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54% think Trump did it with Russians

Moderate Right said:
You say the same things over and over and they have already been refuted over and over by many different posters. I refuse to talk about the same thing over and over again. You, however, believe that if you continue spewing the same garbage enough times that the others give up on you, then you have won the debate. I'm not playing that game.
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Take one thing I said that you claim has been "refuted" and produce it here along with the evidence of refutation.

You cannot do so.

You will not do so.
 
haymarket said:
Take one thing I said that you claim has been "refuted" and produce it here along with the evidence of refutation.

You cannot do so.

You will not do so.
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Nope, I won't do so because you have been refuted over and over and over and over again and I refuse to play on the merry-go-round with you. In fact, you rarely actually post anything that is evidence of anything to actually refute. All you do is post opinions and the facts are always right around the corner or "but the investigation isn't over yet. The evidence is coming".
 
haymarket said:
Take one thing I said that you claim has been "refuted" and produce it here along with the evidence of refutation.

You cannot do so.

You will not do so.
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you called it!
 
Moderate Right said:
Nope, I won't do so because you have been refuted over and over and over and over again and I refuse to play on the merry-go-round with you. In fact, you rarely actually post anything that is evidence of anything to actually refute. All you do is post opinions and the facts are always right around the corner or "but the investigation isn't over yet. The evidence is coming".
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Nice to see you shrink like a fragile flower in a stiff gale yet again from the challenge to put up or shut up. You are nothing if not consistent in your inability to back up your claims about me. Glad to see nothing has changed on that front.
 
Captain Adverse said:
I am not surprised. :shrug:



and...



Joseph Goebbels

The MSM has been pounding this narrative almost from the date Trump was elected.

Most people get their opinions from watching TV.

When the news, talk shows, and pundit talking heads keep repeating a narrative over and over...the herd begins to listen and believe.

Still no evidence of collusion...cue the "investigation is just getting started" responses. :coffeepap:
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Dude, are you kidding me?

I have been extremely critical on the DNC (and they are an awful institution!) for using this as a deflection and a shield for how terrible they are. I think Hillary ran a horrible campaign and she deserves 100% of the blame apportionment. I think that Russia story is hyped up by an overzealous media establishment that wants nothing more than to tear Trump down because he took their toys away from them, and now they're pissed. But, honestly, what the hell do you think this means?

Person claiming to have Russian connections: “[... ] the crown prosecutor of Russia [wants to provide] the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father [...] This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support for Mr Trump. [...]”

Donald Trump's campaign: “If it’s what you say, I love it, especially later in the summer.”​

You can't seriously pretend like this didn't happen. It did. At this point, the Trump campaign's defense is that they happened to not find a real Russian cut-out to collude with. But if she ended up being a real Russian cut-out with real (probably illegally obtained) information, the Trump campaign would have taken it and, by every appearance, would have used it. You can't just shrug that off. Maybe he didn't end up colluding with Russia, but at this point that wouldn't have been because of Trump's moral objections to working with a foreign government during an American election. Having the meeting in the first place was massive ethics violation, and that should be obvious to everyone.
 
haymarket said:
Nice to see you shrink like a fragile flower in a stiff gale yet again from the challenge to put up or shut up. You are nothing if not consistent in your inability to back up your claims about me. Glad to see nothing has changed on that front.
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Everyone knows you are an uber partisan. To deny it is just plain silly.
 
Moderate Right said:
Everyone knows you are an uber partisan. To deny it is just plain silly.
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Name calling does NOTHING to prove your claims about my past arguments and their refutation.

here was your claim

Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
You say the same things over and over and they have already been refuted over and over by many different posters.
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I challenged you to present evidence of this boast. You were impotent to do so and came right out and said you would not do so.
 
haymarket said:
Name calling does NOTHING to prove your claims about my past arguments and their refutation.

here was your claim



I challenged you to present evidence of this boast. You were impotent to do so and came right out and said you would not do so.
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You haven't had any arguments. Don't you remember, the evidence is right around the corner? The investigations aren't finished yet. Yadda Yadda Yadda. You got nothin so there is nothing to refute.
 
Moderate Right said:
You haven't had any arguments. Don't you remember, the evidence is right around the corner? The investigations aren't finished yet. Yadda Yadda Yadda. You got nothin so there is nothing to refute.
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A quick search of my posts would show you that I have made thousands of arguments here.


Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
You say the same things over and over and they have already been refuted over and over by many different posters.
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Pick one. Show where it was refuted.
 
haymarket said:
A quick search of my posts would show you that I have made thousands of arguments here.





Pick one. Show where it was refuted.
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That's just it. An argument is just an argument. I could argue the Earth is flat, doesn't mean it is. Arguments aren't proof of anything. You can't refute someone's opinion. An opinion is just an opinion and you've got a boatload of uber partisan opinions and no proof of anything because the proof is always just around the corner because the investigations aren't over yet. If your side has it's way the investigations will go on forever, no matter how long no proof ever emerges because that's the left's partisan game plan of resistance.
 
Moderate Right said:
That's just it. An argument is just an argument. I could argue the Earth is flat, doesn't mean it is. Arguments aren't proof of anything. You can't refute someone's opinion. An opinion is just an opinion and you've got a boatload of uber partisan opinions and no proof of anything because the proof is always just around the corner because the investigations aren't over yet. If your side has it's way the investigations will go on forever, no matter how long no proof ever emerges because that's the left's partisan game plan of resistance.
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Here is what you previously said that I called you on

Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
You say the same things over and over and they have already been refuted over and over by many different posters.
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So lets see what I said that has " already been refuted over and over by many different posters."

You are impotent to back up your claims and your response proves it.
 
haymarket said:
your obvious contempt for the intelligence of you fellow Americans is noted.
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I can recognize a weakness without feeling contempt for it.

I would prefer that Americans were less accepting of the jingles and manipulations of the ad makers, but the fact remains, we are a pretty moldable group.

Back when cigarettes were advertised on TV, Salem had one of the most successful campaigns in history. They were selling an overpriced product polluted the air, made everybody literally stink and that killed people.

However, when the commercial came on that sang the first part of their famous jingle, "You can take Salem out of the country, but..."

The entire country merrily sang the end of the jingle for them: "You can't take the country out of Salem!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Tn6pNumZok
 
code1211 said:
I can recognize a weakness without feeling contempt for it.

I would prefer that Americans were less accepting of the jingles and manipulations of the ad makers, but the fact remains, we are a pretty moldable group.

Back when cigarettes were advertised on TV, Salem had one of the most successful campaigns in history. They were selling an overpriced product polluted the air, made everybody literally stink and that killed people.

However, when the commercial came on that sang the first part of their famous jingle, "You can take Salem out of the country, but..."

The entire country merrily sang the end of the jingle for them: "You can't take the country out of Salem!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Tn6pNumZok
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What year was that Salem commercial? I am 68 and I don't remember it.

I watched the video and vaguely recall the tune but not the visuals. The one I remember is LSMFT because as kids we had another meaning for it referring to breasts and we all thought it was hilarious.I think the brand was Lucky Strikes which was suppose to be really hard core like Camels.
 
haymarket said:
What year was that Salem commercial? I am 68 and I don't remember it.

I watched the video and vaguely recall the tune but not the visuals. The one I remember is LSMFT because as kids we had another meaning for it referring to breasts and we all thought it was hilarious.I think the brand was Lucky Strikes which was suppose to be really hard core like Camels.
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I don't recall the year of the ad, but we did study it in school as a very successful campaign. It's in color, so probably later 60's...

Lsmft was another interesting campaign:

"Lucky separates the men from the boys- But not from the girls.

Greatest taste that you can buy, LSMFT is why!"

Those jingles were definitely mind worms.
 
code1211 said:
I don't recall the year of the ad, but we did study it in school as a very successful campaign. It's in color, so probably later 60's...

Lsmft was another interesting campaign:

"Lucky separates the men from the boys- But not from the girls.

Greatest taste that you can buy, LSMFT is why!"

Those jingles were definitely mind worms.
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Great stuff. I think Virginia Slims probably was the most successful campaign of all since it expanded the market to women much more than it was.

I was not around in the 40's but those ads featuring doctors plugging smokes must have been amazing.
 
haymarket said:
Great stuff. I think Virginia Slims probably was the most successful campaign of all since it expanded the market to women much more than it was.

I was not around in the 40's but those ads featuring doctors plugging smokes must have been amazing.
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I wasn't either. I think many pro athletes were hawking the things as well.

At that time, the hard livin', hard drinkin' Bogart/John Wayne/Spencer Tracy everyman was the ideal.

Now, everything from Sunlight to milk is pointed to as the bane of our existence.

Times change...
 
haymarket said:
A new poll of the American people shows that 54% of Americans believe Donald Trump either did something illegal or unethical involving the Russians. That is a clear majority of the American people.

New poll: 54% of Americans think Trump's dealings with Russia were unethical or illegal | PBS NewsHour



And I placed it here because the partisan divide is significant with Dems finding him guilty of one or the other but Republicans feeling he has done nothing wrong.

This poll proves two things to me
1- the majority of Americans realize Trump is crooked and was elected with the help of the Russians and that is wrong or even criminal,
2- Trump is right that his supporters could see him shoot somebody on Fifth Avenue and they would still support him.

I would think the absolute ceiling for belief that Trump is guilty of either a crime or ethics violations is about 65%. So this 54% result shows we have convinced 80% of the public who could be convinced in the first place.

Not good news for Comorade Trumpski. Not good news at all.
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I wonder what the folks will think now? Now that we have Podesta, Fusion GPS, The Clinton Crime Family, Obama and FBI all cluster****ed together in Russian collusion and Uranium One. It seems Mueller and Comey have their dirty fingers on this too.

The Socialist of America Partei (SAPs) have been boot lickers of communists and socialists for more than 50-years. And well, now we learn what we already knew.

I wonder, will the SAPs be calling their own party treasonous?
 
zimmer said:
I wonder what the folks will think now? Now that we have Podesta, Fusion GPS, The Clinton Crime Family, Obama and FBI all cluster****ed together in Russian collusion and Uranium One. It seems Mueller and Comey have their dirty fingers on this too.

The Socialist of America Partei (SAPs) have been boot lickers of communists and socialists for more than 50-years. And well, now we learn what we already knew.

I wonder, will the SAPs be calling their own party treasonous?
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If they are smart - (so we have already ruled out at least half of Trump supporters -) they will recognize the difference between apples and cinderblocks and be able to tell the difference before they break a bunch of teeth biting into that grey pie filling with the nice crust on it.
 
poll says trump has no path to white house. how soon you forget.
 
haymarket said:
If they are smart - (so we have already ruled out at least half of Trump supporters -) they will recognize the difference between apples and cinderblocks and be able to tell the difference before they break a bunch of teeth biting into that grey pie filling with the nice crust on it.
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you mean the real Russia story. yep, we're learning about everyday. the MSM can't stop it. it's out. Dems are the ultimate gaslighters.
 
jc456 said:
you mean the real Russia story. yep, we're learning about everyday. the MSM can't stop it. it's out. Dems are the ultimate gaslighters.
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What are you going on about?
 
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