressional Budget Office estimates that this move will ultimately cost the government $194 billion over the next decade.


https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/13/16467910/trump-obamacare-politics-aca
 
Just to be clear, this isn't the EO. This is his decision to cancel the CSR payments (which he has been publicly signaling he would do for political reasons since at least April). These two things came within 24 hours of each other and they have the same goal--blowing up the markets--but they are distinct. The EO doesn't actually change anything, though future regs could. The CSR decision has immediate impact. And indeed is already priced in to 2018 premiums. Hence the Trump Premium Spike.

Anyway, this a pretty obvious act of deliberate sabotage by a petulant man-child.

DMHmvbCXcAARlSK.jpg:large
 
Vern said:
So conservatives rail about Obama's EO's and literally foamed at the mouth about deficits the last 8 years. Forget how this is another example of republicans screwing over average Americans, where's the conservative outrage at EOs and increasing the deficit? Is there any issue conservatives cant obediently flip flop on. I would have said "Putin and russia" a year ago but the answer is "no, there is no issue conservatives wont obediently flip flop on". anyhoo

It will raise Obamacare premiums by an estimated 20 percent in 2018, as health plans have to charge more to make up the lost funds. By 2020, premiums would increase 25 percent due to this change.

The Congressional Budget Office estimates that this move will ultimately cost the government $194 billion over the next decade.


https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/10/13/16467910/trump-obamacare-politics-aca
Click to expand...

Obamacare will be dead and gone long before that decade goes by, so no...this will NOT cost the government almost $200 billion.
 
What is wrong with the decision of President Trump? He has said that unless the Congress appropriates the money for this, his administration will not issue the payments. Now it is up to the Congress to do the job, as it is supposed to do. Since there are many Republicans that do not want to be on the side of saving the PPACA (Obamacare), then the Democrats are going to have to bring something to the table. This is going to take bipartisanship.

As for challenges in the courts? It is really hard to say that President Trump's actions on not paying the subsidies is unconstitutional but President Obama's paying them was constitutional.
 
With the latest Trump ACA sabotage, insurers have now upped the 2018 premiums in Mississippi by a whopping 45%.

Trumpcare is on the way folks.
 
Southern Dad said:
As for challenges in the courts? It is really hard to say that President Trump's actions on not paying the subsidies is unconstitutional but President Obama's paying them was constitutional.
Click to expand...

Trump has been paying the subsidies. Every month for the past nine months.

And in that time he hasn't sought an appropriation, nor has Congress provided one. Literally nothing has substantively changed between next month and this month that would justify this abrupt action.

Oh, except open enrollment beginning. Never miss a chance to screw people! It's the Trump way.
 
Greenbeard said:
Trump has been paying the subsidies. Every month for the past nine months.

And in that time he hasn't sought an appropriation, nor has Congress provided one. Literally nothing has substantively changed between next month and this month that would justify this abrupt action.

Oh, except open enrollment beginning. Never miss a chance to screw people! It's the Trump way.
Click to expand...

Why do you support tax payer bailouts for the evil rich insurance companies? I thought that was antithetical to modern progressivism. :shrug:
 
Mycroft said:
Obamacare will be dead and gone long before that decade goes by, so no...this will NOT cost the government almost $200 billion.
Click to expand...

It's sort of beside the point. He took an action that will increase deficits and increase the premiums ordinary people pay on the exchanges, in an act of spite and sabotage. It hurts real people and accomplishes no other goal than to blow up the ACA exchanges.
 
countryboy said:
Why do you support tax payer bailouts for the evil rich insurance companies? I thought that was antithetical to modern progressivism. :shrug:
Click to expand...

Why do you support 20% premium hikes and higher deductibles? I thought that was antithetical to modern conservatism.
 
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countryboy said:
Why do you support tax payer bailouts for the evil rich insurance companies? I thought that was antithetical to modern progressivism. :shrug:
Click to expand...

The CSR payments are not a bailout of insurers.

1) The law requires insurers to make the payments, AND
2) The law promises to repay them dollar for dollar for those payments.

Not a bailout. The insurers are just a vehicle to deliver subsidies to low income people on the exchanges. The feds could make those payments directly to several million people OR make things much simpler by using insurance companies to deliver those subsidies and only making a relative handful to those insurers, versus millions of payments to every low income person on the exchanges.
 
Greenbeard said:
Trump has been paying the subsidies. Every month for the past nine months.

And in that time he hasn't sought an appropriation, nor has Congress provided one. Literally nothing has substantively changed between next month and this month that would justify this abrupt action.

Oh, except open enrollment beginning. Never miss a chance to screw people! It's the Trump way.
Click to expand...

Yes, I am well aware. He is the President. Now, he has made it clear that he will not be paying the next payment without an appropriation. The Democrats and Republicans in the Congress have the opportunity to come together and pass one, or not. Keep in mind, THIS is the danger of doing things through executive actions and going around the legislative branch. Sooner or later, your party may not be in control.
 
Southern Dad said:
Yes, I am well aware. He is the President. Now, he has made it clear that he will not be paying the next payment without an appropriation. The Democrats and Republicans in the Congress have the opportunity to come together and pass one, or not. Keep in mind, THIS is the danger of doing things through executive actions and going around the legislative branch. Sooner or later, your party may not be in control.
Click to expand...

The dangers of an incompetent moron sitting in the Oval Office are myriad, no doubt.
 
Greenbeard said:
The dangers of an incompetent moron sitting in the Oval Office are myriad, no doubt.
Click to expand...

Incompetent? He beat over a dozen opponents including the best qualified candidate to ever run for the office. Let's face it, he's doing everything that he can to keep his campaign promises. This should not be a surprise to anyone. When the Republicans failed to end the PPACA, President Trump looked for a new way to force this issue back to the Congress. He found it.
 
Southern Dad said:
Incompetent? He beat over a dozen opponents including the best qualified candidate to ever run for the office. Let's face it, he's doing everything that he can to keep his campaign promises. This should not be a surprise to anyone. When the Republicans failed to end the PPACA, President Trump looked for a new way to force this issue back to the Congress. He found it.
Click to expand...

He imposed massive premium increases, many of the worst of them falling on areas that supported him. And he did it on purpose.

Can you point me to where he promised to do that?
 
countryboy said:
Why do you support tax payer bailouts for the evil rich insurance companies? I thought that was antithetical to modern progressivism. :shrug:
Click to expand...

CB, they aren't "bailouts to insurance companies". Insurance companies are being reimbursed for the subsidies they are required to provide. Who knows if your post is based on ignorance or dishonesty but neither is a quality to be proud of.
 
Southern Dad said:
Incompetent? He beat over a dozen opponents including the best qualified candidate to ever run for the office. Let's face it, he's doing everything that he can to keep his campaign promises. This should not be a surprise to anyone. When the Republicans failed to end the PPACA, President Trump looked for a new way to force this issue back to the Congress. He found it.
Click to expand...

SD, you should educate yourself on what he promised instead of just assuming he promised to drive up prices and screw people over. He kinda promised the opposite.

6 promises Trump has made about health care - POLITICO
 
Greenbeard said:
He imposed massive premium increases, many of the worst of them falling on areas that supported him. And he did it on purpose.

Can you point me to where he promised to do that?
Click to expand...

He promised to end the PPACA. This is a step toward that. Now the Congress can, of course, allocate the funding for these subsidy payments. It would take bipartisanship.
 
Greenbeard said:
Why do you support 20% premium hikes and higher deductibles? I thought that was antithetical to modern conservatism.
Click to expand...
Do you really want to pretend this piece of **** dumpster fire of a 'health care plan' wasnt ****ed the moment Obama put pen to paper and signed it? Or that people havent already been getting wrecked by this rat passed Obamination for the last 6 years?
 
Greenbeard said:
Why do you support 20% premium hikes and higher deductibles? I thought that was antithetical to modern conservatism.
Click to expand...

I support liberty. I also don't buy into the leftist loonery propaganda being regurgitated by liberal drones. :roll:
 
JasperL said:
It's sort of beside the point. He took an action that will increase deficits and increase the premiums ordinary people pay on the exchanges, in an act of spite and sabotage. It hurts real people and accomplishes no other goal than to blow up the ACA exchanges.
Click to expand...

He also took action that give people an option to the excessive-premium exchange, so they won't suffer from those increased premiums. And when more and more people abandon the exchange, Obamacare dies and deficits decrease. Blowing up the exchange is a good thing.

But that COULD have been avoided if Congress had done their job for the American People. They didn't, so Trump did.
 
Mycroft said:
He also took action that give people an option to the excessive-premium exchange, so they won't suffer from those increased premiums. And when more and more people abandon the exchange, Obamacare dies and deficits decrease. Blowing up the exchange is a good thing.
Click to expand...

Group coverage costs more than exchange coverage. Blowing up the exchanges to try and move everyone into group plans is idiotic.
 
Southern Dad said:
He promised to end the PPACA. This is a step toward that. Now the Congress can, of course, allocate the funding for these subsidy payments. It would take bipartisanship.
Click to expand...
oooooo SD, I see you're still cherry picking the promises Trump made. He didn't promise to sabotage Obamacare and drive up the prices. He promised something better. This is not better.
 
VanceMack said:
Do you really want to pretend this piece of **** dumpster fire of a 'health care plan' wasnt ****ed the moment Obama put pen to paper and signed it? Or that people havent already been getting wrecked by this rat passed Obamination for the last 6 years?
Click to expand...

oh vance. still clinging to conservative narratives. If Obamacare was "*****ed" 7 years ago, how come trump has to sabotage it. and that's on top of the republican sabotage. See, when you try to see the world only through the delusional prism of conservative narratives you always going to look foolish. And who's been "wrecked" by Obamacare. 20 million people are enjoying health insurance. All of America is enjoying a lower deficit and higher quality care. America is also enjoying the surge in small busineseses and lower health care inflation.
 
Mycroft said:
He also took action that give people an option to the excessive-premium exchange, so they won't suffer from those increased premiums. And when more and more people abandon the exchange, Obamacare dies and deficits decrease. Blowing up the exchange is a good thing.

But that COULD have been avoided if Congress had done their job for the American People. They didn't, so Trump did.
Click to expand...

And I'd perhaps support Trump if Trump had a plan in the wings that improves on the ACA, but he doesn't, and the GOP don't. There is no plan at all that's an alternative to ACA. And so far what the GOP proposed would make things FAR worse overall, which is why their efforts so far were slightly less popular than STDs and roaches.

It's tough to think of an equivalent. Maybe given Trump's former job, like blowing up a building with millions of existing inhabitants and promising them that he hopes in a year or two or three maybe he'll get around to building a new one, but in the meantime they're on the hook for their old rent plus alternative arrangements. BRILLIANT!
 
The payments were never legal. Only someone with TDS would say not paying private insurance companies billions of dollars is costing money.
 
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