• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Is Trump's victory forever sullied?

Moderate Right said:
The presidency is not a dictatorship. Hell, there are some things he will want to do that even the Republican congress is not going to rubber stamp and vice versa. But, Obama did give Trump advice of not overusing executive orders. I haven't stopped laughing on that one yet.
Click to expand...

You misunderstand the term mandate, I guess. Nobody said anything about being a dictator. Trump will be himself.
 
NIMBY said:
Of course trump cares whether the political world thinks his EC win is a mandate or not.

djt needs a cabinet position just to screen his tweets, for the good of the Nation.

Trump claims he could have also won the popular vote, if he wanted to - POLITICO
Click to expand...

He probably could have won the popular vote if that mattered and if his campaign was aimed at that. It would have been easier than running a campaign aimed at electoral votes. He could simply have spent his time in New York and California.
 
MaggieD said:
What is happening in the US right now is frightening. We should all be very nervous. The Left is attempting a coup...a sudden appropriation of power... a takeover.
Click to expand...

Yep, the neo-Commies/Marxists support democracy and freedom only as far, as it is beneficial for their totalitarian agenda.
Wen they see that freedom and democracy is not good for them, they will be pushing for soviet-style censorship and will engage in violence.
 
MaggieD said:
A mandate means he won..
Click to expand...

No a mandate means the candidate who won has the American people largely behind them. And Trump does not as he did not even win the support of the American people in their votes.
 
haymarket said:
No a mandate means the candidate who won has the American people largely behind them. And Trump does not as he did not even win the support of the American people in their votes.
Click to expand...

man·date
/ˈmanˌdāt/
noun
1.
an official order or commission to do something:
"a mandate to seek the release of political prisoners"
synonyms:
instruction, directive, decree, command, order, ... more
2.
the authority to carry out a policy or course of action, regarded as given by the electorate to a candidate or party that is victorious in an election.

Our republic elected Donald Trump. He was victorious. He has a mandate.
 
MaggieD said:
man·date
/ˈmanˌdāt/
noun
1.
an official order or commission to do something:
"a mandate to seek the release of political prisoners"
synonyms:
instruction, directive, decree, command, order, ... more
2.
the authority to carry out a policy or course of action, regarded as given by the electorate to a candidate or party that is victorious in an election.

Our republic elected Donald Trump. He was victorious. He has a mandate.
Click to expand...

When your opponent gets nearly three million more votes that you do and the legitimacy of your EC election is tainted by the Comey letter and the Russian involvement - he has no mandate.
 
haymarket said:
When your opponent gets nearly three million more votes that you do and the legitimacy of your EC election is tainted by the Comey letter and the Russian involvement - he has no mandate.
Click to expand...

I won't argue with you any further about it.

Suffice to say, mandate or no, he is the POTUS. He has a majority in both houses. And if The Loony Left doesn't change its tune, he'll soon enough have a super majority in both houses.

So. If it's not a mandate? It's close enough.
 
NIMBY said:
trump should not have to point out anything about the PV and then completely inflate how big an EC victory he has.

This man is going to be the President and has already butted in on domestic and foreign affairs.

This penchant of his to have the last word should worry ALL Americans.

Remember trump four years ago trashing the EC ?
Click to expand...

And the alternative was a lying, dishonest crook who rigs elections?
 
NIMBY said:
Have you ever seen a comparison between the number of XOs for Obama compared to previous Presidents since Reagan?

trump understands a few things--like power and money.

trump knows he can't piss off McConnell, the real power in DC right now .
Click to expand...

So, you are agreeing that the presidency is not a dictatorship and that even McConnell will not rubber stamp everything Trump wants, just the way it is supposed to work.
 
NIMBY said:
Are you okay with the fact that the hacking and leaking was a 100% one-way job?

Or that trump encouraged it BEFORE the election?

trump is a 21st century version of Nixon--dirty tricks and all.

At least there are a few good GOP Senators who want this thing investigated .
Click to expand...

How could it have been a 100% one way job if the hackers tried to hack the RNC as well?

Trump did not encourage it at all. That's a twist of the truth. That one time that Trump said something like that is when he was responding to knowledge that the DNC was already hacked and he suggested that maybe, if the Russians did it, that they could find the 30,000 emails that Hillary purposely deleted to thwart an FBI investigation on her, and that they could find the emails out of the stuff that was already hacked. He did not encourage them to hack because the hack had already occurred. Doesn't it trouble you at all that Hillary was ordered by the courts to turn over her emails and yet purposely deleted them before handing them over and that some of her aids pleaded the fifth while others got immunity deals?

Trump can't come anywhere near close to all the dirty tricks that Hillary plays. Did you forget that she and the DNC rigged the primaries against Bernie?

Hacking happens all the time from not only other countries but we do it as well to others. I'm all for investigating hacking and putting a stop to it but agencies have an obligation that in this hacking environment to make sure their stuff doesn't get hacked. IF Russia actually did the hacking they did not do it to influence the election to elect Trump. Otherwise, they would not have even tried hacking the RNC at all and hacked the DNC only. Is it Trump's fault that the hackers couldn't get into the RNC but could get into the DNC? After the email fiasco where Hillary admitted that she should not have done that, and how easily the DNC was hacked into, is this the person we wanted to entrust to keep the nation's secrets, secret?
 
MaggieD said:
I won't argue with you any further about it.

Suffice to say, mandate or no, he is the POTUS. He has a majority in both houses. And if The Loony Left doesn't change its tune, he'll soon enough have a super majority in both houses.

So. If it's not a mandate? It's close enough.
Click to expand...

Merry Christmas Maggie.
 
CriticalThought said:
What is clear is Trump does not have anything close to a mandate.
Click to expand...


I agree he has no mandate. However he was elected as a change agent and as someone who needs to focus on the forgotten man/woman (middle-class). If he changes how Washington works and is more answerable to the forgotten man/woman then his legacy will continue for a generation. I wish he would start with Congressional term limits but that doesn't appear the case. If his agenda is more ego driven and flying by the seat of his custom-made pants then he'll be gone in 4 years and the GOP might be finished.
 
"Is Trump's victory forever sullied?"

Only for liberals.
 
CriticalThought said:
Trump won, and his victory, in my opinion, is legitimate, but it appears to me to be a heavily stained victory.

1. Russia, according to both the FBI and CIA, hacked the DNC and RNC and released DNC documents through WikiLeaks in an obvious attempt to undermine the election. Trump, as a joke, even encouraged the Russians during one of his rallies. This has raised numerous questions. Were the Russians aiding Trump? Were they colluding with his campaign? Do they now have RNC documents to hold over Trump's head? Trump's adamant denial that Russia was even involved and his selection of a very pro Russian nominee for Secretary of State is not helping to belay concerns.

2. The Director of the FBI released information 11 days before the election that it was looking at new e-mails that may be connected to the ones that had been on Clinton's server. There was an immediate drop in the polls for Clinton. No new evidence was found but the damage was done, and the impression was an acting director of the FBI had interfered in the political process.

3. Fake News sites, albeit seen by only a small audience, were being shared across social media suggesting that Clinton was involved in everything from murder to child exploitation.

4. Trump lost the popular vote by 2.7 million votes. Some of his supporters simultaneously argue his victory was legitimate and the election was rigged by claiming, with no evidence that "3 million illegals" voted in the election, a number that changed in accordance with by how much Trump was losing in the popular vote as it was reported. Trump claims an "electoral landslide" even though he ranks 46th in 58 elections on electoral vote. After months of decrying the election process as rigged and the electoral college as faulty, Trump is forced to defend it.

What is clear is Trump does not have anything close to a mandate. He may have won, but he and his supporters will never know whether it was his message or the political interference that clinched the victory for him. While it may be irrelevant to many Trump supporters, it is important to remember that many of the factors that led to their anger could now begin to fuel the anger of the majority of voters who had not voted for Trump. If Trump does not build bridges then his legacy shall be dismantled in 4 to 8 years as surely as he will begin to dismantle Obama's legacy.
Click to expand...

Trump dismantling Obama's legacy ? Lol...No, Obama's already damaged it beyong repair.

His legacy will be defined by the failure of his signature legislation, his feckless and reckless foreign policy decisions and his decision to ignore the plight of the Middle Class and millions of struggling working class Americans.

Obama's only real success was to thoroughly destroy the Democratic brand. He knocked that one out if the park.

What people will remember is under Obama the Democrats lost over 900 legislator seats, 14 Senate seats and 69 House seats and eventully the Presidency.

Obama clearly said his policies were on the ballot, and Americans responded.

Does he have a mandate ? Lol ! He flippped 6 States to beat a Candidate who out spent him by 200 million dollars and a candidate that had the MSM and Hollywood celebrities working to get her elected.

Trump's victory wont be defined by partisan opposition, or butthurt Hillary supporters. Nope.

He ran on a campaign of America first and that resonated with people who just spent the last 8 years living under a President who thought America owed the World a apology
 
CriticalThought said:
Trump won, and his victory, in my opinion, is legitimate, but it appears to me to be a heavily stained victory.

1. Russia, according to both the FBI and CIA, hacked the DNC and RNC and released DNC documents through WikiLeaks in an obvious attempt to undermine the election. Trump, as a joke, even encouraged the Russians during one of his rallies. This has raised numerous questions. Were the Russians aiding Trump? Were they colluding with his campaign? Do they now have RNC documents to hold over Trump's head? Trump's adamant denial that Russia was even involved and his selection of a very pro Russian nominee for Secretary of State is not helping to belay concerns.

2. The Director of the FBI released information 11 days before the election that it was looking at new e-mails that may be connected to the ones that had been on Clinton's server. There was an immediate drop in the polls for Clinton. No new evidence was found but the damage was done, and the impression was an acting director of the FBI had interfered in the political process.

3. Fake News sites, albeit seen by only a small audience, were being shared across social media suggesting that Clinton was involved in everything from murder to child exploitation.

4. Trump lost the popular vote by 2.7 million votes. Some of his supporters simultaneously argue his victory was legitimate and the election was rigged by claiming, with no evidence that "3 million illegals" voted in the election, a number that changed in accordance with by how much Trump was losing in the popular vote as it was reported. Trump claims an "electoral landslide" even though he ranks 46th in 58 elections on electoral vote. After months of decrying the election process as rigged and the electoral college as faulty, Trump is forced to defend it.

What is clear is Trump does not have anything close to a mandate. He may have won, but he and his supporters will never know whether it was his message or the political interference that clinched the victory for him. While it may be irrelevant to many Trump supporters, it is important to remember that many of the factors that led to their anger could now begin to fuel the anger of the majority of voters who had not voted for Trump. If Trump does not build bridges then his legacy shall be dismantled in 4 to 8 years as surely as he will begin to dismantle Obama's legacy.
Click to expand...

Trump dismantling Obama's legacy ? Lol...No, Obama's already damaged it beyong repair.

His legacy will be defined by the failure of his signature legislation, his feckless and reckless foreign policy decisions and his decision to ignore the plight of the Middle Class and millions of struggling working class Americans.

Obama's only real success was to thoroughly destroy the Democratic brand. He knocked that one out if the park.

What people will remember is under Obama the Democrats lost over 900 legislator seats, 14 Senate seats and 69 House seats and eventully the Presidency.

Obama clearly said his policies were on the ballot, and Americans responded.

Does he have a mandate ? Lol ! He flippped 6 States to beat a Candidate who out spent him by 200 million dollars and a candidate that had the MSM and Hollywood celebrities working to get her elected.

Trump's victory wont be defined by partisan opposition, or butthurt Hillary supporters. Nope.

He ran on a campaign of America first and that resonated with people who just spent the last 8 years living under a President who thought America owed the World a apologyo
 
Trump's victory and it's problems won't be blamed on Trump. They'll be rightly blamed on Americans for not being smart enough to see that Russia was trying to get Trump elected (which we knew), fake news was all over the place (which we knew) and Trump ran - by far - the most negative campaign in the history of American politics. He trolled every other candidate and turned his campaign into a circus where his platform was 3 issues (Hillary in jail, Mexico pays for a wall, immigrants will all get kicked out of the country) that were all lies (which we knew).

What is amazing is that beyond the usual I'll-vote-for-any-Republican-or-Democrat regardless of who they are, Trump attracted people who believed every lie that came from his mouth. They were angry about nothing, obsessed with the idea that white people are victims and conservatives are victims, and were driven by hatred to the point that they honestly believe that Democrats are running a worldwide pedophile ring and are secretly Satanists.

This is the point in history where we choose to be an idiocracy or take a step back and unite as Americans. I wish for the latter.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom