I dislike liberal arrogance

BitterPill said:

The obviously not-so-moderate Moderate Right denies Trump uses racist and bigoted language.

That tells us a lot, and remember that with Trump supporters actions speak much louder than words since their words cannot be trusted. They are Trump supporters after all.

Click to expand...

Please give us examples that aren't your twisted opinions or things taken out of context.

Rich123 said:

Ya The Mexican Judge comment wasn't racist. They are letting in all these Mexican Rapist and Murders. Having (Pepe') the frog as your meme isn't racist. Saying "I don't want Black people counting my money, I want short white guys wearing Yamilkas counting my money." Your right, nothing racist here.:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Click to expand...

He said some of them are rapists and murderers and immediately afterward said that some were good people. That's just a fact, not racist.

Rich123 said:

y
Ya and certainly you can't count as racist, "I grab them by their *****'s and get away with it, because I'm a star." This whole thing about being racist and an asshole is just left wing propaganda. Why can't you see that? Well at least that last statement wasn't racist. So there!

Click to expand...

First of all that is a comment made in private, bragging about something that may have never happened and it has never been proven to have happened. Second of all, that is not racist.

BitterPill said:

If anyone ever accuses you of being a white-nationalist, I've got their back.

Click to expand...

Of course you do, because you are a member of the fake news campaign.

CriticalThought said:

This is one area I can agree with the populist right wing about and for which I hope against hope that the leftist and progressive movements can do some soul searching about in the coming months. The reason so many independent voters who fall in the working poor and middle class are fed up with liberals is the elitism and PC culture that has permeated the movement. Liberals used to calmly embrace the nuance and ambiguity of complex sociopolitical issues like race, religion, and civil rights but now many seem as dogmatic as the religious right and intolerant of views that do not perfectly coincide with their own. They are now often the people who sue bakers who won't make a cake for a gay wedding when they can just use another baker or call someone a "racist" because they support law enforcement over violent protesters.

Click to expand...

You call it arrogance. We call it sanity and reason. Those fascist in their beliefs call others that challenge their worldview, "arrogant". Given the source, I'll have no trouble living with that.

BitterPill said:

You defend Trump's racism and bigotry: cut-and-dried.

Click to expand...

It's not cut and dried when you can't prove the racism even exists. It's just your partisan opinion based on facts you twist to your advantage.

BitterPill said:

You are doing it again.



The example is you defending Trump's bigoted and racist comments, and you do so regularly it seems.

Click to expand...

Where is your proof that he is racist or bigoted in the first place? You've been asked numerous times and all you can do is attack others based on zero evidence.

lurchadams said:

You call it arrogance. We call it sanity and reason. Those fascist in their beliefs call others that challenge their worldview, "arrogant". Given the source, I'll have no trouble living with that.

Click to expand...

Challenging is not the problem, lack of listening and lack of willingness to listen is.

Hawkeye10 said:

Challenging is not the problem, lack of listening and lack of willingness to listen is.

Click to expand...

Considering the source is a major factor when considering whether or not to listen. For example, I would not attend a white supremacist rally to hear what the speakers are going to say. There is nothing they would have to say that could tempt my interest.

I also have trouble listening to those who do nothing but spew pretentious, pseudo-intellectual word salad. I think you know of whom I'm speaking here.

Moderate Right said:

First of all that is a comment made in private, bragging about something that may have never happened and it has never been proven to have happened. Second of all, that is not racist.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, that old fall back position - "it's never been proven" yet there are numerous women who have accused Trump of molestation.

A lot of women just accused Donald Trump of sexual assault.It turns out that when Trump told Anderson Cooper at the second presidential debate that he had never acted on his “locker room talk,” several women watching at home pointed at the screen and said, “Liar.” They included, according to The New York Times, Jessica Leeds and Rachel Crooks, who say Trump groped and kissed them, respectively, without their consent. Also Mindy McGillivray, who told The Palm Beach Post that Trump groped her at his Mar-a-Lago resort in Florida some 13 years ago.

Meanwhile, Yahoo reports that Cassandra Searles, who competed in the 2013 Miss USA pageant, said on Facebook that Trump “continually grabbed my ass.” CBS has uncovered footage from 1992 of Trump surveying a group of 10-year-olds participating in a Christmas television feature and declaring of one of them, “I am going to be dating her in 10 years. Can you believe it?”

Click to expand...

Following the Weinstein debacle, the women who have accused Trump of similar actions wonder why nothing has been done.

Almost a year after New Yorker Jessica Leeds and other women stepped forward with harrowing accounts of being sexually assaulted by a powerful man, another scandal with similar elements exploded.

Only this time, the punishment was swift and devastating.

"It is hard to reconcile that Harvey Weinstein could be brought down with this, and [President Donald] Trump just continues to be the Teflon Don," said Leeds, who claims she was groped 30 years ago on a plane by the man whose presence she cannot escape now that he sits in the Oval Office.

In Florida, Melinda McGillivray, was having much the same reaction.

"What pisses me off is that the guy is president," McGillivray, who a year ago went public with allegations that Trump grabbed her at Mar-a-Lago in 2003 when she was 23. "It's that simple."

Leeds and McGillivray were among the 11 women who came forward in the 2016 campaign to accuse the then-Republican presidential candidate of unwanted touching or kissing. Trump called the charges "pure fiction" and referred to the women as "horrible, horrible liars."

Their claims did not stop the celebrity real estate titan on his climb to the most powerful office in the world.

Click to expand...

I would think the rational might wonder why "Trump has never followed through with his vow to sue his accusers or produce the "substantial evidence" he said would refute their claims." One response by Trump to accusations has been really classy - in typical Trumpian fashion. "Believe me: She would not be my first choice. That I can tell you"

Maybe, I say again - Maybe - we will learn something in a couple weeks

Trump's pushback led one of his accusers, Summer Zervos, a former contestant on Trump's reality television show, "The Apprentice," to file a defamation lawsuit against him three days before he took the oath of office.

Zervos first appeared weeks before the election at a news conference with her attorney, Gloria Allred, and accused Trump of aggressively kissing her and groping her breasts during a 2007 meeting that took place when she was seeking a job at his company.
(. . .)
The next brief is due on Oct. 31, and sometime after that, a judge in New York state, where the suit was filed, is expected to rule on whether the case will proceed.

History suggests that an ongoing court case could be perilous for a sitting president.

Click to expand...

Somerville said:

Ah yes, that old fall back position - "it's never been proven" yet there are numerous women who have accused Trump of molestation.



Following the Weinstein debacle, the women who have accused Trump of similar actions wonder why nothing has been done.

I would think the rational might wonder why "Trump has never followed through with his vow to sue his accusers or produce the "substantial evidence" he said would refute their claims." One response by Trump to accusations has been really classy - in typical Trumpian fashion. "Believe me: She would not be my first choice. That I can tell you"

Maybe, I say again - Maybe - we will learn something in a couple weeks

Click to expand...

Please show the proof of Trump ever being found guilty of molesting anyone. How about a payoff? Do you even see even one settlement regarding it?

Moderate Right said:

Please show the proof of Trump ever being found guilty of molesting anyone. How about a payoff? Do you even see even one settlement regarding it?

Click to expand...

Has Harvey Weinstein been found guilty of molestation? So, without a court finding him guilty, you are willing to believe that all of the women accusing Trump of sexual assault are little more than self-seeking "Demorat" lackeys?

Somerville said:

Has Harvey Weinstein been found guilty of molestation? So, without a court finding him guilty, you are willing to believe that all of the women accusing Trump of sexual assault are little more than self-seeking "Demorat" lackeys?

Click to expand...

Actually, this is America and in America you are innocent until proven guilty. We do know, however, that Bill Clinton made payouts to women who have accused him and we do know that he lied about his affair with Monica Lewisnsky and faced impeachment as a result of it. Do you have any proof that Trump made payments to anyone? Anyone at all? Is Trump facing impeachment or anything else connected to possible female accusers? Are you saying you would rather have the Clintons back in the White House instead of Trump?

Moderate Right said:

Actually, this is America and in America you are innocent until proven guilty. We do know, however, that Bill Clinton made payouts to women who have accused him and we do know that he lied about his affair with Monica Lewisnsky and faced impeachment as a result of it. Do you have any proof that Trump made payments to anyone? Anyone at all? Is Trump facing impeachment or anything else connected to possible female accusers? Are you saying you would rather have the Clintons back in the White House instead of Trump?

Click to expand...

Yes, an accused person is innocent until proven guilty. Bringing up Bill Clinton is irrelevant and little more than an attempted diversion, he is not the President. Do you have any proof that Trump has not made payments to anyone? Is Trump facing impeachment? Possibly. Is that possibility related to women accusing him of sexual assault or harrassment? No. Yes, i would prefer the Clintons to Trump.

The Case for Impeaching Donald Trump Is Real and Serious. Here’s Why.

An impeachable offense is a crime against the Constitution, or the body politic—as Alexander Hamilton said, “injuries done immediately to the society itself.” Impeachment isn’t a process by which an established set of principles is enforced. There’s no tablet to be taken down from on high and followed; there’s no code of offenses for which a president can be charged. There are precedents, but they’re not binding, which is a good thing. Two of the previous impeachments, of Presidents Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton, were essentially partisan exercises that fell short of the needed Senate votes. On the other hand, Richard Nixon would have been impeached and convicted had he not given up the presidency to avoid that fate (and to hold on to his pension). The proceeding against Nixon in effect succeeded because it was serious and bipartisan. Whether such a formation is possible in today’s politics is questionable, but as the Republicans get increasingly worried about Trump, a bipartisan move against him becomes less far-fetched than has been widely assumed.

Obstruction of Justice.

Accepting Foreign Emoluments.

Abuse of the Ethics Rules.

Lying to the Public.

Refusal to Release Tax Returns as President. This charge, like some others, may not stand on its own in impeachment proceedings, but could be part of a combination of charges that Trump puts his private interest over that of the public.

A Report by the Special Counsel to Congress That the President Has Committed Crimes.

Click to expand...

4 (And maybe 5) Grounds to Impeach Trump

First, in taking the oath of office, a president promises to “faithfully execute the laws & the constitution.” That’s Article II Section 2.

Second, Article I Section 9 of the Constitution forbids government officials from taking things of value from foreign governments. (emoluments)

Third: The 1st Amendment to the Constitution bars any law “respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.”

Fourth: The 1st Amendment also bars “abridging the freedom of the press.”

A fifth possible ground if the evidence is there: Article II Section 3 of the Constitution defines “treason against the United States” as “adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort.”

Click to expand...

How's that for "Liberal arrogance"?

Somerville said:

Yes, an accused person is innocent until proven guilty. Bringing up Bill Clinton is irrelevant and little more than an attempted diversion, he is not the President. Do you have any proof that Trump has not made payments to anyone? Is Trump facing impeachment? Possibly. Is that possibility related to women accusing him of sexual assault or harrassment? No. Yes, i would prefer the Clintons to Trump.





How's that for "Liberal arrogance"?

Click to expand...

Now, how can I come up with any evidence that Trump didn't pay anyone off? I also can't prove that he hasn't murdered anyone either. This is what YOU brought up. The burden of proof is on you and you have none.

Absentglare said:

Nobody claimed that.

Click to expand...

If you are advocating for a popular vote to elect the president, you are giving control to the 9 most populous states, as they make up just over 50% of the total U.S. population. That's unfair to the other 41 states.

What you are also not thinking about is the fact that you would be allowing politicians to pander to only the most populous states (CA, TX, FL, NY, etc) and completely ignore the smaller states (WY, WI, WV, VT, etc.)
Our states (and the people residing in them) are very diverse and have different wants/needs/etc... For example, the Rust Belt states cared a lot about creating jobs because their manufacturing jobs have been in steady decline for many many years, so they decided to vote for Trump because they felt that he would be a better president for one of the things they cared about most (manufacturing jobs) [WI, MI, PA, IN, etc. etc.]... With a popular vote deciding who wins, these Rust Belt states would have had absolutely zero voice, because even if the other 30 some less populated states joined up with them, the top 9 most populous states would still have the majority (assuming voting turnout percentages would be similar in each state, and they probably would be in the case of a popular vote). The electoral college is actually a more fair way to elect presidents if you really think about it from a different angle besides "everybody's votes count, more people wanted this than that" etc...

President Elect - Articles - Why the Electoral College is better for America than direct elections (this site further explains what I've briefly mentioned)
Why We Use Electoral College, Not Popular Vote

CriticalThought said:

This is one area I can agree with the populist right wing about and for which I hope against hope that the leftist and progressive movements can do some soul searching about in the coming months. The reason so many independent voters who fall in the working poor and middle class are fed up with liberals is the elitism and PC culture that has permeated the movement. Liberals used to calmly embrace the nuance and ambiguity of complex sociopolitical issues like race, religion, and civil rights but now many seem as dogmatic as the religious right and intolerant of views that do not perfectly coincide with their own. They are now often the people who sue bakers who won't make a cake for a gay wedding when they can just use another baker or call someone a "racist" because they support law enforcement over violent protesters.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, arrogance...brings back a memory from back in the mid 60's...with stops in Europe on my way to landing in Africa for a year...the general view from the outside world was that we Americans are arrogant so I submit that the view is not new and has been around for years...and one that could be argued from either side of the political divide.

More recent inquiry regarding how others around the world view Americans...just one persons answer...someone who has lived in numerous countries in recent history..."They think you're wrong."

Food for thought...when you point a finger, look at your hand...there are generally three pointing back.

Arrogance in America today?

Seems to me when the climate is such that KKK and other sorts feel free to go without hoods...that's getting a bit arrogant...hardly what I'd call from the liberal side of the isle...is that the ignorance you prefer?

The kind of fine folks that Trump base are obviously a part of...granted, not all...but at what point do folks draw the line...I confess my prediction came about two weeks late but it's getting entertaining now...some are catching on.

More importantly...Trump has picked a battle he cannot win...cheap entertainment to me...the cost will be much greater to many more, including most on this Discussion Forum.

eace

Moderate Right said:

Where is your proof that he is racist or bigoted in the first place? You've been asked numerous times and all you can do is attack others based on zero evidence.

Click to expand...

The proof is in Trump's words and actions.

Now the question is why you defend a bigoted racist?

I have an idea.

BitterPill said:

The proof is in Trump's words and actions.

Now the question is why you defend a bigoted racist?

I have an idea.

Click to expand...

You have been asked numerous times and you still can't prove that Trump IS a bigoted racist. Why do you continue when you can't even prove it?

Moderate Right said:

You have been asked numerous times and you still can't prove that Trump IS a bigoted racist. Why do you continue when you can't even prove it?

Click to expand...

This is not about what is. It is all about emotional mud throwing.

BitterPill said:

The proof is in Trump's words and actions.

Now the question is why you defend a bigoted racist?

I have an idea.

Click to expand...

I haven’t seen anything that shows him to be a bigoted racist. It would also be atypical for the social group he grew up with. Rich New Yorkers mostly have other things in mind.

joG said:

This is not about what is. It is all about emotional mud throwing.

Click to expand...

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. If you are saying that Trump is guilty of emotional mud throwing then I totally agree. If you are saying the left is guilty of emotional mud throwing I would also totally agree. My post was directed at BitterPill, who is constantly claiming that Trump is a racist bigot and yet when asked numerous times to prove it, he can't and won't. So, I'll take your post to mean that both Trump and BitterPill are guilty of emotional mud throwing.

Moderate Right said:

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. If you are saying that Trump is guilty of emotional mud throwing then I totally agree. If you are saying the left is guilty of emotional mud throwing I would also totally agree. My post was directed at BitterPill, who is constantly claiming that Trump is a racist bigot and yet when asked numerous times to prove it, he can't and won't. So, I'll take your post to mean that both Trump and BitterPill are guilty of emotional mud throwing.

Click to expand...

Most folks that emotionally call people racist bigots, it is not the truth they are interested in. It is the good feeling it gives them or the hope that some of the dirt will stick.

joG said:

Moderate Right said:

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by that. If you are saying that Trump is guilty of emotional mud throwing then I totally agree. If you are saying the left is guilty of emotional mud throwing I would also totally agree. My post was directed at BitterPill, who is constantly claiming that Trump is a racist bigot and yet when asked numerous times to prove it, he can't and won't. So, I'll take your post to mean that both Trump and BitterPill are guilty of emotional mud throwing.

Click to expand...

Most folks that emotionally call people racist bigots, it is not the truth they are interested in. It is the good feeling it gives them or the hope that some of the dirt will stick.

Click to expand...

Just a couple examples for Trump defenders to peruse and then attempt to make their best efforts in defence of the man.

Is Donald Trump Racist? Here's What the Record Shows
Next in the Trump record on race came a 1991 book by John O’Donnell, who had been president of Trump Plaza Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City. O’Donnell quoted Trump saying,“ Black guys counting my money! I hate it. The only kind of people I want counting my money are short guys wearing yarmulkes… Those are the only kind of people I want counting my money. Nobody else…Besides that, I tell you something else. I think that’s guy’s lazy. And it’s probably not his fault because laziness is a trait in blacks.”

Click to expand...

Trump's Long History of Racism
Though it's technically true that no one but Donald Trump knows what's in Donald Trump's heart, he's given us some pretty good clues. He likely thinks swastika-toting Nazis and hood-wearing KKK members are bad guys – those are the easy targets everyone knows we're supposed to denounce – but the entitled, clean-cut, polo-wearing, torch-bearing racists chanting about how they won't be replaced? Those are the people who put him into office. They're his people. And they know he's their leader because they know Donald Trump is, like they are, racist.

Oh, they wouldn't put it that way. They think the real racism is the affirmative action that gives people of color a chance in a world that hands people who look like me privilege from birth. They believe the real racists are the ones who declare black lives matter. ("What, ours don't?") But like the president they cheer, they're racist as hell.

Click to expand...

Is President Trump a 'textbook racist'?
In a Los Angeles Times op-ed article, Duke University public policy professor Jay A. Pearson lays out the academic case for calling Trump a “textbook racist”:

As a professor who researches and teaches courses on the health effects of race, racism and inequality, I can assure you that the president’s defenders are wrong. Trump is a racist. What he says and does meets the scholarly definition of the term.

Broadly speaking, a racist combines negative prejudicial biases with sufficient power to leverage action against targeted groups. Trump’s words and behaviors demonstrate considerable prejudicial bias, and, as president of the United States — arguably the most powerful office in the contemporary world — he has indeed leveraged action against various groups.

Racism is predicated on belief in the scientifically discredited concept of biological race.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Captain America said:

Yup.

Same here.

They yanked my conservative card for pointing out all that rightwing fake news propaganda. Well, that, and the fact that I don't believe that all these hurricanes as of late are the fault of the homosexuals. LOL!

Click to expand...

Hahahahah awesome!
and Yes I'm glad to point out fake news propaganda when I see it. What sucks is there really isnt any media out there that just leans right, most of it is center, center left, extreme left, extreme right