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The Paul Ryan Agenda

Helix said:
i'm arguing that we should expand medicare into a single payer health insurance system, as is the status quo in much of the first world. i'm not sure how that could be considered to be right wing.
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I am on the left and claiming we need privatize costs, not socialize costs. It doesn't matter what type of payer system it is, under any form of Capitalism.
 
danielpalos said:
I am on the left and claiming we need privatize costs, not socialize costs. It doesn't matter what type of payer system it is, under any form of Capitalism.
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it certainly matters to the people needing health care who are without the means to pay for it
you know, what we had before Obamacare, and still have to a lesser extent
 
danielpalos said:
I am on the left and claiming we need privatize costs, not socialize costs. It doesn't matter what type of payer system it is, under any form of Capitalism.
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i don't agree for the reasons that i outlined in post 21.
 
Think of how much the economy would explode if the corporate tax rate were at 0% instead of the highest in the world at 35% (then add 5 to 10% for state corporate taxes). All those jobs that went overseas would suddenly flood back home.
 
Brewdog said:
Think of how much the economy would explode if the corporate tax rate were at 0% instead of the highest in the world at 35% (then add 5 to 10% for state corporate taxes). All those jobs that went overseas would suddenly flood back home.
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The right claims that; but, we cannot fight wars on any given abstraction, and still win those alleged wars. Only the fantastical right wing, believes we can win a war on the abstraction of terror, or a real war in the Middle East, while lowering taxes.

Why not simply end the drug war.
 
danielpalos said:
The right claims that; but, we cannot fight wars on any given abstraction, and still win those alleged wars. Only the fantastical right wing, believes we can win a war on the abstraction of terror, or a real war in the Middle East, while lowering taxes.

Why not simply end the drug war.
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Start voting libertarian and end the foreign wars, the war on drugs, stop foreign aid and think of all the extra money we'll have. And with all those new factory jobs, we'll have revenue and spending from people that are otherwise collecting a government paycheck for being unemployed.
 
Brewdog said:
Start voting libertarian and end the foreign wars, the war on drugs, stop foreign aid and think of all the extra money we'll have. And with all those new factory jobs, we'll have revenue and spending from people that are otherwise collecting a government paycheck for being unemployed.
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Did you know, that Capitalism, has acquired and possessed, its very Own and Natural, rate of unemployment? Capitalism's natural rate of unemployment ensures the right can merely blame the least wealthy for making poor lifestyle choices, while actually poor.

Why is there no Jobs Boom ethic required of the one percent by the right, like there is a work ethic from the Age of Iron, from that very same and fantastical, right wing. The capital gains preference is supposed to help with full employment.
 
danielpalos said:
Did you know, that Capitalism, has acquired and possessed, its very Own and Natural, rate of unemployment? Capitalism's natural rate of unemployment ensures the right can merely blame the least wealthy for making poor lifestyle choices, while actually poor.
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I didn't blame the poor. I blamed excessively high corporate taxes, the war on drugs, foreign giveaways, and promoted the creation of good-paying jobs for people that don't have work. Why can't everyone agree that these are all good things for our country to fix?
 
Brewdog said:
Think of how much the economy would explode if the corporate tax rate were at 0% instead of the highest in the world at 35% (then add 5 to 10% for state corporate taxes). All those jobs that went overseas would suddenly flood back home.
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graph corporate taxes as share of tax revenues.png
look at the data
these corporations pay little in taxes despite the rate, thanks to an array of deductions
where in this world would you rather have a business, other than in the USA?
 
Brewdog said:
I didn't blame the poor. I blamed excessively high corporate taxes, the war on drugs, foreign giveaways, and promoted the creation of good-paying jobs for people that don't have work. Why can't everyone agree that these are all good things for our country to fix?
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see the portion of your post i emphasized
then tell us exactly what you would do to create good-paying jobs for people who are now unemployed
 
Brewdog said:
I didn't blame the poor. I blamed excessively high corporate taxes, the war on drugs, foreign giveaways, and promoted the creation of good-paying jobs for people that don't have work. Why can't everyone agree that these are all good things for our country to fix?
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Yet, every time the issue of natural rights comes up, the right wing is nowhere to be found in even a second wave, whenever it is not specifically about guns. Where can, an expressly declared, War on Drugs, be found in the Republican Doctrine?

to some on the left, the fantastical right wing is merely cognitively dissonant by being infidel, protestant, and renegade, to their own, Republican Doctrine.
 
Brewdog said:
Think of how much the economy would explode if the corporate tax rate were at 0% instead of the highest in the world at 35% (then add 5 to 10% for state corporate taxes). All those jobs that went overseas would suddenly flood back home.
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The rate looks high but the devil is in the details - what that tax rate actually applies to. Rest assured that 80K pages of tax law were not put there to tax the hell out of businesses (or investors) that fund congress critters' campaigns. ;)
 
justabubba said:
View attachment 67209642
look at the data
these corporations pay little in taxes despite the rate, thanks to an array of deductions
where in this world would you rather have a business, other than in the USA?
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So what you've just shown us with your chart is that corporate taxation (which is paid for by consumers and not corporations) is only a little over 1% of revenues. So if we were to cut corporate taxes to zero, all the corporations that went to Mexico and Thailand and China would come back, thereby creating a boom in productivity and jobs for people who would now be paying taxes instead of living on the government teet. How is this a losing situation for anyone?
 
Brewdog said:
So what you've just shown us with your chart is that corporate taxation (which is paid for by consumers and not corporations) is only a little over 1% of revenues. So if we were to cut corporate taxes to zero, all the corporations that went to Mexico and Thailand and China would come back, thereby creating a boom in productivity and jobs for people who would now be paying taxes instead of living on the government teet. How is this a losing situation for anyone?
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Simply cutting taxes to zero does not solve for Capitalism's, natural rate of poverty inducing, unemployment.

Why not have the corporate tax be a general tax that funds unemployment compensation on an at-will basis?
 
danielpalos said:
Why not have the corporate tax be a general tax that funds unemployment compensation on an at-will basis?
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Because I want to bring jobs back to the US an create an economic boom. Not redirect tax money to social programs and welfare for people to goof off all day.

I'm providing something as a solution to unemployment. You just want to shuffle more money that we don't have into social programs.
 
Brewdog said:
Because I want to bring jobs back to the US an create an economic boom. Not redirect tax money to social programs and welfare for people to goof off all day.

I'm providing something as a solution to unemployment. You just want to shuffle more money that we don't have into social programs.
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If you merely want to bring jobs back; why not excise the wage difference, like Cuba does for their own natives? US Firms would have no reason to leave for cheaper labor, which we cannot compete with, instead of better products at lower cost; like Henry Ford.
 
danielpalos said:
If you merely want to bring jobs back; why not excise the wage difference, like Cuba does for their own natives? US Firms would have no reason to leave for cheaper labor, which we cannot compete with, instead of better products at lower cost; like Henry Ford.
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Are you going to use Cuba as your model for economic success?
 
Brewdog said:
Are you going to use Cuba as your model for economic success?
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You claimed you wanted jobs back. We cannot compete with cheap labor. US Firms would have no reason to leave for cheaper labor, which we cannot compete with, instead of better products at lower cost; like Henry Ford.
 
danielpalos said:
What market would be worse off; if Persons are not in poverty? Normal market conditions should apply, whenever possible.
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you're still not addressing what i posted. let's try again.

Helix said:
because an essential service with inelastic demand in which geographical immediacy is a critical factor is not best delivered by pure market solutions, especially when we're talking about a segment of the population which is basically guaranteed to get sick. if we want to change medicare, the proper change is to expand it to cover all basic care, and then use the bargaining power of that payer to force prices down, as the rest of the first world has already done, for the most part.
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Helix said:
you're still not addressing what i posted. let's try again.
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My good comrade, why encourage such socialism from our politicians? What you are basically saying, is that government should dictate price control in addition to gun control, instead of minimum wages or minimum standards.
 
danielpalos said:
My good comrade, why encourage such socialism from our politicians? What you are basically saying, is that government should dictate price control in addition to gun control, instead of minimum wages or minimum standards.
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does this clear it up for you?

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Helix said:
does this clear it up for you?

View attachment 67209652
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What I am suggesting, is to merely use existing infrastructure to solve for a simple poverty of money, in our Institution of money based markets and form of Capitalism.

What if poverty is no longer excuse for lousy capital management.

How does a single payer system, help with that?
 
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