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If Obamacare is so bad....

fmw said:
It was a waste of time and money. I guess that's a big deal.
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well fmw, now we know why you cut and ran from our discussion of your claim "Obamacare didn't reduce the deficit". If you acknowledge the facts you cant obediently flail and whine at Obamacare. So just to be clear, Obamacare has given 20 million people healthcare coverage, lowered the deficit and improved the quality of care. Whining and flailing doesn't change the facts.
 
Vern said:
well fmw, now we know why you cut and ran from our discussion of your claim "Obamacare didn't reduce the deficit". If you acknowledge the facts you cant obediently flail and whine at Obamacare. So just to be clear, Obamacare has given 20 million people healthcare coverage, lowered the deficit and improved the quality of care. Whining and flailing doesn't change the facts.
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So Vernon what was the number of uninsured prior to ACA? Let's see how intellectually honest you are? How many uninsured now?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
Hot off the presses today.

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Greenbeard said:
Hot off the presses today.

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The truth is these people have worhless insurance they can't use because the deductibles and out of pocket expenses are so high they are afraid to go for medical services. But, for partisan graphs, charts, and other statistics they get counted as people who have insurance who did not have it before Obamacare.
 
Vern said:
well fmw, now we know why you cut and ran from our discussion of your claim "Obamacare didn't reduce the deficit". If you acknowledge the facts you cant obediently flail and whine at Obamacare. So just to be clear, Obamacare has given 20 million people healthcare coverage, lowered the deficit and improved the quality of care. Whining and flailing doesn't change the facts.
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I didn't flail. I didn't whine. I just said you are mistaken.
 
fmw said:
I didn't flail. I didn't whine. I just said you are mistaken.
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Er uh fmw, not that you telling me I was wrong wasn’t a bit whiny but this is the whining and flailing I was talking about.

fmw said:
It was a waste of time and money. I guess that's a big deal.
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What makes it “whining and flailing” is that It was already explained to you that 20 million people gained coverage, it lowers the deficit and improves the quality of care. You cut and run from that discussion because as is usually the case, your narrative is more important than the truth. Here is the perfect example of you cutting and running from a discussion. You posted

fmw said:
It operates the only authorized retail channel for individual policies.
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And how did you respond when I proved that statement to be completely false? you didn’t. You went on your merry way content in the knowledge that “govt in insurance business”, “doesn’t lower the deficit”, “doesn’t improve the quality of care” and “obamacare is the only authorized retail outlet for insurance”. Here’s the best part fmw. If all your “magic” facts are true then that only makes it more hilarious that republicans cant come up with a plan let alone a better plan.
 
Vern said:
Er uh fmw, not that you telling me I was wrong wasn’t a bit whiny but this is the whining and flailing I was talking about.


What makes it “whining and flailing” is that It was already explained to you that 20 million people gained coverage, it lowers the deficit and improves the quality of care. You cut and run from that discussion because as is usually the case, your narrative is more important than the truth. Here is the perfect example of you cutting and running from a discussion. You posted



And how did you respond when I proved that statement to be completely false? you didn’t. You went on your merry way content in the knowledge that “govt in insurance business”, “doesn’t lower the deficit”, “doesn’t improve the quality of care” and “obamacare is the only authorized retail outlet for insurance”. Here’s the best part fmw. If all your “magic” facts are true then that only makes it more hilarious that republicans cant come up with a plan let alone a better plan.
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There is no good plan that involves government involvement. So they will fail just as the democrats did.
 
Moderate Right said:
The truth is these people have worhless insurance they can't use because the deductibles and out of pocket expenses are so high they are afraid to go for medical services. But, for partisan graphs, charts, and other statistics they get counted as people who have insurance who did not have it before Obamacare.
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And yet fewer people are having trouble paying medical bills now than before:

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And according to the National Health Expenditure Accounts growth in out-of-pocket spending has been lower since the ACA passed than it was in the early 2000s.

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Greenbeard said:
And yet fewer people are having trouble paying medical bills now than before:

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And according to the National Health Expenditure Accounts growth in out-of-pocket spending has been lower since the ACA passed than it was in the early 2000s.

2qxwdwh.gif
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You really have a vested interest in ACA for whatever reason. How come you never posted how many people are still uninsured after ACA, how many had their premiums increased, how many lost their doctors and their medical plan? Better yet tell us all how Obama lost the Congress and the WH with such great economic results from ACA?
 
Conservative said:
Keep diverting as you always do, I gave you the reason for ACA
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Your pitiful posts about the reason for ACA are a diversion meant to distract from the rights failure to come up with a plan to replace ACA

Conservative said:
Keep ignoring who brought Medicare into the debate, NOT ME
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Conservative said:
Medicaid was expanded TEMPORARILY and most of those who were added and the left takes credit for with ACA were already eligible for Medicaid. Your program increased cots, did nothing to improve quality, has left over 32 million Americans uninsured, and has bankrupted a number of exchanges showing just how great govt. programs are. Your ideology seems to create total ignorance when it comes to evaluating results. There is a reason the Democrats lost the House in 2010-2012 and lost the Congress in 2014-2016. Maybe if you took the blinders off and stopped listening to the leftwing propaganda you could figure it out. hint, the Obama record isn't what you want to believe
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more pitiful attempts at diversion
 
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Conservative said:
You really have a vested interest in ACA for whatever reason. How come you never posted how many people are still uninsured after ACA, how many had their premiums increased, how many lost their doctors and their medical plan? Better yet tell us all how Obama lost the Congress and the WH with such great economic results from ACA?
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I miss the days before ACA when everyone had insurance, premiums never increased, and everyone could see the doctor of their choice.
 
Moderate Right said:
That's because their deductibles are so high they're not going to the doctor!
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Yes, I remember how those people used to flock to the doctor before ACA, when they had NO insurance at all.

I wonder if the haters ever give more than a moments thought before they post such nonsense
 
sangha said:
Your pitiful posts about the reason for ACA are a diversion meant to distract from the rights failure to come up with a plan to replace ACA





more pitiful attempts at diversion
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You know, this is pretty funny. I never supported ACA and have no problem whatsoever if the GOP doesn't replace it but they will. Trump has been in office over 3 weeks and obviously is a failure to the left but not to those of us who supported him over Hillary. Still waiting for an answer as to how many Americans are still uninsured and how anyone can take victory laps over the implementation and costs of this program
 
sangha said:
I miss the days before ACA when everyone had insurance, premiums never increased, and everyone could see the doctor of their choice.
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So do I, guess the left forgot the purpose of ACA and the promise that if you liked your doctor and your insurance you could keep it, plus the fact that Medicaid existed already
 
Conservative said:
So do I, guess the left forgot the purpose of ACA and the promise that if you liked your doctor and your insurance you could keep it, plus the fact that Medicaid existed already
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er uh Con, I remember the purpose of the ACA. can you explain what you think I'm forgetting. and Medicaid already existing is only news to you.
 
Vern said:
er uh Con, I remember the purpose of the ACA. can you explain what you think I'm forgetting. and Medicaid already existing is only news to you.
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Medicaid existing apparently was unknown to the millions who were eligible and have now signed up helping boost the numbers of insured that you want to take credit for. Guess I am not going to get an answer to how many are still uninsured after years of ACA? Wonder why?
 
Conservative said:
Medicaid existing apparently was unknown to the millions who were eligible and have now signed up helping boost the numbers of insured that you want to take credit for. Guess I am not going to get an answer to how many are still uninsured after years of ACA? Wonder why?
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so thanks to Obamacare they not only learned they were eligible but had a website to guide them and 20 million gained health coverage. whats the point of whining "some could have gotten it without Obamacare"? please elaborate. As far as answering your questions, this is a debate forum not google. Nothing prevents you from a making an honest and intelligent point. But since you don't have one to make you try to make the point "wah wah answer my question?". Its a tiresome tactic dishonest conservatives like yourself often resort to.
 
Vern said:
so thanks to Obamacare they not only learned they were eligible but had a website to guide them and 20 million gained health coverage. whats the point of whining "some could have gotten it without Obamacare"? please elaborate. As far as answering your questions, this is a debate forum not google. Nothing prevents you from a making an honest and intelligent point. But since you don't have one to make you try to make the point "wah wah answer my question?". Its a tiresome tactic dishonest conservatives like yourself often resort to.
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So 20 million gained coverage leaving how many uninsured? You believe getting people to sign up for Medicaid required ACA? You are so easily indoctrinated. I don't have to make a point, Google makes it for me, approximately 30 million remain uninsured and because of ACA people had skyrocketing premiums, lost their coverage, lost their doctors, Obama lost the House, and then lost the Congress and now the Congress and the WH. What is it about those results that make you proud of ACA?
 
Vern said:
Why can’t republicans come up with a better plan? How about a plan? Yea, they’ve had 6 years. We’ve had 3 full years of the exchanges. Certainly there is enough data from that alone to help come up with a plan. it doesn't even have to be a better plan. They can just lie that its better and their base wont hold them accountable. Their base just needs something to repeat over and over. I'm thinking something along the lines of “sure it covers fewer people and costs more but its better because there are no death panels”.

Certainly even some conservatives have to start to wonder how "repeal and replace" got repealed and replaced with "repeal and delay"?
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Obamacare is dying a very slow death. Each year we read where another insurance company or two has pulled out of the exchanges. Aetna and United Health Group are pulling out and Humana has pulled way back and it is just a matter of time before Humana too abandons the ACA altogether. This among the other problems the ACA has.

If I was a Republican, I wouldn't try to repeal or replace it. I would just leave it alone to die of its own accord. Today you have this:

Currently, 29% of Americans say Obamacare has hurt them and their family, up from 26% in May, and the highest Gallup has measured to date. Meanwhile, the percentage who say the ACA has helped their family dropped from 22% to 18%. The bulk of Americans, 51%, continue to say the law has "had no effect." As more provisions of the law have taken effect over the years, the "no effect" percentage has dropped from the first reading of 70%, in early 2012.

More Americans Negative Than Positive About ACA | Gallup

I would say the republicans have more trouble in the White House than they can cope with than even trying to do something with Obamacare. If you oppose it, just let it alone as it is dying. If I were Speaker Ryan, I would announce that the Republicans will be working on a quality healthcare replacement for Obamacare that will probably take a couple of year to complete. That they want to do it right to meet what the vast majority of Americans want and need. That they won't rush it like the Democrats rushed to pass Obamacare and didn't get it right.

I have a feeling Trump will hurt the GOP much more than anything they do or don't do with Obamacare. My prediction for 2018, the Democrats take back the house.
 
Perotista said:
Obamacare is dying a very slow death. Each year we read where another insurance company or two has pulled out of the exchanges. Aetna and United Health Group are pulling out and Humana has pulled way back and it is just a matter of time before Humana too abandons the ACA altogether. This among the other problems the ACA has.

If I was a Republican, I wouldn't try to repeal or replace it. I would just leave it alone to die of its own accord. Today you have this:
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Pero, Obamacare may be dying a slow death but it would be even slower if republicans had expanded Medicaid in every state and didn’t encourage people to not sign up. Medicaid expansion and more people signing up lowers the costs for everybody. And don’t forget that republicans blocked the risk corridor payments. Just like with Medicare D, it was designed to smooth out and limit cost increases as the markets stabilize. But no worries, the small percentage of conservatives who understand this wont hold them accountable.

And you simply cant ignore that republicans said they would not only replace Obamacare, they would replace it with something better. At some point even you will have to realize they were lying and pandering to you. When you finally realize that, please come back and explain why that was okay.
 
Vern said:
Pero, Obamacare may be dying a slow death but it would be even slower if republicans had expanded Medicaid in every state and didn’t encourage people to not sign up. Medicaid expansion and more people signing up lowers the costs for everybody. And don’t forget that republicans blocked the risk corridor payments. Just like with Medicare D, it was designed to smooth out and limit cost increases as the markets stabilize. But no worries, the small percentage of conservatives who understand this wont hold them accountable.

And you simply cant ignore that republicans said they would not only replace Obamacare, they would replace it with something better. At some point even you will have to realize they were lying and pandering to you. When you finally realize that, please come back and explain why that was okay.
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So Vern now you want to expand Medicaid to every state? You really are good at spending someone else's money. Medicaid after the initial expenditure the cost goes to the taxpayers of the individual states

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Conservative said:
So 20 million gained coverage leaving how many uninsured? You believe getting people to sign up for Medicaid required ACA? You are so easily indoctrinated. I don't have to make a point, Google makes it for me, approximately 30 million remain uninsured and because of ACA people had skyrocketing premiums, lost their coverage, lost their doctors, Obama lost the House, and then lost the Congress and now the Congress and the WH. What is it about those results that make you proud of ACA?
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so you did know how many remain uninsured. I suspected you might but for some reason you thought it was an intelligent and honest tactic to pretend not to. thanks to Obamacare 20 million Americans gained coverage and every American enjoys increased quality of care and a lower deficit. Hey just for laughs, instead of continuing rant and flail, tell us what you think will be in the republican replacement plan. If your conservative masters let you that is.
 
Perotista said:
Obamacare is dying a very slow death.
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oh and pero, in addition to republicans attacks on insurers and Obamacare customers, don't forget their indirect affect on insurers. Seems the uncertainty concerning the republicans "replacement" is also scaring off insurers. When fewer insurers participate in a market, prices go up.

Obamacare Uncertainty is Scaring Off Health Insurance Companies - NBC News

I would announce that the Republicans will be working on a quality healthcare replacement for Obamacare that will probably take a couple of year to complete. That they want to do it right to meet what the vast majority of Americans want and need. That they won't rush it like the Democrats rushed to pass Obamacare and didn't get it right.
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And what that statement has to ignore is republicans have had 6 years to come up with a plan and they promised one "right out of the gate". Its kinda the point of the thread. If you were look at the facts honestly you would have to conclude that republicans were never serious about replacing Obamacare. What stops republicans from ever (yea, I said ever) coming up with a better plan is any "better" plan will cost more money. You cant get rid of the "pre-existing condition" exclusion without mandates or single payer. Single payer is more expensive. Its why republicans came up the idea of mandates in the first place. Do you think this proves Ryan has been lying and pandering to you the last 7 years? Its what ryan said about their repeal bill from last year.
Vern said:
"We have now shown that there is a clear path to repealing Obamacare without 60 votes in the Senate. So, next year, if we're sending this bill to a Republican president, it will get signed into law."

Obama vetoes Obamacare repeal bill - CNNPolitics.com

mmmmm, ryan seemed to think all he needed was a republicans president. Now that he has one, whats up? their only plan seems to be to pretend to want to repeal Obamacare.
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